Inland .30 carbine price check...

[SwissArmyDad]

Found one locally. Wondering what I should be looking for as far as cartouches/stamps, and if their price is far off.

The serial number is 5,472,xxx on the action behind the rear sight and has " Inland Div. ", stamped right above it.

The barrel says, "Inland MFG, General Motors, 11-46(or 48, maybe)

The stock has a sanded off number of 262 or 282 that's just barely visible forward of the sling mount. Stock has a ribbed metal butt-plate.

Rear sight wasn't a WWII sight with the L-shaped adjustable aperature, and the bayonet mount places it somewhere pre-vietnam, correct?

Price was $799.00. I could probably offer a lower price, but around here the Universals are like $500.00 and Big 5 wants $1000.00 minimum for their stock (if they even have any more available)


Here's a quick pic:

 

[CoalTrain49]

I just purchased an Inland about a month ago. Mine is a Korean import which is worth less on the open market than a CMP gun that has no import marks on the barrel. Some are marked on the side and some on the bottom. You might see BLUE SKY or ARI ORD or lots of other stuff. Basically anything other than Mfg. (Inland, Rock-Ola, etc) and date is an import stamp.

The carbine is one of the last mfg. by Inland in 1945 according to the SN. I can't tell much about it from the pic but the rear aperture sight looks correct.

They are all mix masters from the armory rebuilds and only those that have been re-spec'd by collectors have the "factory correct" parts. There are no "original" carbines left in the world except those in museums.

Practically speaking, prices are going through the roof on these and will continue to rocket. The CMP source is finished and no more will be imported due to adm. politics and policy.

Check the receiver and barrel for the same mfg. Inland should be under the rear of the sight housing. If both match you have a USGI gun with lots of different parts from god knows where. Some could be after market, some USGI.

Bore doesn't matter much as a new barrel can be installed for about $200. Parts are everywhere and easy to find.

Consider this. A new AO will run $750. Those are not high quality guns. A new Futon Armory gun will run $1450. Old USGI guns like you are looking at are highly sought after. Those are well built and still chugging along after 70 years.

$750 is probably a good price today. Next year $950 will be a good price. I payed $550 for mine but like I said it's an import and I stole it.

If you buy it get a smiff to check it over before you shoot it. Check for head space issues cause these sometimes slam fire or fire out of battery with out of spec brass or head space issues. Just a warning, don't let that slow you down.

Also, a bayo lug was std. for your SN. Only Win and Inland used them late 44 to end of production.

If you don't buy it let me know where it is (pm please) as I might be interested in it myself.

Thanks.

 

[1KPerDay]

Looks like a potbelly stock in fairly rough shape. Price is not good but not horrible, IMO.

The days of $450 CMP M1 Carbines are over. Make sure the barrel is in good shape before you buy.

Personally, I have 2 carbines, but at today's prices I wouldn't buy a carbine unless I really wanted one specifically. I'd buy a Garand.

 

[SwissArmyDad]

Thanks for the input. Not afraid of a mixmaster, as long as it functions well, and is a good representation of an original gun. As you say, coaltrain, i'd much rather have this than a new AO or universal, and simply due to my budget, am not really interested in paying more.

I can confirm that the barrel does, in fact, have another marking down it's length:

 

[SwissArmyDad]

Very much apologize for the atrocious cell phone pics.

I can definitely make out "Blue sky" as the first part

 

[SwissArmyDad]

Rear sight

 

[SwissArmyDad]

Trigger, safety, magwell. Oh, and just remembered - he said that it won't come with any mags. I guess i'm fine with that as long as 10-rd'rs are available?

I have some 10/20 pmags that i could use to trade...

 

[1KPerDay]

I can confirm that the barrel does, in fact, have another marking down it's length:

Blue Sky for $800? Walk away, IMO.

 

[SwissArmyDad]

Well, thats an option 1kperday, for sure. What price would green light it for you personally?

 

[CoalTrain49]

The import stamp makes the gun less valuable for sure. Are you buying a shooter or collector? The import stamp will not effect it as a shooter. The bores on a lot of these guns are worn out. Some of them still can shoot 4 or 5 MOA even with a worn out bore. New barrel only guarantees 3 MOA anyway. They are NOT and never will be as accurate as a bolt gun or an AR.

