how to tell a friend he is careless with guns

[Tokugawa]

I have an old and valued friend, into collecting guns but but not really a shooter. Everytime he shows me a fire arm or vice versa, he covers me with the muzzle, has his finger on the trigger as soon as he picks it up, assumes it to be unloaded, etc. He is a good friend, and over the years I have told him gently to not point it at me. Examples- I am driving to a show, he pulls out a revolver and is fondling it in the passengers seat with finger on trigger and muzzle at my body. I show him a rifle and he examines it and swings the muzzle past me three or four times, has his finger on the trigger constantly. I knew the weapon was unloaded, I checked very deliberately in front of him, but it makes me nervous as hell.
Basicly, he breaks all the four rules and relies on the gun being unloaded. I will not go shooting with him, once he had a jam on the bench next to me and was fidddling with the loaded weapon with the muzzle pointed at me along the line of benches. Yes I jumped out of the way!
Is there some polite way I can get him to wise up? I have no desire to lose a friend, he and his wife have helped me thru some rough times. But I fear for his safety and that of people around him. I have thought of buying him a membership in our local club, which has a pretty intensive safety orientation.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

Semi-subtle things like "WHOAAA buddy, careful where you point that thing, I need my head!" don't work?
Have a discussion of cooper's 4 rules with him. I don't mean lecture him on them, I mean ask him what his thoughts are on each one. Maybe he doesn't know them.. Inform him

 

[bensdad]

Friends don't let friends cover them with guns.

 

[Jacka L Ope]

Is there some polite way I can get him to wise up?

What Double said. If that doesn't work, time to be more assertive if not downright aggressive about your own safety (possible life or death situation, is it not?).

 

[Gun Geezer]

Search the net...

for a few choice pictures of folks with their heads blown mostly off by someones "accidental discharge". Share that with him and make dang sure he gets the point.

I he won't shape up, then don't be around him and guns at the same time. I will NEVER hunt with my own Dad again for the reason that I am just plain tired of having his .270 pointed at me.

 

[Cosmoline]

I've had trouble with this from time to time. I suggest actually making up a little card, maybe Hallmark style, that has Cooper's rules printed in it. It's enough of a joke to keep him from getting insulted, but it should get the point across.

 

[Taurus 66]

I wouldn't need advice

Tell you something ... if he swept me me with the muzzle, "100% guaranteed" I wouldn't be here asking what to say to the guy. Try the yell at him approach if all else fails.

 

[Neo-Luddite]

"Hey John Wayne watch that $%&*@ muzzle will ya?"

Call him on it every time. Remind him that if the 'sweet little baby Jesus told you that the gun was empty you would still check the chamber'. This last one is one of my more flamboyant but effective gun safety sentiments and it works on Christians and non-Christians alike.

Buy him a bunch of loaded chamber indicators.

Or, hate to say it, stay far away.

 

[ChefJeff1]

I like the Hallmark idea, that you can still be friends. Also, try referring him to this site.

 

[Soybomb]

Don't be subtle or coy about it.

"The way you handle guns scares the hell out of me. You're always pointing guns at me, you always have your finger on the trigger, you've had a loaded weapon aimed at me before. You're my friend and I don't want to see you do anything bad to yourself or someone else on accident. You need to start taking this seriously or I can't be around you when you're handling guns. I'm not trying to play mommy here but I'm worried about your safety and the safety of those around you."

Its kind of similar to my driving drunk talk.

 

[Caimlas]

If he's breaking all 4 rules wantonly, and has a general disregard for your gentle "hey, don't point that at me" warnings, I'd say tell him flat out, in no questionable terms, to stop doing it. This isn't like, "my friend has a drinking problem" - this is like "my friend is driving drunk and I'm a sober passenger" problem. It's life-and-death, and one little slip up could bring you to the morgue post-haste.

Would you speak softly to someone waving a chainsaw around while it was engaged?

This is no time to mince words. What you're currently doing obviously isn't making its way into his thick head; you really need to up the ante and speak to him sternly, like a child.

 

[default]

Tough issue. However, if he really is an old and valued friend, the friendship ought to weather the approach Soybomb recommends. Your friend sounds like a good guy, apart from his gun safety issues, and even if he responds negatively at first, he might well call you in a couple of days and say "You know, I was mad at first, but I've been thinking about what you were saying...".

As long as you are respectful and reasonable in your tone, and willing to put up with a little initial shock and anger (no one likes to be corrected, no matter how gentle the correction, no matter how obviously wrong they are), I expect you can resolve this positively.

 

[benelli12]

for a few choice pictures of folks with their heads blown mostly off by someones "accidental discharge". Share that with him and make dang sure he gets the point.

I he won't shape up, then don't be around him and guns at the same time. I will NEVER hunt with my own Dad again for the reason that I am just plain tired of having his .270 pointed at me.

If all else fails I would have to agree with the above. Sometimes they will learn their lesson after they accidently kill somebody because of their lack of safety and respect for the weapon, but by then it's to late. Showing the consequences of what careless actions can cause is sometimes the only way to get them to learn, although not pleasent, it sometimes is the only way.

When I first started out with shooting, it didn't take me long to develope a HUGE respect for guns after I saw a few dear on the recieving end of my cousins .270 and my friends' dads' 30-06. These kills were all at very close range, <75 yards, with blood, and BIG exit wounds.

