mljdeckard
Member
^^I tell people that the NRA is made up of people like myself, and they do exactly what we pay them to, because it is more cost effective than all of us trying to do it on our own.
I don't think they expected the push back we gave them
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Tom from WNY
Member
For those who believe that the fight for 2A is over because Feinstein's bill did not make it to the Senate floor this time, you are delusional. The war has just begun and we won the first skirmish. Battles are yet to shape up at the Federal level. Schumer's UBC bill has yet to come up and there are gun owners that think UBC's, as defined by Chucky, are OK.
The real battles are being fought at the State level. NY is a warzone, and we are working hard to get any sort of victory (we do have the Emperor a bit frazzled). CO just experienced a loss; I think CO gun owners now know what the war will look like. IL thought they would finally see CCW's; the legislature is fighting IL gun owners to strip them of their rights. The Anti crowd knows that they have resources behind them (like Dictator Bloomberg's bank account) and by fighting in the States, they will try to bleed us out. Be vigilant and aware, $$ do not = numbers of voters!
One good thing about us in the anti-2A States is that we did not let down our guard and fought with all weapons. Now is the time for all good gun owners to stand up for the cause across the United States of America.
The real battles are being fought at the State level. NY is a warzone, and we are working hard to get any sort of victory (we do have the Emperor a bit frazzled). CO just experienced a loss; I think CO gun owners now know what the war will look like. IL thought they would finally see CCW's; the legislature is fighting IL gun owners to strip them of their rights. The Anti crowd knows that they have resources behind them (like Dictator Bloomberg's bank account) and by fighting in the States, they will try to bleed us out. Be vigilant and aware, $$ do not = numbers of voters!
One good thing about us in the anti-2A States is that we did not let down our guard and fought with all weapons. Now is the time for all good gun owners to stand up for the cause across the United States of America.
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The fight will never be over, as others have said.
The anti's are doing their best to characterize gun owners as failing to see "common sense," or "uncompromising."
We must continue to argue logically with any who would listen. We must teach our kids to respect guns rather than to fear them, as many of our schools are trying to do.
The fight is on many different platforms, and we must meet it on each of them.
The anti's are doing their best to characterize gun owners as failing to see "common sense," or "uncompromising."
We must continue to argue logically with any who would listen. We must teach our kids to respect guns rather than to fear them, as many of our schools are trying to do.
The fight is on many different platforms, and we must meet it on each of them.
MachIVshooter
Member
Well, in the long term, they may have done us a favor here.
It sucks right now, but if all the conversations, polls, responses to articles and posts on Hick's FB page are any indication, they have just handed the state's government to the GOP on a silver platter.
and not just in Colorado my friend~ there are lots of people from both parties here in NY that are alarmed by the way the SAFE act was bullied into law, the "representatives" that allowed it to happen and the "too-bad-so-sad, you'll do as we tell you you peasants, I did want I want and tough cookies if you don't like it" attitude coming from our Governor. Not to mention Bloombergs soda-FAIL~
We just have to hold the lines until election time and GOP- here we come!!!
We just have to hold the lines until election time and GOP- here we come!!!
HorseSoldier
Member
+1. It is interesting that anti-2A leadership is not just ignoring the will of their constituents, but are abusing the democratic process to enact, or try to enact, their agendas. Cuomo's midnight romp and Colorado's fast track on their bills both suggest that the anti-2A types don't feel very secure in their position and believe that the more public input on their ideas the less likely they are to succeed.
LiveLife
Member
Yes, that's scary. That's not reflective of democracy this country represents but rather totalitarian/anarchy!
I hope that was a wake up call to many, especially to those claiming to be Democrats/liberals.
The founding fathers wrote the Constitution/Second Amendment to protect us from such abuse of power!
I hope that was a wake up call to many, especially to those claiming to be Democrats/liberals.
The founding fathers wrote the Constitution/Second Amendment to protect us from such abuse of power!
It's even worse than that HorseSoldier, Cuomo has been quoted saying outright that he knew it didn't have a chance in hell of passing if anyone had a chance to read it, let alone debate it or even get public input beforehand. And the pushback by most counties, sheriffs and the public at large is the proof in that pudding~
SleazyRider
Member
You must have watched a different CPAC meeting than I did.
beatledog7
Member
Has it occurred to anyone that the entire AWB and mag restriction push was always just a left-hand ruse to distract us from what the right hand was doing? That Sen Feinstein knew from jump street that those provisions would never get a vote and was simply employed in the role of gadfly?
The Majority Leader says no to the AWB and magazine capacity limits, but UBC--the real objective because it opens the door to registration and then confiscation--is still in the gun control bill.
