Howdah Pistol Basics

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Are there precedents of Muzzle Loading 12 Gauge, SXS 'Pistols'?


I'm wondering if that would be a mite rough on the wrist...


Really, I've been thinking of getting some sort of re-pop Muzzle Loader in 12 Gauge, and, making a Howdah out of it...then I think "Ooooo I dunno...with a full-house Charge, that might be a bit much!"
 
There was some talk on the Accurate Reloading forum a couple years ago about chopping a 12ga double muzzle loader down to Howdah form. I think atleast one guy finished and fired a conversion. You can always start low and work up to a comfortable load.

The grip on my 70 cal looks abit odd, until you pick it up and fire it. Then it's perfect. My 10yo son likes shooting 20gn's of FF.

70cal-02.jpg
 
Hi lar45,



Kind of a SAA 'Bisley' sort of Grip angle there...looks like it would be very stable and comfortable.

How about a few more views of that Pistol?


It sure looks interesting.

European? - French maybe?


Yes...good point...if one did have a 12 Gauge 'Howdah'...working up from a mild loading, and seeing how things feel would be best!


That's always best anyhoooo, of course.
 
Did you see the pics one page back?
The proof marks looked Belgian. I don't remember what the rifleing twist rate is, but it was fairly fast, implying that it was meant for conical slugs instead of round balls. The groove depth is .700". I have shot the Lee 12 ga 1oz slug quite abit and at 10-15 yds the barrels make nice groups fairly close to each other, but are about 10" above the sights. The rear sight also serves as a saftey and extractor. The front sight is a brass bead. I'd like to try different weight bullets and powder charges to see if I can get it to shoot to the sights. I'm not really sure what powder charge would be safe to shoot in it. The 1.6" brass case has a water capacity of 140 gns, so there would be enough room for atleast 100gns of FFg. It would be nice to see what this wold be capable of, but I'd hate to ruin it.
The Lyman 12 ga 1oz slug measures .702" and looks like it should shoot well also. I have a pile of them cast, I just need to make the time to go to the range and try them.
I also have some on my webpage. http://www.lsstuff.com/howdah/howda.html
I need to update it with some loading info and pics.

70cal-01.jpg

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Instead of shot, could you use a Forster-style rifled slug in the 20ga pistols? Would a 30gr Pyrodex or Triple Seven pellet be safe in a .50 with a sabotted .452" bullet?
 
Instead of shot, could you use a Forster-style rifled slug in the 20ga pistols? Would a 30gr Pyrodex or Triple Seven pellet be safe in a .50 with a sabotted .452" bullet?
Click to expand...

Yes & yes. Experimenting with different loads and projectiles within the limitations of the safety parameters of the individual gun is what muzzle loading is all about.
 
Every shot's a custom load.

Now I'm thinking of getting a 20 gauge slug mold now..I got used to shooting those big Minie balls in my rifles. The bore is .638" across which is really 18 gauge, but I've been using 5/16" paper wads made of cardstock to keep the powder under the overpowder wad and the shot from slipping under the under shot wad. 40-45 grains of 777 and 80 grains of BB's, #7 birdshot, 12 #1 Buck, or a .60" ball with a patch.

Sunday before last, I had some friends over and I pulled out my Howdah for the first time in a while. I loaded it with .60" balls first. My friend was able to hit the top of a 2 liter Coke bottle with one of the barrels and dinged my gong with the other at 15 to 20 yards. I still haven't zeroed it.

I loaded it with BB's and we peppered an old shed I need to tear down. It knocked the paint off the tin and dented it at 30 feet.
I loaded up my '42 Springfield .69 smoothbore with 80 grains of BB's and 30 grains of 777 and shot the shed at 30-40 yards. The BB's went through the tin and some of them made their way through a gap in the clapboard to hit the other side of that room and embedded themselves into the boards on the other side. If someone was standing in that room, they would have been full of BB's.

Now I wonder about loading the Howdah with Buck and Ball. I'll back it down to 30 grains and give it a try.
 
With full loads I suppose it would be a bit feisty. With reduced loads it shouldn't be bad. Aguila 12 gauge minishells kick about like a .410 or 20 gauge. It stands to reason that a reduced load in a muzzle loading 12 gauge Howdah wouldn't be too bad.
 
My sister hold's hers with both hands. One of her wrists dosen't appear to be more bigger around than the middle joint of one of my thumbs but she dosen't have any trouble to speak of I reckon. Like I said, she uses #2 shot but she must keep a pretty good powder load in it (She uses Triple Seven 3fff) because she killed a deer with it that was in her garden. (Of course it was just one of those little Alabama White Tails. Not much bigger than one of these little antelope around here)....
 
I'll be honest, I bought my Pedersoli Howdah, because it reminded me of Mel Gibson's sawed off double from the Mad Max movies. That, and the fact that class 3 was not necessary for the front stuffer.
Plus, you have to admit, that makes one pretty darned effective home defense gun. God forbid any of us ever have to use one,
If you hold it 2 handed, either with the conventional grip, or with 1 hand on the grip and the other wrapped around the barrels, it shouldn't be a problem.
 
That's why my sister settled on one of them. Home defense. Short, easy to handle and swing around. Somebody (he was caught a few weeks later breaking into someone else's home while they were at church one Sunday afternoon and he admitted to a county deputy that he was the one messing around and trying to break and enter her home while she was at home. damned ol' crack head) tried to come in her back door one night and all she had right to hand was a .38 Special and she got to thinking it might be too easy to miss with it. She's there with her two grandchildren and she's a fine Christian girl with a good heart but she will most definitely shoot somebody's ass off for them. Those two grandchildren are her life....
 
I thought about making a lace-on leather barrel cover, just for shooting with the off hand wrapped around the barrel. Also thought of replacing the grip cap screw with a sling swivel for a single point sling.

As effective as a good .38 hp is, it's hard to argue against 2 barrels of 20 ga buck or buck/ball.
 
Howdah 20 X 20 and shooting clay pigeons

Has anyone tried to shoot clay pigeons with a Pedersoli Howdah 20 X 20???

I'd like to get a Howdah, but I've been told the muzzle velocity is too slow to shoot clay pigeons.

Perhaps there is a way to consistently throw pigeons slow enough and close-in enough to make shooting clay pigeons less of a frustration.

I welcome your ideas.

Thanks.
 
How about straight AT you? That way velocity would only have to be enough to break the target before it hits YOU. Could be interesting, no?
 
Peter R said:
I'd like to get a Howdah, but I've been told the muzzle velocity is too slow to shoot clay pigeons.
Click to expand...

It's mostly a matter of being willing to load enough powder and shot to obtain enough velocity and a decent pattern.
It should be able to reach to 25 yards and maybe even to 30 yards.
But one can't be shy about loading it up. After all it's based on their shotgun action and is constucted to be plenty strong.
And throwing the clay by hand in a slow upward manner should be helpful to getting a bead on it.
There are also mini-clays that might be fun to try to break if they're thrown upward by hand at a moderately closer distance. :)
 
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The biggest problems to overcome would probably be sighting errors due to the short sighting plane of the barrel, the difficulty holding the gun steady and on target while pulling the trigger, and getting the shot pattern to hold together beyond 15 - 20 yards.
But with heavy shot loads and the use of plastic wads or paper shot cups, some shots at clay birds should be makable at the fringe of 25-30 yards.
 
It's been mentioned that slug's can be used in the smooth bore Howdah, but can you load the .50 cal. rifled version with shot or will the rifling make for an inconsistent shot pattern?

G D
 
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