Outlaws
Member
I think a 20mm Vulcan would work alright.
Hunting Gray Whales, Tribal Style
- Thread starter 30 cal slob
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SDC
Member
I seem to remember seeing a picture of this the LAST time the Makah did this, and the picture they showed then had a fellow holding what looked like a McMillan 87R in the canoe.
Edit: found the pic I was thinking of on the "Shepherd Society's" web page (an offshoot of Greenpeace); it was actually a LAR Grizzly 50; http://www.seashepherd.org/whales/whales_world_Makah_articles.html
Edit: found the pic I was thinking of on the "Shepherd Society's" web page (an offshoot of Greenpeace); it was actually a LAR Grizzly 50; http://www.seashepherd.org/whales/whales_world_Makah_articles.html
Novus Collectus
Member
thorn726
Member
first off HOW LAME that these folks have to worry about the legality of taking the whale...
endangered or not, this isn't some huge company, this is supposedly a tribal event where the whale would probably feed a whole village, the kind of killing even an environmentalist nut like me can get behind, but
Should they be using guns?
isn't the whole complaint that we took away their tribal ways with our technology?
anyway machine gun, yeah right? how many rounds per sec does a .50 cal throw out??
wouldn't the whale be in shreds????
hehehe===
This action opens the bolt, and pulls the belt of ammunition through the weapon, readying it to fire again, all at a cyclic rate of 450–550 rounds per minute (600–1,200 M2/M3 in WW2 aircraft, 300 synchronized M2). This is a rate of fire not generally achieved in use, as sustained fire at that rate will "shoot out" the barrel within a few thousand rounds, necessitating replacement. The M2 machine gun's sustained rate of fire is considered to be anything less than 40 rounds per minute.
endangered or not, this isn't some huge company, this is supposedly a tribal event where the whale would probably feed a whole village, the kind of killing even an environmentalist nut like me can get behind, but
Should they be using guns?
isn't the whole complaint that we took away their tribal ways with our technology?
anyway machine gun, yeah right? how many rounds per sec does a .50 cal throw out??
wouldn't the whale be in shreds????
hehehe===
This action opens the bolt, and pulls the belt of ammunition through the weapon, readying it to fire again, all at a cyclic rate of 450–550 rounds per minute (600–1,200 M2/M3 in WW2 aircraft, 300 synchronized M2). This is a rate of fire not generally achieved in use, as sustained fire at that rate will "shoot out" the barrel within a few thousand rounds, necessitating replacement. The M2 machine gun's sustained rate of fire is considered to be anything less than 40 rounds per minute.
thorn726
Member
oh ok, i hadn't seen this
very cool
very cool
alucard0822
Member
and not one pair of earplugs aboard
call me ishamael
What?
Ishmael
Sure, this is swell
no, call me Ishmael
Call him yourself.
Oh bother.
SDC
Member
I'm sure the AP reporter heard ".50 calibre Browning Machine Gun cartridge", and automatically conflated THAT to ".50 calibre machine gun".
Novus Collectus
Member
It was really a Weatherby rifle and not a .50 machine gun.
The local newspaper (In the greater Seattle area) reported that a Weatherby rifle was used. Now all of a sudden it has turned into a .50 cal. machine gun!?!
With this level of inconsistency, Maybe we better check Steve Fossett's home, he may just be sitting in his lounge chair wondering where everybody went. Sorry to change the subject but this type of C#@P P^%$#S me off.
With this level of inconsistency, Maybe we better check Steve Fossett's home, he may just be sitting in his lounge chair wondering where everybody went. Sorry to change the subject but this type of C#@P P^%$#S me off.
Novus Collectus
Member
The Seattle article that said what kind of rifle it really was, was after the initial reports by other media that it was a .50 BMG machine gun.
ReadyontheRight
Member
Endangered Species? NO
Illegal Weapon? NO
Illegal Season- NO - for these folks.
What, exactly, IS the story? "Family Humanely Hunts Mammal to Feed Children"?
Illegal Weapon? NO
Illegal Season- NO - for these folks.
What, exactly, IS the story? "Family Humanely Hunts Mammal to Feed Children"?
I visited Neah Bay, the home of the Makah shortly after their last hunt ("99 or so IIRC) they were real nice to my family and told us about the hunt. When I asked what whale tasted like one old guy said " well it tastes like chicken".
As for shootin' out of a canoe, 30 feet is a little canoe to the tribes of the NorthWest and I reckon if they can paddle one to and fro' Alaska, shootin' a whale with a .50 was kinda like a Sunday afternoon drive.
As for shootin' out of a canoe, 30 feet is a little canoe to the tribes of the NorthWest and I reckon if they can paddle one to and fro' Alaska, shootin' a whale with a .50 was kinda like a Sunday afternoon drive.
DoubleTapDrew
Member
+1. The last hunt they did said it was killed with a .50 bmg and didn't mention the MG word but this reporter probably heard what BMG stands for and figured it was a machine gun. Reporters have a very high standard of inconsistency and anti-gun bias they have to maintain.
The last time this happened I was irritated that it was shot instead of caught in the traditional way if they want to get back to their whaling roots (I fish with a fishing rod, not a gun), but if it's just used to put the animal out of it's misery then I guess it's the humane thing to do. I wonder how whale tastes?
The Canuck
Member
While I believe that the tribal rights to hunt whale is right I also believe that the traditional methods should be used, however, I understand that the agreement was made in a fashion as to make sure the whale was taken as humanely as possible. I have a personal policy against eating things that might be sentient... Whale are on that list.
acdodd
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It was a .460 according to the guy that shot it.
http://www.nwcn.com/topstories/stories/NW_090907WAB_whale_shot_folo_SW.b94d1ebd.html
http://www.nwcn.com/topstories/stories/NW_090907WAB_whale_shot_folo_SW.b94d1ebd.html
ArfinGreebly
Moderator Emeritus
Hunting Whales, Tribal Style
Overall, this thread has managed to maintain an acceptable signal-to-noise ratio.
