Introduction and Questions

[Divine Rights]

Hello. I am not even sure if this is the appropriate place to post an introductory thread and if not I apologize in advance. I'm a little nervous posting here for the first time because I'm not very knowledgeable but I am willing to learn and interested. I have been watching YouTube reviews and reading about firearms or firearm safety for several months now.

I am looking to buy a Rifle and a Pistol. I have moderate experience with firearms from shooting with friends but I have never owned my own. They have encouraged me to get into firearms myself and I have a few questions. Thank you for humoring me as I am sure you have all heard these questions before.

I'd like to preface my questions with a few things. I plan on using my rifle mainly for range shooting (target practice) and I will not be hunting with this gun. I expect to keep the rifle as a backup prepper rifle. I plan on using my pistol for home defense & obviously for shooting at the range for practice. (I do not plan to carry.)

In addition, I don't want the cheapest but I certainly don't want to get the most expensive option available. As long as it is reliable & well built then I am happy.

So on to my questions:

What would you say is the best rifle round for range shooting or preparedness and what corresponding rifle would you suggest?

What type of pistol round would you recommend for home defense and what corresponding pistol would you recommend?

Can you suggest an easily accessible and secure bed-side safe for a pistol?

Can you suggest an affordable, reliable, gun safe for 1 to 3 rifles?

It's a bonus if the ammo is cheap for your selections.

Thank you so much for your time.

 

[Walkalong]

There is no perfect for any one use gun. There are however, many that will do a fine job.

What guns or calibers have you shot that you like?

Inexpensive to shoot? A 9MM auto or a .38 Spl revolver. A Mosin Nagant and a tin of ammo.

 

[primalmu]

No gun safe is complete without a .22 LR rifle. I recommend .22 rifles for everyone as their first rifle. Cheap ammo (current prices notwithstanding) means more practice/fun. Its also probably the most versatile caliber out there. Take a look at CZ for nicer rifles and Savage or Marlin for cheaper alternatives.

For handguns, 9mm all the way. Go to a gun store and try some out, see how they feel in your hand. You won't go wrong with Glock, Springfield XD, Smith and Wesson, Ruger, CZ, etc. My personal gun of choice is a CZ75 BD with VZ grips.

 

[PCCUSNRET]

Personally I would recommend a short barreled shotgun and a 9mm pistol for home defense. Nothing wrong with a AR type rifle for home defense, but at the prices they are going for now you could buy a decent shotgun and pistol. I just sold both of my AR's as there was no way I could use them for home defense. I don't know of any .223 ammo that won't penetrate 3/4" plywood at 100 yds, so there would be nothing stopping these rounds from going through the walls of my house and the neighbors next door. If I lived in the country and the nearest neighbor was a mile down the road I would have modified my home defense plans. As for target shooting, the 9mm is good and a 223 Remington or 308 Winchester would be my preference if you are concerned with costs. Really doesn't matter right now as all ammo is being sold for almost double what it did 5 months ago. Hopefully things will settle down soon. Welcome to the Highroad.

 

[Divine Rights]

For handguns I have shot 9mm, 45 ACP, 22lr, & some other random assortments. I found them all enjoyable & comfortable. I prefer less "kick" when I fire. The "humm" some of the larger rounds leave in my hand can be uncomfortable.

I had initially considered an XD 5.2" 45ACP, but a friend advised me to pick a smaller caliber for my first pistol. So I was considering the S&W M&P .40 (or even the 22lr) because I was told the 9mm has higher penetration.

As for rifles I would really like an AR-15 build, but it seems out of my price range. So I had been considering a S&W M&P 15-22 or a Ruger 10/22 because I was told they are good prepper rifles and ammo is relatively cheap. The idea of a larger caliber than a 22lr is appealing though.

Thanks again for your reply and thank you for the recommendations. I appreciate the welcome to the community as well

 

[hso]

The advantage to having an AR is that you can purchase the single platform in 5.56 and drop a .22lr upper on it for a practical defensive/range rifle that will take a wide range of game as well as having an inexpensive .22lr range/plinking/small game rifle. Further modify it and you can enter competition with it.

A defensive pistol should fit the user and no one can tell you that you need Model X from Maker Y. You need to find out what fits YOU first.

 

[HKGuns]

1. What would you say is the best rifle round for range shooting or preparedness and what corresponding rifle would you suggest?

2. What type of pistol round would you recommend for home defense and what corresponding pistol would you recommend?

3. Can you suggest an easily accessible and secure bed-side safe for a pistol?

4. Can you suggest an affordable, reliable, gun safe for 1 to 3 rifles?

5. It's a bonus if the ammo is cheap for your selections.

First, welcome to the forum and there is ZERO reason to be apprehensive. Everyone here was a rookie at one point, no-one here, well almost no-one, was born with firearms knowledge.

1. AR15 - Great all around rifle, versatile for many uses and when the panic is over prices for the rifles and ammo will fall to reasonable levels. If you feel like an AR is too much for you, I always say no firearms owner should be without a Ruger 10/22. Affordable, cheap to shoot and utterly reliable.