UBC is the right hand of the anti-gunners, the one they have always thought and still think can win because, as they say, it's just reasonable to make sure crooks and nut jobs can't get guns, and UBC will do that. That load of bull has played very well in Peoria, and there's no real indication that it won't pass. When it does, the next thing will be "realization" that it's impossible to enforce UBC without registration, so the President will sign an Executive action to implement that step, legitimized by the concept of enforcement facilitation.
While Senator Feinstein wrings her hands and gets all boo-hooey over not getting her vote on AWB, and we celebrate the probable defeat of AWB and magazine restrictions, the anti's laugh at us for being so gullible and quietly instigate the mechanism for taking all our firearms.
Folks, there's nothing to celebrate until we defeat UBC.
The Majority Leader says no to the AWB and magazine capacity limits, but UBC--the real objective because it opens the door to registration and then confiscation--is still in the gun control bill.
UBC is the right hand of the anti-gunners, the one they have always thought and still think can win because, as they say, it's just reasonable to make sure crooks and nut jobs can't get guns, and UBC will do that. That load of bull has played very well in Peoria, and there's no real indication that it won't pass. When it does, the next thing will be "realization" that it's impossible to enforce UBC without registration, so the President will sign an Executive action to implement that step, legitimized by the concept of enforcement facilitation.
While Senator Feinstein wrings her hands and gets all boo-hooey over not getting her vote on AWB, and we celebrate the probable defeat of AWB and magazine restrictions, the anti's laugh at us for being so gullible and quietly instigate the mechanism for taking all our firearms.
Folks, there's nothing to celebrate until we defeat UBC.
LiveLife
Member
^^^^^^^^
Ding Ding Ding!!!
Ding Ding Ding!!!
NORMAL NATIONAL POLITIkAL THINKING AND TIMELINE.
"We won" makes any party think mandate. A tragedy happens, and El Prez acts on that alleged 'mandate'. Look this is simple left wing politboro activity, quickly into a new dynasty er, excuse me term, FILL THE TOILET with as much crap as possible. Hit the lever, lever again, plunger, plunge plunge again. 5 gal bucket of water, GET IT DOWN and cleaned up before next election cycle.
They definately expected some complaints even a few 'nuts' saying we ain't doin' it.
They DID NOT expect 3 nationwide flash marches, armed in as many areas as possible. That's a chiller folks think about it the National Mall has been filled b4, statehouses etc with no helmet protests, voting rights, gays....never armed.
Think politically....and listen hundreds if not thousands of miles away, NY statehouse THOUSANDS showed up and yelled "WE WILL NOT COMPLY...WE WILL NOT COMPLY"
Most politicians of any dynasty er, excuse me term don't want any part of that
REMAIN VIGILANT...write (pen and paper with misspeledd
words) phone calls emails !!
"We won" makes any party think mandate. A tragedy happens, and El Prez acts on that alleged 'mandate'. Look this is simple left wing politboro activity, quickly into a new dynasty er, excuse me term, FILL THE TOILET with as much crap as possible. Hit the lever, lever again, plunger, plunge plunge again. 5 gal bucket of water, GET IT DOWN and cleaned up before next election cycle.
They definately expected some complaints even a few 'nuts' saying we ain't doin' it.
They DID NOT expect 3 nationwide flash marches, armed in as many areas as possible. That's a chiller folks think about it the National Mall has been filled b4, statehouses etc with no helmet protests, voting rights, gays....never armed.
Think politically....and listen hundreds if not thousands of miles away, NY statehouse THOUSANDS showed up and yelled "WE WILL NOT COMPLY...WE WILL NOT COMPLY"
Most politicians of any dynasty er, excuse me term don't want any part of that
REMAIN VIGILANT...write (pen and paper with misspeledd
words) phone calls emails !!
RetiredUSNChief
Member
I hope you're correct. But you'd better take a hard look at actual demographics on that and not go by your feelings on this before you get your hopes up.
NYC is as well established on liberal control as Chicago. And that's TIGHT. Even a hardcore turnout of conservative voters will have an extremely difficult time, not only because of the numbers against them, but because the tactics and money is against them as well. Numbers are easy to counter with money and strategic control of traditionally liberal assets, such as media, unions, social programs, and so forth.
I DO wish you the best of luck. Certainly a darn strong conservative movement would be great to boot some people. But even if people are booted, the system is thoroughly liberal and it'll be a constant battle to affect changes. This means that it's entirely possible for liberals to set the state for a return in force, simply because they can tweek public dissatisfaction by impeding conservative policy and changes, then saying "SEE! They can't get anything done, so you need to vote us back in!"