A few posts, however, really contribute very little signal.
If you notice that your post is gone or that it's been cleaned up a bit, don't take it personally.
Just sweeping up a bit.
No need to junk the whole thread, as it contains actual signal. Oh, and I changed the thread title to something more accurately descriptive.
Carry on, folks.
Overall, this thread has managed to maintain an acceptable signal-to-noise ratio.
A few posts, however, really contribute very little signal.
If you notice that your post is gone or that it's been cleaned up a bit, don't take it personally.
Just sweeping up a bit.
No need to junk the whole thread, as it contains actual signal. Oh, and I changed the thread title to something more accurately descriptive.
Carry on, folks.
Last edited:
ReadyontheRight
Member
I really mean this as staightforward and non-facetious as possible, so please respond to this question in kind...
If you have decided that you are going to hunt and kill an animal...why in the world would you not use the most effective legal means available?
"Traditional" hunters were also pragmatic. We can single out a few interesting techniques, but pre-firearm humanity used many methods we would consider barbaric and cruel - because they and their children were actually hungry.
If a whale hunter 100-1000 years ago had a .50 BMG and it was actually effective, and his family was hungry, I do not think he would care about popular opinion on the gun.
How is poking a large mammal with a stick and letting it suffer for a day or two better than putting it down quickly with a large bullet?
If you have decided that you are going to hunt and kill an animal...why in the world would you not use the most effective legal means available?
"Traditional" hunters were also pragmatic. We can single out a few interesting techniques, but pre-firearm humanity used many methods we would consider barbaric and cruel - because they and their children were actually hungry.
If a whale hunter 100-1000 years ago had a .50 BMG and it was actually effective, and his family was hungry, I do not think he would care about popular opinion on the gun.
How is poking a large mammal with a stick and letting it suffer for a day or two better than putting it down quickly with a large bullet?
Wes Janson
Member
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- May 12, 2006
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- 1,962
So the 1999 hunt used an LAR Grizzly, and this time they chose a .460 Weatherby?
From this I think we can conclude two things: One, either .460 Weatherby is insufficient for whales, or they can't shoot properly. And two, it seems likely that the change in caliber was due to the prior results of trying to fire a bolt-action .50 out of a canoe in open water with half a dozen other guys crammed together in the boat. Who knows, maybe there were other reasons for the change..but I have to wonder if perhaps they weren't a bit unprepared for the muzzle blast the first time around.
From this I think we can conclude two things: One, either .460 Weatherby is insufficient for whales, or they can't shoot properly. And two, it seems likely that the change in caliber was due to the prior results of trying to fire a bolt-action .50 out of a canoe in open water with half a dozen other guys crammed together in the boat. Who knows, maybe there were other reasons for the change..but I have to wonder if perhaps they weren't a bit unprepared for the muzzle blast the first time around.
BlisteringSilence
Member
I apologize in advance:
Does anyone really think that mounting a .50 machine gun to the gunnel of a canoe is, well, possible. I'll admit, I've not floated every kind of canoe in existance, but I have fired an M2. And with the way it shook the humvee it was mounted on makes me wonder if there is a canoe in existance that could handle it.
yes. I know.
Does anyone really think that mounting a .50 machine gun to the gunnel of a canoe is, well, possible. I'll admit, I've not floated every kind of canoe in existance, but I have fired an M2. And with the way it shook the humvee it was mounted on makes me wonder if there is a canoe in existance that could handle it.
yes. I know.
silverlance
Member
1. hunting big game in most every state requires a large caliber weapon. in AK, for instance, black powder hunting must be done with a bullet not less than 50 caliber. ideally, it woudl be 69 caliber.
2. the inuit eat what they kill. the furs, etc that they get they sell - but the meat is very very necessary food for their survival. these are NOT rich people by any means. when i spent time in the inuit villages i would often see posted notes at city hall from local government saying things like "Hunters, please donate meat to the elder citizen's home as winter is approaching"
there are NO supermarkets, no fast food stores, no ruth chris steak house in those parts. you cant even buy milk.
2. the inuit eat what they kill. the furs, etc that they get they sell - but the meat is very very necessary food for their survival. these are NOT rich people by any means. when i spent time in the inuit villages i would often see posted notes at city hall from local government saying things like "Hunters, please donate meat to the elder citizen's home as winter is approaching"
there are NO supermarkets, no fast food stores, no ruth chris steak house in those parts. you cant even buy milk.
stevelyn
Member
Sounds like we need to send an Inupiat delegation of advisors down there to teach them to hunt whales correctly.
Up here they use a whale gun that launches an explosive head (whale bomb) into the vitals and pretty much immediately kills the whale.
Why are they whacking greys anyway? They suck. Bowheads are better and belugas are even better yet.
Up here they use a whale gun that launches an explosive head (whale bomb) into the vitals and pretty much immediately kills the whale.
Why are they whacking greys anyway? They suck. Bowheads are better and belugas are even better yet.
Novus Collectus
Member
Maybe they don't use exploding harpoons because they are not allowed in Washington state. Not sure about if they are legal on tribal territory though.
But I think the real reason may be why is that part of the treaty is that Mahak hunt the whale in a ceremonial fashion and so the origional strike has to be with a harpoon and the .50 rifle is there just to insure a humane and quick end to the whale's life.
But I think the real reason may be why is that part of the treaty is that Mahak hunt the whale in a ceremonial fashion and so the origional strike has to be with a harpoon and the .50 rifle is there just to insure a humane and quick end to the whale's life.
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