I just can't shoot at 100yds

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kd7nqb

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So I have always been more of a handgun shooter but as somebody who does enjoy all aspects of firearms I do own a few rifles. I have 2 .22lr rifles both of which I would consider myself an ok shot with but nothing amazing. However my only centerfire rifle is a Mosin Nagent M44, I take it with me to the range just about every time and will shoot it a little bit but just really cant master it in any degree.

This time I put a 8in "shoot N see" sticky target at 100yrds and tried shooting at it. Of the 15shots I fired 11 hit the target 4 were complete misses. The remaining 11 showed no signs of grouping so I dont even think the misses all missed in the same direction.

Now the mosin is certainly not a MOA rifle and I dont expect it to be, but I doubt that this lack of success is all attributable to the rife. I also imagine that if I were to put a scope on the rifle I would improve my group but 100yds is not a shot that should require a telescopic sight.

One issue I seem to have is because of the loss of the detail at 100yds I don't even think I am holding the rifle at the same point on the target each time.

For the record these shots were taken from the sitting position off a bench with the front of the stock resting on a 6in block.

For comparison I can reliable put 5rnd groups of .40s&w inside of 1in at 15yds with my M&P so I think my "fundamentals" of shooting and trigger control are at least moderately sound.

Any help would be appreciated.
 
^ I agree.. We will often shoot a Mosin and a Mauser side by side at 100 yds open sights, not to show what a poor rifle the Mosin is... But what a great rifle the Mauser is. :D
 
What are you focusing on when you are shooting at that distance? The target or the front sight? Your fundamentals are good for shooting handguns, rifles are using a different set of muscles.....different set of problems. Are you using a 6 o'clock hold or a center hold for sight picture? Are you flinching? Have you had someone else shoot that rifle to see if they can get it to group? Is the mosin the only centerfire rifle you shoot? I would see if I could get my hands on something that kicks a little bit lighter to start with. There ain't many handguns that kick like a mosin. The recoil is handled different on a rifle than a handgun, so find something a bit easier on the shoulder to work with.

That said, I believe that the factory sights on the mosins are excrement not fit for fertilizer. I don't like them, or that type of sights on any of the rifles I have shot that had them.
 
Interesting that both of the first posters seem to think it could be the gun. I am going to have to bug a couple of my buddies to see if they could drag out their rifles to the range next time I go. Would shooting off a lead sled eliminate enough of the shooter interaction to confirm if this is the rifle?
 
It's entirely possible you have a tired dog o' war there or that you're using ammo not to its liking. Every Mosin I've owned has favored a particular type of ammo. Some do better with heavy ball, some with light, some with extra wide .312" bullets. You just have to fiddle with them a bit.

The quickest way to check against something you are doing is to have a more experienced shooter try it. But if you're already shooting test loads from a bench with the barrel on a padded rest, I suspect your M44 may be the problem.

We will often shoot a Mosin and a Mauser side by side at 100 yds open sights, not to show what a poor rifle the Mosin is... But what a great rifle the Mauser is.
Click to expand...

Yeah yeah. I've had old Turk dogs o' war that belched smoke back at me and gave a basketball group at 50 yards, and I've had Finn Mosins that shot MOA even with my old eyes. I've even had a number of Soviet 91/30's that would reliably shoot a sold 2 to 2 1/2 MOA. That's as good as the average battle Mauser.
 
hell I can not hit anything at 50 yards with my mosin... mostly because I cannot see the target with the iron sights. I really should see an eye doctor... sigh...
 
Don't under-estimate the importance of eye sight. If you can barely see the target, chances are good you are not aiming in the same spot shot-to-shot. I have the same problem with my AK. With open sights I can put maybe 50% of the rounds on a 8.5x11" sheet of paper at 100 yards. With a 4x scope, I can put 75% of my rounds into a 2.5" coke bottle at the same range.
 
I can't add anything else of substance other than to say, as an NCO that spent countless hours teaching soldiers to shoot, at 100m it's usually not the rifle.

Did any of the 'hits' keyhole? If the bullets are going in sideways, yeah, it's the rifle. If you have perfect little circles, concentrate on BRM & focusing on the front sight.
 