I would offer $600-$650 no more if you really want a USGI carbine. If it has a good bore (2 or less measured with a muzzle gauge) it's a fair price. Use the import stamp as a bargaining point.

 

[Flash!]

I would pay about $650 for it myself.....

 

[jimmyraythomason]

Blue Sky for $800? Walk away, IMO.

Why? Please elaborate.

 

[1KPerDay]

Well, thats an option 1kperday, for sure. What price would green light it for you personally?

I wouldn't pay $400 for a blue sky.

 

[1KPerDay]

Why? Please elaborate.

Blue sky import/rebuilds are not considered high quality in general. They earned a reputation for being rather hamfisted. Stamping barrels so hard with their info that they crushed them... things of that nature. I have a Blue Sky "tanker."

Others may disagree.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

I have a Blue Sky Import M1 Garand. It is a Springfield Amory. All parts are stamped SA (non-matching numbers though). Aside from the stamping on the barrel it is identical to any other used M1 Garand.

 

[cfullgraf]

I have a Blue Sky Import M1 Garand. It is a Springfield Amory. All parts are stamped SA (non-matching numbers though).

FYI, Garand parts were never stamped with the serial number of the receiver. The numbers on the parts are the drawing numbers and revision numbers.

There are specific drawing and revision numbers that are considered "correct" for a particular serial numbered Garand as they were made at the same time.

One of the beauties of the Garand design is the easy interchangeability of parts.

One of the fun projects for some Garand collectors is to locate the correct vintage parts for their Garand.

Apologizes if you knew this already.

 

[cfullgraf]

Rear sight

An adjustable sight was a late war modification. Many carbines that went through an arsenal rebuild had the original flip sight replaced with the adjustable version.

The adjustable sight tends to hide some of the markings on the receiver.

 

[CoalTrain49]

Well I see some folks don't like the imports.

In a few years you won't be able to buy any M1 carbine with the original barrel and receiver for under a grand. People are buying them now and stripping them to sell the parts.

 

[SwissArmyDad]

CoalTrain49: Well I see some folks don't like the imports.

In a few years you won't be able to buy any M1 carbine with the original barrel and receiver for under a grand. People are buying them now and stripping them to sell the parts.

I'm certainly getting that distinct impression.

I'm not sure yet what i'll do, but i definitely appreciate being able to have a more informed discussion about it thanks to you and these other fine folks.

It may very well be that this is the best example that is actually available that i can afford. If so, i'll have to simply (yeah right) decide if it's "the one".

 

[fpgt72]

I also own a blue sky Garand and it is fantastic. Yes some don't like them but few know much more then they are imports from Korea years ago.

They did see action in the Korean war, and got put away after a fresh up for that just incase the crazy north headed south again. They are true US made guns that have a history in the Korean war, and likely also WWII. They are the same quality as any other surplus weapon meaning you will see good and you will see bad. Most will shoot very well as the south had been over run to the point their country was gone except around one small port in the extreme south of the country....these guns needed to be good to go again. Don't be afraid of Blue Sky, they did not put anything together, move parts around or anything, they are just an importer...this is not Centrury making FAL's or Mas 49/56 into 308. They can be good guns and they do have a direct pointer to being in Korea during the war....that adds value to some, not take away....but with any surplus it is all about the general shape of that specific rifle.

As to your inland....the price is eh' ok. Not great but not bad, my last carbine was an IBM to fill out a missing hole in my collection that was about 2-3 years ago and that was the same price you are paying for this inland. If you are just looking for A carbine and want to just have fun with it....and IMHO it is the most fun surplus gun out there....check the bore and if it is good, I would say buy it. Like others say the days of the cheap carbine are long gone....my first one I bought was a Winchester and it was $500 about 10 years ago. It does have the bayonet lug so that is a plus, but don't let those that say a carbine without is not a GI carbine....during the re-furbish process after the war many guns did not get the lug.

They are all parts guns....they had different makers parts in them before they left the factory....I have read stories to keep the lines running if one mfg ran low on parts they would get them shipped in from others....so before they even touched a GI's hands some had mix matched parts....don't let that bother you....or it should not....in fact if you come across one that is all matching it was likely made that way LONG after WWII.

I currently have 4 and we (my wife and I) use two of them in CMP matches every summer.