Since I was very young and had not seen any type of death before these pictures and stories hit me hard. When an object that is around the size and weight of a marble can go clear through a large animal and leave a 7-8" exit hole, and burry itself deep into the earth, it diserves Alot of responsibility and Respect. This is one of the reasons I was fascinated by guns at a young age.

--Sometimes you have to shock somebody to get them to listen, and I hope your friend developes good safety habits, and respect for the weapons he has.

 

[tubeshooter]

My good friends would say something like "Man, don't point that [blank]ing thing at me like that!".


I would, too. I might be a bit more low-key about it to an acquaintance, but I still would be firm and crystal clear.

 

[Lucky]

how to tell a friend he is careless with guns

With swears? The moment you start thinking about other guy's feelings you're no longer technically guys.

If you want to be 'polite' then assign a cost system. If he covers you with the muzzle then say, "You covered me with the muzzle, now you have to buy lunch."

And then call him a swear.

For inspiration watch the opening scene of 'Way of the Gun'.

 

[JWarren]

Gotta +1 for Lucky.

With swears? The moment you start thinking about other guy's feelings you're no longer technically guys.

Some of the things my best friends have said to me, and have heard from me would make a Tiajana prostitute blush. And I still love those guys.


John

 

[Orthonym]

Reminds me of my favorite Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers strip.

Fat Freddy was sent out to pay the landlord, but came back with a shotgun and no rent receipt. He played "soldier" around the apt., eventually covering Freewheelin Franklin, who said, "Hey, mother****er, don't point that thing at me!"

Freddy said, "Aw, it ain't loaded," then immediately dropped it and had it go off, blowing hole in ceiling with shot rat falling down from hole immediately.

Well, it seemed that Freddy had promised to eat everything he killed.

The last panel showed The Fat One with rat on plate, sweating copiously and asking for more ketchup, with Franklin standing behind him with shotgun and bad attitude.

 

[10-Ring]

I would be honest & tell him flat out to visually check the gun in front of you before so carelessly handling a firearm.

 

[Hoppy590]

one kid i struck with the butt of the gun when he swept me.
others i just yell at

if hes willing to end a friendship because you put value on your physical well being. hes not much of a friend is he?

most new owners will take the advise of a more experienced gunny very seriously. they will take it as a learning experiance and nothing personal.

the stubborn old timers are the ones that get personaly offended that some one tells them they are wrong.

 

[MudCamper]

If he's a true friend, you can be blunt and honest with him, and he won't take it wrong. If he's not a friend, you should still be blunt and honest. This is about life and death. It shouldn't be pussyfooted around.

 

[mindwip]

I never yell at my friends, but when i was teaching one of them to shoot, he kept putting his finger on the trigger. So each time i caught him i yelled louder and longer, (finger off trigger!!). It got to the point were he remembered to keep his finger off the trigger because he did not want to be yelled at. He knew i was yelling at him over a serous safty issue, so he did not hold it against me. Just got pissed. Lesson learned, a pissed off friend for one day is better then one sleeping 6 ft under.


Be direct

 

[Laurel]

Tell him if he doesn't start following the 4 rules, you'll stop interacting with him in any situation where firearms are present. Period.

If he screws up again, follow through.

It's not worth it to get shot over injuring his feelings or creating awkwardness in your friendship, is it?

 

[joab]

I had a very old and dear friend like that

I usually said nothing or made one of those jokes that others have suggested.
I never could bring myself to lecture or chastise him because he was older than me (maybe it's a southern thing)

We were at an indoor range with my 13 year old son one day
I looked over and he was trying to unjam his loaded pistol with a pocket knife with his finger on the trigger and the muzzle pointed directly at my sons chest.

I told him if he didn't get that gun up and down range and out of my sons face I was going to shove it up his @$$
I didn't realize it until after that I had my gun at low ready throughout the exchange (southerner be damned it's a father thing)

Point is
Say something now or someday you might have to do something stupid like draw on your buddy, cuss him out shortly before he dies and get banned from a pretty good range.

 

[skinnyguy]

I've had that happen with a couple of non-gunners I've known over the years. Like you, I had made sure MYSELF that there were no rounds available, let alone inside the gun. I've watched them, and when the barrel covers me, I gently say STOP. They will usually stop moving, look up at me, and say "what", I say "more people are killed with an "unloaded" gun than by any other. Now, look where that thing is pointing."

They will usually say the same expletive, and quickly change the direction of the muzzle.

In only one case, this gentle reminder was not a permanent fix. He was looking at my .22, comparing it to his, and pointed it right at me. At that time, I asked for the rifle, he of course handed it to me, and I immediately took aim at his head, without my finger on the trigger, when his eyes got roughly the size of Nebraska, I asked him how it feels, and would you please stop trying to shoot me, I really don't like it.

I then went over the basic 4 rules, and he had violated ALL of them within .2 seconds, and if he kept doing that, somebody, perhaps his wife or child was going to get shot. Found out sometime later that he sold his rifle, and I found out from a mutual friend, because he never spoke to me again. So be it, I may well have saved a life or two.

 

[Model 624]

Soybomb is 110% right. I'd start it off with "Johnny, your a great friend and good guy, but I've got to tell you something that really bugs the hell out of me"

Better to make him mad that to pull a bullet out of ........