interesting night

[roval]

I'm putting this here don't know if it belongs to strategies etc...
My wife and woke up at 3:15 am with a phone call and the house alarm ringing. it was the security company asking if we were ok. i've considered myself a light sleeper but i must've been in the deep phase of sleep because i didn't wake up till the phone call(biked 27 miles that am after no biking for a a few months).
got my 9 mm from the small electronic safe. a)waking up from deep sleep. it took me 2 tries to punch in the number. b)i store my gun with a loaded magazine not inserted in the gun but i don't think it would have added anything to me keeping it loaded and then press checking it. our alarm company said the alarm came from the living room zone/kitchen. i turned on all the lights cautiously moved into the space and checked the sliding door, the windows in the affected zone , turned on all the outside lights. after checking the affected zone i opened the door to the garage(not the garage door). everything good. i went to the second floor and checked all the windows and the rooms and closets. everything good. left all the outside lights on for the rest of the night.
for a couple of my self critiques-realized this later. c)since i knew the alarm wasn't on for long and the affected zone wasn't in the upstairs. i was less stringent about slicing the pie.d) I did keep my finger off the trigger the whole time except when i switched from my strong hand to weak hand but i noted later that briefly i had the finger inside the trigger guard immediately after the switch.( i would have covered my arm with the muzzle if i kept the muzzle at the closet(potential threat) and didn't switch hands). e) weapon didn't have a mounted weapon light but not sure if it would have been an advantage(still reconsidering it now). I did use a flashlight later to recheck the windows.
i purposefully didn't step outside to look around in case there was somebody out there. one of the tactics suggested by the best defense show. my family was in the same room when this happened (my son had wanted to sleep with us- don't ask me how hold he is) so i didn't have to gather the family.
I already knew from before i could never open the main gun safe in an emergency situation and this bears this out. keeping a gun ready without a safe is not an option in my house even if my son knows never to touch them unless i allow him.
this am i checked the outside and everything was ok. window screens were not tampered with. still don't know what caused the alarm.
my wife is antigun but now is asking for a gun she could handle but i doubt she'll practice adequately. I've invited her regularly to the range but has only gone with me a couple of times. if I was away and it happened , i don't know if it will be safer for her to cower like sheep and have police come and check things out than cower with a gun she hasn't practiced with(maybe this will change things)
for others that have been in a similar situation have you found yourself doing something stupid or less than ideal since you weren't fully with it when it happened?

 

[NavyLCDR]

Why not keep the gun loaded in the safe? When would be a better time for a malfunction to occur that requires troubleshooting, in the middle of the daytime with no stress or in your situation?

 

[Coyote3855]

Posts without paragraphs are very difficult to read. My DIL successfully thwarted a home break in with my son's handgun even though she had never fired it. Display was enough. She didn't cower.

 

[btg3]

How fortunate that you were granted a rehearsal, instead of the real deal. What are you going to do differently going forward?

 

[Sam1911]

She didn't cower.

Interesting choice of words. What DID she do?

 

[buck460XVR]

How fortunate that you were granted a rehearsal, instead of the real deal.

I agree. You now will be more prepared if there ever is a next time. We all have a positive mindset of how we are going to handle a SD/HD scenario. I suspect 99.9% of them never go down the way they do in our heads. You and your family are safe, shortcomings in your M.O. have been pointed out and you have the chance to correct them. All in all, you probably did no worse than the majority of folks.

 

[Onward Allusion]

roval
interesting night

No harm, no foul and all ended well . . . this time. A couple of things that could be done differently.

- leave gun loaded, unlocked, & accessible at night
- get a couple of wireless cameras (or even baby monitor cameras) so you can see downstairs w/o having to go downstairs
- RE: anti-gun wife (your words) - take it as an opportunity to convert her

 

[mrvco]

I must say that I like having a dog sleeping at the foot of our bed when something goes bump in the night. It makes the threat assessment easier. Thankfully we haven't had any two-legged prowlers to date, but between the dog and the cats, few (if any) four-legged critters go unnoticed (and we get fox, black bear and everything in between snooping around our house between dusk and dawn).