If you do get voting results, PLEASE back that up in force for the long haul!
Twmaster
Member
This is worth repeating. The UBC, IMHO, -is- the 800 pound gorilla. We must defeat this. Once that camel gets it's nose under the tent it just goes downhill from there.
I pray Rep. Bob Goodlatte (House Judiciary Committee Chairman) is good about his words for no gun bills to make it out of committee.
lloveless
Member
So what does UBC mean?
LL
LL
lloveless
Member
Nothing I heard from the CPAC, makes me hopeful!
LL
LL
kyhunter
Member
I posed the same question and was flamed for it.
http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/Schumer-Universal-Background-Checks/2013/03/12/id/494397
checks with registration.
enforcement.
restrictions.
confiscation.
Two months ago, the gun control proponents and the media were mentioning the AWB first, then magazine limits second, and then UBCs third. That's the order of importance they put on each of those measures at the time.
The idea that "the AWB was designed to fail" or that "UBCs were the REAL goal..." is just RETCON on the part of gun control proponents now that the AWB has not received the rousing support they expected. Feinstein and many others fully, completely believed they would and could pass the AWB and other measures. The massive over-reach of the AWB is not some kind of calculation to set the goalposts a long way away (although that is certainly part of the result), but rather what gun control proponents really, actually wanted to achieve.
Let's recall the post 2012 election orgy of hubris that the left seemed to wallow in. They felt that the POTUS' re-election gave them a mandate to push through the full measures of their agendas. They really believed that Sandy Hook would be the coup de gráce, the cherry on top, that would make the gun control aspect of that mandate possible, and the echo-chambers of the media made it appear to them that everyone in America was on board with that plan.
Now that the AWB doesn't have all the support they believed it would, they are switching horses mid-stream to support the other measures that haven't had dirt kicked in their faces yet so they do not have to admit failure. It's Pee Wee Herman saying "I meant to do that" after flipping over the handlebars on his bike -- you can bet that if magazine limits and UBCs end up with the same resistance, they'll also fall back to other positions of support so they won't have to admit failure there, either.
I think those of you who think "this is all part of one big calculated plan" are giving way too much credit to the gun control forces. Wanting to achieve an objective, having a cogent strategy to achieve that objective, and executing that plan are three very separate concepts. I think that the gun control crowd has a lot of the first, but not enough of the second and third to actually make it a complete reality. That certainly doesn't diminish the threat, because even a disorganized clown-show of a warplan executed by idiots can still inflict a significant bit of damage. The threat is still there, and is going to be there for a long time, and is going to approach from many different angles on many different levels.
As others have said, the AWB news is a small victory in a small skirmish in a much large battle and war. It is NOT an indicator that the war is won by ANY means, but it is an indicator that the enemy is not quite as tall as they made themselves out to be prior to the start of the war.
The idea that "the AWB was designed to fail" or that "UBCs were the REAL goal..." is just RETCON on the part of gun control proponents now that the AWB has not received the rousing support they expected. Feinstein and many others fully, completely believed they would and could pass the AWB and other measures. The massive over-reach of the AWB is not some kind of calculation to set the goalposts a long way away (although that is certainly part of the result), but rather what gun control proponents really, actually wanted to achieve.
Let's recall the post 2012 election orgy of hubris that the left seemed to wallow in. They felt that the POTUS' re-election gave them a mandate to push through the full measures of their agendas. They really believed that Sandy Hook would be the coup de gráce, the cherry on top, that would make the gun control aspect of that mandate possible, and the echo-chambers of the media made it appear to them that everyone in America was on board with that plan.
Now that the AWB doesn't have all the support they believed it would, they are switching horses mid-stream to support the other measures that haven't had dirt kicked in their faces yet so they do not have to admit failure. It's Pee Wee Herman saying "I meant to do that" after flipping over the handlebars on his bike -- you can bet that if magazine limits and UBCs end up with the same resistance, they'll also fall back to other positions of support so they won't have to admit failure there, either.
I think those of you who think "this is all part of one big calculated plan" are giving way too much credit to the gun control forces. Wanting to achieve an objective, having a cogent strategy to achieve that objective, and executing that plan are three very separate concepts. I think that the gun control crowd has a lot of the first, but not enough of the second and third to actually make it a complete reality. That certainly doesn't diminish the threat, because even a disorganized clown-show of a warplan executed by idiots can still inflict a significant bit of damage. The threat is still there, and is going to be there for a long time, and is going to approach from many different angles on many different levels.
As others have said, the AWB news is a small victory in a small skirmish in a much large battle and war. It is NOT an indicator that the war is won by ANY means, but it is an indicator that the enemy is not quite as tall as they made themselves out to be prior to the start of the war.
