I was forced into watching a crappy movie!

Status
Not open for further replies.
D

Duramaximum

Member
Joined
Feb 24, 2006
Messages
122
Location
Kalispell, MT
But seriously, haven't we all been forced to go see a crappy romantic comedy by our girlfriends, wifes, various other good friends who have a poor taste in movies? Well, I got that pleasure the other night. I spent most of the movie thinking up a scenario (nothing exploded in that movie, I had to do something to keep myself occupied.) I always carry to movie theaters. I think it was the second verse in that Tim McGraw song "Don't take the Girl" that has always made me a bit leary of them, just because I never wanted to be the schmuck who surrendered in a bad situation. True, the likelihood of this scenario happening is slim to none, but you never know and I like threads like this because it makes me think, real or not. Oh, and can we keep the "You should have been paying attention to your surroundings, not daydreaming." speeches for another day. So here it goes.


I was wondering what I would do if I came out of the theater after the movie (we were the last show to get out around midnight) saw a BG holding the cashier at the concession stand at gunpoint with a Glock or whatever it is homies carry nowadays, demanding cash and looking crazy.

Things to Remember:
-I had my EAA Tanfoglio Witness Compact 10mm, 12+1 180gr. Hornady JHP, but you can have whatever you prefer.
-BG doesn't see you.
-You have 9 people in your party, not including whoever else was in the theater. 2-Guys, 7-Girls (Hence the poor movie choice.)
-Everyone in the 21st century has a cell phone.
-Distance between you and the BG was approximately 10-15 yards.

Originally, I thought "Just try to drop him and hope for the best to save the cashier." Then after realizing my life isn't "24" and I'm not Jack Bauer, I thought that possibly starting a firefight could only end in disaster such as a hostage situation. So this is what my best case scenario would have looked like.

First Step: Get back out of sight and clear leather.
Second Step: Get everyone back out the side door and tell a specific person to call 911 and tell them that someone (being you) is armed and has a CWP.
Third Step: Stay with the group and keep them out of sight and wait for the BG to get in his car before trying to look for a license plate #.
Fourth Step: Go check on cashier.
Fifth Step: Wait for Police.

Floorplan (Not to scale):
theater2cq9.png


For anyone who cares the movie was "Music and Lyric."
 
Last edited:
If you're 15 yards away, and the bad guy's back is to you, and you go to the range regularly... how are the shots you fire going to start a firefight?

If the bad guys's gun is pointed at someone, lives are in danger right now.
 
Yeah, that Tim McGraw song gets to me too.

That said, it's really nice to have someone go the extra distance with a detailed tactical floorplan of the combat zone.

Is it possible to get top-to-bottom thermal scan to trace heat signatures of any possible hidden baddies? :evil: J/K

Seriously, it's a poor setup for any kind of shoot... not that it even dictates one at this point. If you're coming from the right side of the theater is almost directly in your line of fire. If you're coming from the left side of the theater, any stray shots would probably go right out the front door (which no doubt is glass) and strike some unsuspecting victim in the parking lot.

oh...
If you're 15 yards away, and the bad guy's back is to you, and you go to the range regularly... how are the shots you fire going to start a firefight?
Click to expand...

Stress...loss of fine motor control, adrenaline dump, auditory exclusion...

Even drawing on the BG and moving from behind cover in order to issue commands to him ("Drop the gun!" or "Stop!") might get the cashier shot, or if the BG turns and fires towards you, he could hit you or someone in your group.

Unfortunately, the best plan of action is to call 911. You are not SWAT and it's not your problem. Hopefully the gangsta won't decide to peel the cashier's wig back. If he does, I would feel really guilty, like I should have done something, but in all reality, there's nothing that anyone besides Chuck Norris could do.

It could also go the way of hostage situation.

Or, you could dump the mag of that nice 10mm ya got there and pray for the best. I'll watch your trial on Court TV.
 
This is an example of why I don't carry 10mm. A full-house 10mm load will plow through the target and several layers of the material that current movie theaters are made of. If it is loaded to 'lite' spec, it is a .40. (Before I get flamed for being a 10 hater, I think there are very good reasons to use a 10 in war.)

For ME in this situation, there would be two things that would determine whether I would wait and call or engage. 1. How crowded is the theater? Are there other people beyond your target? is there a limited likelihood that you will hit anyone behind the target? 2. Is there REALLY a high chance the BG is going to pull the trigger? I won't engage to protect a 3rd party if the risk isn't absolutely imminent.

I'm thinking the vast majority of the time, I will be using my weapon to cover the retreat of my party BACK THROUGH THE THEATER AND OUT A SIDE EXIT.
 
I'd inform the BG that a large stale popcorn, flat coke, and milk duds will cost him $34. He'd pass out from shock and I'd tie him up with red vines.:neener:
 
(Note: This is about a subscenario I proposed, which is that the bad guy is pointing a gun at someone right now. The original scenario doesn't say. Or maybe it does: "a BG holding the cashier at the concession stand at gunpoint").

IF the bad guy is pointing a gun at someone, why would you yell commands at him?
 
Why you have to hate on us?

First Dura, why you gotta be a hater and not warn the rest of us away from whatever snorefest you attended.

Second, would send everyone behind me out the back to safety and wait as a witness. Camera phone witness anyone? Also, by staying behind cover this allows you to engage if ABSOLUTELY necessary and be a good witness to the best of your abilities.