 

[AWorthyOpponent]

Question,

You left your wife and son alone in the bedroom while you checked the home?

-While you want to check the home, the ultimate goal should be your family's safety. You have an alarm, the police were surely already on their way. Maintain security by holding yourself where you were and covering the entrance to the room where you already knew you were safe. Rooms have the advantage (usually) of one way in, one way out. Also the reason a dispatcher will tell you to go into a closet if someone is breaking in. Your home may be setup differently, but as one person protecting two others, it would be your best bet. Let them take whatever they want if you know your family is safe.

Not saying you did anything wrong, espicially because I wasn't there. Just trying to give you another outlook. Security lights may also be a good idea. Movement can activate them and give you an idea of where people are in your yard. Easy to determine where they entered if the motion light is on...

 

[scaatylobo]

I am sure those will differ

Many will differ as to my view.

After clearing too many houses,wharehouses & schools to remember them all, my view in hindsight is that IF someone wanted you = your most likely dead or wounded.

Having done 'force on force' training and splatball bldg. clearing ,it is OBVIOUS that any Op-For is ahead of the curve as they KNOW they will shoot you if they see you.

And they have a high probability of hearing or seeing you first.

If you think you good enough,try getting a friend to ambush in you home after getting the instructions that he is to be as sneaky as possible and take you out if at all possible.

Use lasers,sumunitions, splatbbal guns or water pistols.I bet you lose.

As was stated,the alarm should have gone to the police and all you need do is keep your family safe.

Its your life,do as you please,the aforementioned is just my 'not so humble opinion'.

 

[Sam1911]

Those who've trained for it, done it with sims, and had to do it in real life tend to say what scaatylobo says. Those who haven't, and/or who've studied it exhaustively on TV and in movies tend to suggest that it is worth doing.

Which perspective to listen to? Hmmm...a conundrum....

 

[danez71]

From the OP:

i don't know if it will be safer for her to cower like sheep and have police come and check things out than cower with a gun she hasn't practiced with(maybe this will change things)

IMO, its better for her to have a gun she hasn't used than to be with out one.

If she doesn't have one, she cant even try to use it. The option is not there. Kind of like the lottery, you cant win if you don't play.

If she does have one but has never used it, the argument is usually that it could be taken away and used against her. My reply to that is if the bad guy is willing to use her gun against her then he most likely already had the intent of harming someone if they were there anyways.

keeping a gun ready without a safe is not an option in my house even if my son knows never to touch them unless i allow him.

I don't know how old he is but this should be an option.

IMO, gun safety is no different than pool safety. You're in FL so chances are there are pools (or the ocean) nearby that he may encounter.

Teach him to swim and What To Do and What Not To Do around water. No difference than guns really.

No pools nearby? Have you taught him how to cross a street safely? No difference really.

 

[Vol46]

I am a lifelong shooting enthusiast, hunter, & outdoorsman - was taught to hunt & shoot as a youngster, & had my own guns before most of my friends.
I've never considered myself timid or extra cautious, but I believe pretty strongly that loaded guns and little kids are not a good mixture.
Sure there are pools, oceans, streets, etc., but why add another risk, no matter how small, to the mix.
Yep, teach him to swim, teach him to handle firearms safely, but wait until he is mature enough to understand the possible consequences ( beyond a spanking or making Daddy mad) before you leave a loaded firearm within easy reach.
To me, avoiding even an infinitesimal risk of a horrible tragedy to your child is wort the few additional seconds it takes to unlock your bedside safe. I'd lock mine too if there were still kids in the house.

 

[cambeul41]

My wife was a hoplophobe, not so much anti-gun, but afraid of them. She wanted me to be armed going into Detroit and forced herself to qualify for her CCW/CPL when I earned mine "for togetherness sake." The shooting part of the course almost totally freaked her out. Even after getting her licence, she still would not voluntarily pick up a gun.

Not long after, she was threatened with a club, and the near call helped her overcome her fear of guns and now she carries when and where legal.

Perhaps,your night time scare can have beneficial results.