I can't add anything else of substance other than to say, as an NCO that spent countless hours teaching soldiers to shoot, at 100m it's usually not the rifle.

Did any of the 'hits' keyhole? If the bullets are going in sideways, yeah, it's the rifle. If you have perfect little circles, concentrate on BRM & focusing on the front sight.
Click to expand...

No keyholes at all which was one sign that made me think that it was me. I will most certainly doing a few things to figure this out including having a buddy shoot the rifle, shooting the rifle from a sled and trying out a different rifle at 100yds. I may be purchasing a winchester 30-30 lever gun here soon and if that happens it will be a good test to check out.

As to the ammo all the ammo I have been using has been cheap surplus stuff from sportmans guide that I bought in a 150rnd pack. I would have to dig out the box to find the specific specs on it.
 
well, the trigger on those suck, unless you work on them, the 44 is also hard to shoot, if the sites are not really 'on'.
I would take one of your 22's and shoot it at the same target, and see what results you get; What 22 ammo do you have? if it is remington, just go out
and get some American Eagle, red box, made by Federal. they are cheap, but pretty decent and consistent. If you can shoot your target pretty decent with the 22, and you should be able to put all shots with open sites, inside the 8
inch target, then you will know that the prob lies with the 44, and it needs some tweeking. Open up the bbl channel, keep the bayonet, if it has one, closed, do a trigger job, etc.
http://www.surplusrifle.com/russianmosin189130/index.asp
http://7.62x54r.net/
 
For comparison I can reliable put 5rnd groups of .40s&w inside of 1in at 15yds with my M&P so I think my "fundamentals" of shooting and trigger control are at least moderately sound.
Click to expand...

That's pretty impressive with a pistol, but although trigger control is very important shouldering your rifle properly can be very important as well. Have you broke the rifle down to get a better look at the inlet of the stock? Have you tightened everything up? Like you said the Mosin isn’t shooting a minute of angle, but to be completely missing the target from a 100yds would lead me to believe you have other issues than just a heavy trigger or the rifle not being shouldered properly. I would break it down, clean, lube, tighten everything up, check the crown, and start over.
 
Try shooting at 50 yards instead of 100. That's what I did with my mauser. 100 yards is just a little too far for my aging eyes. I've never shot a mosin but have heard the same as above about their lack of accuracy. I'm getting a scope for the mauser you might try that also.
 
You mention resting the "front of the rifle on a 6" block..."
If in fact you are resting the forestock on a 6" block of wood; I would suggest padding the block with a folded towel, or using a shooting bag.
This may make a difference in your accuracy. Try it.
 
So many variables and much good info here. If I were you I would:
A. Have someone else shoot the rifle
B. Shoot a different rifle
C. Try the lead sled
D. Have my eyes checked
E. Try different loads in the rifle
F. Practice, Practice, Practice. Off a rest shouldn't take
much...
Shoot well...:)
 
It's not a smoothbore, is it?

That was my first thought, as I was looking at a friend's newly purchased M44 and the bore condition was comical.
 
The M44, for all its positive attributes, is not the best rifle to use to benchmark your rifleman skills. I'd suggest working with the .22 rifles for a while. What type of rifles are they, and what kind of sights do they have? A 10/22 with Tech Sights is a great training tool.

Also, consider getting yourself to an Appleseed - that's the best rifle training for the dollar available anywhere.
 
Also, if you don't think you will ever need the bayonet, take it off. Either punch the pin out, and pull it out, or grind the whole darn thing off. The russians never got the harmonics right with the 44's and bayonets, whether opened or closed- usually they shoot even worse with the bayo open.
 
I don't know if this is an option for you, but look at getting a Stevens 200 in .223. Put a decent scope on it and head to the range. The Stevens are very accurate and inexpensive. The .223 had little to no recoil and allows you to focus on the all the other stuff need to shoot a distance. A scope simplifies the aiming process and allow for some magnification as well.

After you build up some confidence and skill, you can try other rifles. I bet you would be amazed how fast you can pick up the basics with a combo like this.

Good Luck.
 
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