Again, many forget the value of a camera phone. Remember how many times do we have a stick figure description for the GG to catch and identify the BG's with?
 
well i can't carry yet.........

but if i was or even if i was just on the way out i would direct other people from the theater i was in to the back door. and call 911 why risk getting you and the cashier shot then you have a double homicide on your hands.:what:
 
I think you have a pretty solid plan in mind.

There's a huge section of the lobby you can't see from "your" position. Bear in mind that there may be one or more other bad guys present out of your line of sight so if you open a can o' firefight you could suddenly find yourself seriously overmatched. It is always VITAL to assume there is more than one badguy!

If you unass yourself from that place via that exit behind you some people are going to applaud you and some will call you cowardly. Believe me being called cowardly is a lot easier on you than the justice system will be even in a 100% righteous shooting.

About the only other thing I can think of that might "break" the situation is to yank the fire alarm. I'm of mixed feelings about that because many people might try to exit via the lobby. Badguys confronted with a lot of people and confusion would -probably- flee (best case scenario here) but I also wonder about sending unsuspecting folks into danger.
 
Camera phones make noises, if he sees you take his picture, you might freak him out and cause him to start shooting, I think the first senario is the best, hide out and call the cops until he leaves.
 
Do nothing, he hated the movie as bad as you and was just after a refund from the rip-off!:D
 
Mmmm, 10mm. I'm down with that.:) If it's like my Witness, it'll probably jam on you, so best just to get out.
 
As you are getting your cel phone out, shooing people away, finding cover, and doing all these smart things, the BG pulls the trigger on the gun he's been pointing at the clerk.
 
Last edited:
As you are getting your cel phone out, shooing people away, finding cover, and doing all these smart things, the BG pulls the trigger on the gun he's been pointing at the clerk.

Enjoy.
Click to expand...

Maybe, maybe not.
Maybe the badguy is a shooter. In that case he's going to shoot.
Maybe the badguy isn't a shooter. In that case startling him may result in a shooting that wouldn't have happened.
Maybe it's important to get X number of other people out of harms way while you can.

Either way, if the clerk was shot then your implication that the clerk's death is then the responsibility of the OP is every bit as insane as the implication that the gun killed someone. Responsibility for the situation rests completely with the shooter.

Adding the "enjoy" to the end is crass and extremely low road.
 
I'm just having a heck of a time wrapping my head around this. I appear to be completely alone in my feeling that this is as clear a shoot/no-shoot scenario as I've ever read on here. It probably means I'm wrong in my assessment of it, but I just don't see it.

So, if a bad guy is pointing a gun at someone, it's alright to figure that he might not pull the trigger. There's no need to stop him right now. Right?
 
It's not YOUR responsibility to guess what his intentions towards the clerk are. (At least not your PRIMARY responsibility.) It's your responsibility to make sure that you and your party leave alive. Jumping in as a third party is just as likely to get someone killed as save anyone's life.
 
Jumping in as a third party is just as likely to get someone killed as save anyone's life.
Click to expand...

His back is turned to you. He doesn't know you are there. You are well within handgun range. As drawn on the diagram, there is nobody behind him.

Now, how is it that taking immediate action to stop the clear and present threat to the clerk's life is more likely to get someone killed?

It's like saying you shouldn't throw a life ring at a drowning man because you might hit him in the head and kill him.
 
My opinion: you shoot a guy in the back, and that guy hasn't killed anyone yet, you're going to jail for a long time.

May not be fair, may not be right, but I bet the prosecutor will agree with me.
 
His back is turned to you. He doesn't know you are there. You are well within handgun range. As drawn on the diagram, there is nobody behind him.

Now, how is it that taking immediate action to stop the clear and present threat to the clerk's life is more likely to get someone killed?
Click to expand...

Wayneconrad
I'll jump back to my earlier post and re-state something. Via that diagram the "you are here" dot can't see a lot of that lobby. If there are other badguys in the areas of the lobby you can't see and you cap the "X" one you can then you've lost all element of surprise. That's going to turn deadly ugly instantly.

Okay, a lot of robberies are one-man jobs but the style of two or more man is becoming more and more common these days. Tactically you have got to assume that if you see one gunman then he/she has backup unless you are completely certain otherwise.

Now to be completely clear, I also understand the attitude of "I couldn't just leave that kid there at the gunman's mercy" but this would be one of those situations where logic needs to trump emotion.
 
My opinion: you shoot a guy in the back, and that guy hasn't killed anyone yet, you're going to jail for a long time.
Click to expand...
This is likely to vary from state to state. Under Arizona law, this would be a justifiable use of deadly force. In the back, in the front, doesn't matter.

PS: I'm no lawyer. Just some schmuck on the net.
 
"BadGuy" is a cop arresting an armed and/or dangerous concession worker.

"BadGuy" is a bad guy but you don't see any overt indications of such.

You need to be Real Darn Certain of any situation where you are thinking of shooting someone seconds after you first see them.

Another point - 10-15 people coming out of a theater? The group is not very likely to be quiet. I doubt you're going to get them to stop, change direction, and exit via another path without making enough noise to alert said BG to the fact that you're still there.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

W
  • Locked
Situational Awareness
Replies
9
Views
756
Karla (Threadbndr)
K
E
  • Locked
Was this an an incident in the making?
Replies
6
Views
616
Trebor
T
Zak Smith
  • Locked
Force on Force AAR & PICS
2
Replies
28
Views
7K
Zak Smith
Zak Smith
S
  • Locked
Interesting thing happened at Walmart
2 3 4
Replies
91
Views
5K
38SnubFan
3
B
  • Locked
Self Defense Scenario - what say you?
2 3
Replies
61
Views
2K
3:00hold
3
Back
Top