 

[Godsgunman]

These "practice situations" or experiences are really good for finding holes in your plan and also converting "anti-gun" spouses into at least realizing the benefits of such freedoms if not a pretty big pro gun owner mentality.
I've had 2 such experiences and my wife, who isn't against guns per se just doesnt like them with kids around, has asked for my spare gun for her to use in case something happens to me. I have learned from my experiences and have a better plan. One being at night having the key inserted in the bedside safe so all thats needed is a turn and I'm in. Trying to enter the code when suddenly awoken from a deep sleep is far to slow and complicated. And Yes the gun is already fully loaded and ready to go. Who says you'll even have time to insert the mag and rack it? Especially as you said you didn't hear anything until the phone woke you.
You now know your weaknesses, change the plan accordingly and take the wife shooting .

 

[Odd Job]

If you already have your loved ones in a room with you, it doesn't make sense to go house clearing. Lock yourselves in that room, have your gun ready and loaded, buttress the door with furniture if you have to and then call the fuzz.

 

[Outlaw Man]

Easy for us to armchair quarterback, but I agree with those who say you should have stayed put. That has been my planned defense for quite some time now, and now that I have a baby on the way, the thought of having to stumble into the unknown to gather my family is a little overwhelming. You should be glad you had that opportunity.

Stupid things I've done? Came home from a range day one weekend in college. Back door to our house was open. My roommate and I immediately loaded (neither of us had carry licenses at the time) and proceeded in to clear the house. I went room to room with my roommate behind. Upon finishing, I realized he wasn't covering me. He was outside still trying to get his hollow points to load in his Para Warthog (I think it was).

Stupid thing #1: don't clear a house you don't have to.
Stupid thing #2: don't assume your backup is behind you when they don't even have the gun loaded.

I'm sure there are others.

 

[preachnhunt]

My wife had our alarm go off in the middle of the night while I was out of town. She grabbed her Model 36 .38 and called our neighbor who is the sheriff. It turned out that the den window was unlatched and as the night cooled it must have slid down tripping the alarm.

The good part is she felt very vulnerable with only a snubby and insisted that I go ahead and purchase an AR. Now we both sleep better if I am away.

 

[Black Knight]

This may be the incident that changes her attitude entirely. Some folks need to see a wolf at the door before they will realize that wolves do exist (we know the type of wolf I refer to). Also for her safety there are tactics that can work in her favor. A gun she can handle is not a bad idea as well as a short barreled shotgun in a gauge she can handle. Also you can reinforce your bedroom door so it is more difficult to break down. A cell phone in the bedroom allows her to contact police in the event phone lines are cut. Since you have a security system that seems to be monitored by a central monitoring center they can notify emergency services while she stays in her "safe room". Another item that can help is an extra set of keys attached to a lightweight heavy duty flashlight. She can cut the light on and drop the light and keys to police from her window once the police do arrive and need access. She should also have a high intensity flashlight she can aim at the intruder's face and temporarily blind them. It may save her from pulling the trigger. Don't take her sudden interest lightly. These are just some ideas you can consider. I do hope they are never needed but in today's society it could go either way.

 

[danez71]

I am a lifelong shooting enthusiast, hunter, & outdoorsman - was taught to hunt & shoot as a youngster, & had my own guns before most of my friends.
I've never considered myself timid or extra cautious, but I believe pretty strongly that loaded guns and little kids are not a good mixture.
Sure there are pools, oceans, streets, etc., but why add another risk, no matter how small, to the mix.
Yep, teach him to swim, teach him to handle firearms safely, but wait until he is mature enough to understand the possible consequences ( beyond a spanking or making Daddy mad) before you leave a loaded firearm within easy reach.
To me, avoiding even an infinitesimal risk of a horrible tragedy to your child is wort the few additional seconds it takes to unlock your bedside safe. I'd lock mine too if there were still kids in the house.

I agree to a point. And Ive argue the same here a few times. I hate it when someone says "I put it up high where my 4 yr old "cant" reach it. A 4 yr old will figure out how to balance 3 chairs on top of a skateboard to get to something.