 

[Cocked & Locked]

Just have this one...$99.95 + sales tax

Well I see some folks don't like the imports.

In a few years you won't be able to buy any M1 carbine with the original barrel and receiver for under a grand. People are buying them now and stripping them to sell the parts.

I bought the one pictured below years ago at a Roses store.

The store had an ad in the newspaper...SKS rifles for $89.95. These were displayed vertically in fiber board barrels. Also out were more fiber barrels with M1 carbines in them. The carbines were $10 higher than the SKS guns. I picked the one that looked best to me.

I often wonder why the imported carbines are looked down on by folks...maybe more worn out than non-imports? Rebuilt too many times? Different history? They served in WWII, Korea, possibly other places, probably not Viet Nam.

My $99.95 M1 carbine's barrel is marked INLAND MFG. DIV. GENERAL MOTORS 9-43. The receiver is marked INLAND DIV. with a serial number of 852211 which should also put it at a 9-43 production date. It came with the M2 style magazine release, adjustable rear sight, and one GI magazine.

The import mark on the bottom of the barrel is ARL ORD ARLINGTON VA.

 

[Hacker15E]

Blue sky import/rebuilds are not considered high quality in general. They earned a reputation for being rather hamfisted. Stamping barrels so hard with their info that they crushed them... things of that nature. I have a Blue Sky "tanker."

Others may disagree.

Unfortunately, Blue Sky's reputation is both earned and unwarranted at the same time.

The fact is that some are great and some are complete crap.

I have owned several of them that spanned the gamut. The first Carbine I ever bought was a Blue Sky because I didn't know any better, and it sort of fell into the "crap" category with worn parts and a gray repark over them. Others I've owned have been better-than-CMP-quality, and still others have had shot out barrels but very nice parts. Only one out of a half dozen (that first one I bought) did I feel like I overpaid for; all of the others I felt like I got a great deal on because I knew what I was buying. I would absolutely, without question, buy another Blue Sky carbine today if it were in the right condition for the right price.

The reality is you are probably not as savvy a buyer as you think you are if you blanket ignore buying anything with Blue Sky stamped on the barrel -- you will be potentially bypassing a great firearm at a "sale" price (since as has been noted, the imports are generally at a lower price than comparable non-imports).

Just like any other gun, you have to "buy the gun not the story"; don't buy the story that all Blue Sky guns are crap, instead evaluate each one individually for condition, and you can end up with a nice carbine.

With respect to 1Kperday's Tanker Garand, these are well-known problematic modifications of the Garand that are independently unrelated to the condition of Blue Sky/Arlington Ordnance's imports of Garands and Cabines in the 80s/90s.

 

[CoalTrain49]

I did some checking for you.

Over on gunbroker an import like the one you are looking at was sold for $630 late last year and there was active bidding.

The imports are now selling for about the same price that the rack grade non-import CMP guns were 2 years ago.

Non-import guns are going for about $800 and up depending on condition.

I think a good rule of thumb now is add about 5% to the price of either every year.

That's where we're going. If you snooze, you loose.

 

[SwissArmyDad]

Awesome, thanks for the info, CoalTrain, and thanks for the insight, Hacker.

Just for example, I just bought a Victory model S&W revolver off a friend of mine that has ALL matching numbers, and is in very, very good shape. The only blemish, that I was fully aware of when I bought it, was that at some point somebody replaced the orig. stocks with aftermarket 1950's ones, and that at some point the top strap "U.S. property" or "U.S ARMY/NAVY" stamp had been removed.

Does it lower the value of the gun? Sure. Do I care? Nope. I'm actually going to take it out and shoot it, and if it's a tackdriver, which I'm kind of expecting it to be, I'll probably see my wife swoop in and put it to use as her bedside/HD gun.

Cheers!

 

[SwissArmyDad]

1KPerDay: I wouldn't pay $400 for a blue sky.

Ok, thanks for taking the time to respond. It seems you know these guns a bit and are proabably aware that they aren't being sold for sub-$400.00 prices normally, so i can only gather that at their asking price or any reasonable offer there-abouts, you'd walk away.

And this is due to your "all bad" rather than a good or even "hit or miss" experience of a "blue sky" gun.

Gotcha. Your opinion doesn't seem to match up with everything i'm reading, but i appreciate the perspective. Thanks!