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Zeke/PA
Member
Universal Backround Check !
My searches tell me that in 2012 over 80,000 "gun buyers" nation wide, told lies on Federal Form 4473 after which a total of SIX prosecutions took place.
The UBC to me, means merely ANOTHER piece of un-enforced Gun Legislation that will ONLY be adhered to by our current law abiding folks.
NRA Endowment Member
My searches tell me that in 2012 over 80,000 "gun buyers" nation wide, told lies on Federal Form 4473 after which a total of SIX prosecutions took place.
The UBC to me, means merely ANOTHER piece of un-enforced Gun Legislation that will ONLY be adhered to by our current law abiding folks.
NRA Endowment Member
vito
Member
A few points:
- Look at the countries where gun confiscation has taken place in recent history. It is always preceded by registration. The real goal of universal background checks is to create a national gun registry. Watch how the anti-gun faction in the Senate is resisting language in their proposal that would prohibit the establishment of such a registry. The reality of how few prosecutions takes place even now for someone failing the background check shows that it is not truly intended just to stop the sale of guns to unqualified individuals.
- Our fight will never be over. We can only be free from gun control to a certain degree, while those pushing for gun control can always try again and again to limit our freedom.
- America continues to become more and more urbanized. And large cities are the place where gun control is most accepted. While overall gun and ammo sales are way up, there is some evidence that gun owners are a shrinking percentage of the total population, something that bodes badly for us.
- The NRA is our strongest tool in the effort to stop erosion of the 2A. Imagine if instead of 4-5 million members we had 10 or 15 million of us in the NRA. Even with thousands of new memberships being registered every day we will not get to the 10 million mark for several years. We need tens of thousands of new members daily; we can all do our part by encouraging everyone we know to become part of the NRA.
A final comment: While I don't expect grammar and spelling to be perfect in forum thread comments, some of the comments on this particular thread are so poorly written as to make it unclear as to what the writer was trying to express. I encourage followers of the THR to take a moment longer when composing a thread comment and try to make it understandable in reasonably proper English.
- Look at the countries where gun confiscation has taken place in recent history. It is always preceded by registration. The real goal of universal background checks is to create a national gun registry. Watch how the anti-gun faction in the Senate is resisting language in their proposal that would prohibit the establishment of such a registry. The reality of how few prosecutions takes place even now for someone failing the background check shows that it is not truly intended just to stop the sale of guns to unqualified individuals.
- Our fight will never be over. We can only be free from gun control to a certain degree, while those pushing for gun control can always try again and again to limit our freedom.
- America continues to become more and more urbanized. And large cities are the place where gun control is most accepted. While overall gun and ammo sales are way up, there is some evidence that gun owners are a shrinking percentage of the total population, something that bodes badly for us.
- The NRA is our strongest tool in the effort to stop erosion of the 2A. Imagine if instead of 4-5 million members we had 10 or 15 million of us in the NRA. Even with thousands of new memberships being registered every day we will not get to the 10 million mark for several years. We need tens of thousands of new members daily; we can all do our part by encouraging everyone we know to become part of the NRA.
A final comment: While I don't expect grammar and spelling to be perfect in forum thread comments, some of the comments on this particular thread are so poorly written as to make it unclear as to what the writer was trying to express. I encourage followers of the THR to take a moment longer when composing a thread comment and try to make it understandable in reasonably proper English.
buck460XVR
Member
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While it does speak loudly, a louder message would be if those sales were being made by more first time gun owners. Unfortunately, it seems most of the ammo and guns disappearing off the shelves is being bought by folks already into the shooting sports. While it increases the amount of firearms owned, it is not increasing the number of gun owners. IMHO, This is where we need to focus. We need to get back to introducing those youth and young adults to the shooting sports that previously had no experience. We need to teach them responsible gun ownership and ethics. We need to teach them not only to exercise their 2nd Amendment rights, but the right to vote......responsibly. They are the future, and until guns can vote instead of gun owners, gun numbers themselves mean little.
r1derbike
Member
Feinstein and Obama are alive and well, continuing to push 2nd Amendment and Constitutional travesty:
http://www.nraila.org/get-involved-...s/2013/vol-20,-no-12-03222013.aspx?s=&st=&ps=
http://www.nraila.org/get-involved-...s/2013/vol-20,-no-12-03222013.aspx?s=&st=&ps=
Oh they expected the push-back alright. They also didn't expect to push their whole agenda through right now either. They hit us with as much as they can and hope some sticks. It works little by little. I didn't expect Colorado to turn the way it did. It goes to show you how even a state with a solid gun culture can change when enough people move in with different ideas.
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