Kids are risky little buggers. However, there comes a time and every kid is different.


Some day the kids will walk to school alone or be left alone in the house. That is far more dangerous than a loaded gun in the night stand while asleep type scenario.

Being a parent isn't easy or with-out worry.

 

[roval]

​

thanks for the replies. I do think it was a fortunate incident even though I felt different at the time. I surprisingly wasn't nervous.
-first thing. regarding the gun i've had my xdm as my go to gun since I feel I'm the most consistent with it but now that I know I'm more consistent with my cz7b after replacing the sights i'll change it out. I feel more comfortable with a cocked and locked hammer fired gun than a striker fired gun that's loaded. I will likely always second guess myself if I did leave it with a round in the chamber(never mind the tiny loaded chamber indicator and equally tiny cocked indicator). also my xdm has a powder river replacement trigger while the cz has stock trigger(lawyer- so you replaced it with a hair trigger....).
-leaving the loaded gun out of a safe is not an option for me .others may disagree but for me this is irresponsible. your child may be taught. still wouldn't trust leaving a loaded gun around but what about a friend that comes over. kids go to restricted areas all the time. just tonight I saw a hornady bedside safe that could be opened several ways(security card, numerical code and most interestingly a small rfid bracelet) from shooting usa's shot show coverage I shall look into it.
- we'll probably look into getting motion activated lights and security cams.
-our dog sleeps with us on her dogbed in the bedroom. my wife and I were actually commenting this morning that surprisingly she didn't bark when she usually starts barking even when you are just dialing the phone. she like us was in deep sleep.
- regarding leaving the family to check on the alarm. my assumption is that with the alarm it's only been less than a minute. they usually call within 30 seconds. so most likely the potential break in was thwarted. also our master's is on the first floor where the alarm was triggered. the windows, door in question was about 20 feet away from my bedroom door. others may feel different but I will also defend my house not just my family. I will never consider myself an operator type (hahaha) but most home intruders are not going to be soldier types but burglars. yes if somebody wants to kill you they can easily kill you as you transition from your open doorway to a hallway but I will not just hide behind my door. actually we never called the police. once my wife said we were ok the security lady hung up. my wife and I talked about it afterward and for a similar situation in the future we'll have the police come to check us out.
- once there was no evidence of break in to the windows and door that trigerred the alarm I am not going back to bed without checking the rest of the house out. I don't want to be an operator type but I will try to do it best as I could. what are you going to do call the police and have them check your rooms in the absence of evidence of a break in. my wife and I would not be able to sleep if I didn't do it.
- tactically our masters suite is not ideal since it has a door that opens to the outside and 3 ground floor windows but can't think of much to do about it at this time.
- regarding my antigun wife. I told her she should learn to run a gun. we may look into something tomorrow. I told her we'll pick one out not based on appearance. just 2 days ago we we're going to check a charter arms 38 special pink lady but she didn't like the shade of pink. (hey whatever gets her to shoot with me) . tomorrow we are going to the range. in fact, some of her facebook friends were talking about a shotgun I told her it's not practical for her then I remembered the lgs had a hard to get keltec bullpup in stock.... hmmm , naah too expensive.

 

[roval]

sorry to the poster complaining about the paragraphs. I tried indenting but the post has default indent setting. will try doublespacing between paragraphs next time.

 

[MartinS]

You have given yourself way too much too think about.

 

[pinehtr]

I found out one night I could not get a gun out of my electronic safe in a emergency
from dead sleep. I can do it with my eyes closed when awake and not under stress.
I don't use it anymore.

 

[Mike1234567]

RE firearm light: I'm NO expert but I do know this much. I wouldn't be without a firearm light. There's a chance a break-in could happen during a power outage... some criminals will take advantage during emergencies. Too, some criminals are intelligent enough to switch off the power and cut phone and cable lines outside your home before entering. Unless your alarm system uses battery backup AND a cell phone transmitter then there is no COM to (or from) the alarm company. You'll need a cell phone and gun light... or a good mini flashlight you're trained to use along with your firearm.