2. Pistols are personal, for starting out 9mm is affordable from a pistol and ammo perspective. Your best bet is to find someone to take you to a range and try a variety of pistols and buy the one that is most comfortable and that you shoot best. Smith & Wesson M&P's are mid-range level pistols that would work but you should really hold and shoot one before buying.

3. I have no experience with these but they look good and I have considered buying one. Others may have actual experience with this model and tell you it is crap, so take this recommendation with a grain of salt.
- Gunvault SpeedVault SV500 gun safe -

4. Stack-on makes small and affordable gun safes that will fit most any budget. They aren't the best, but they certainly are better than a closet.

5. I took ammo affordability into all of my answers.

 

[Divine Rights]

Taking all the advice into account I think I will go to my local range and rent a few different pistols before making a decision.

As for a rifle, it sounds like there are a lot of advantages to building an AR-15. I may just wait for the prices to go down a bit before I make a decision on a rifle.

Also, after investigating the "SpeedVault", I located a model called the "GunVault 1000" that I think will fit all of my needs.

Again, I really appreciate the advice here and if there are any additional specific model or brand recommendations please feel free to let me know.

Thanks again for the warm welcome.

 

[MedWheeler]

The Ruger 10/22 is an excellent choice for a "backup prepper" rifle, but your use of that phrase implies you already have a "primary" prepper rifle. If so, what is it?
The 10/22 is fairly light, short, and easily modified to fit any of many different configurations to suit your needs. A "ready-made" AR-type .22 rifle, such as the S&W you mention, or the Mossberg one, can also be a good choice of that's the platform you want. For more general use with great durability and reliability, the Marlin 60 is also at the top of the list.
If you want your handgun to be a 9mm (which I'd recommend over the .40 because of price and eventual availability of ammuntion), there is a lot of good reading here: www.best9mm.com. The site is a few years old, but there are plenty of images, specs, and some reviews there of typical 9mm pistols, of which there are waaaay too many to even delve into here, over there.

 

[BigBore44]

Welcome to THR.

My 2 cents from my personal experience (I believe that's what you're asking for).

Rifle for range:
Short Range- I love my Marlin model 60 22lr. Good to about 150 yards. $150
Long Range- I love my Springfield M1A. Good to 1000+ yards. $1500

Pistol for home defense:
My bedside pistol is an XD-45 with PDX-1 230 gr hollowpoints. Trust it with my life. $600

But guns are SOOO personal. You should really get some friends and family to take you to the range and try some different ones out.

 

[akv3g4n]

Like others have said, choosing the right firearm is a highly personal choice and there is no firearm that it right for every situation.

With that in mind, if I could only have 1 rifle and 1 handgun, I would choose a Russian Mosin Nagant M44 carbine for my rifle. The rifle and 7.62x54R round are both still inexpensive and the ammo is plentiful in surplus form and powerful enough for most defensive situations that you would need it for. It is easy to maintain and fairly accurate. The recoil can be a bit of an issue for some folks but is manageable with a recoil pad or shooting jacket.

I would choose a Glock 17 as my primary handgun. The 9mm round is inexpensive and effective and the Glock platform is also simple to field strip for cleaning. The finish is also fairly bullet proof and durable. The pistol is ergonomic to most shooters and the mild recoil makes it fun to shoot. The pistol is middle of the road in price coming in right around $500.

Those are my two suggestions. As others have stated, it never hurts to throw in a Ruger 10/22 also and an inexpensive pump 12 gauge.

Good luck and welcome to THR!

 

[Ryanxia]

Welcome to The High Road!

As has been stated personal preference will sway most people's answers. Personally I would go with a Glock 9mm for the handgun and an AK-47 for the rifle. There are several reasons I prefer AK's over AR's (owning both) but a few are that the rifles are generally a little cheaper and so is the ammo.

Mosin Nagants are good cheap rifles, for $120 they're fun if you don't mind heavy guns with a decent amount of recoil (in terms of a newer shooter).

 

[Jim Watson]

John "Pondoro" Taylor said he would feel safe and well fed "from Cairo to Cape Town" with a .22 rifle, "a bag of cartridges" and a powerful handgun. I doubt you will do better in the wilds of the USA.

I would go with a 9mm auto or .357 revolver and a Ruger 10/22. Actually I DID go with that combination, I've GOT those guns. There are other choices.

I would want a clear definition of need before making a surplus or militaroid centerfire rifle my FIRST purchase.

 

[Krusty783]

Welcome to THR!

Firearms are like cars to a certain extent:
A) Personal Preference has a big part in your decision making, because
B) There are very few situations where there are only a few calibers or firearms which will suit your needs.

I had a Mosin Nagant 1891 awhile ago and it was a fun range gun. I actually took it hog hunting a few times, but never got the opportunity to take one with it. However, the 7.62x54 ammo can be hard to find.

If you're looking for a prepper/SHTF type gun, there are several options based on prevalent calibers:
-A 5.56 AR pattern rifle. Everyone knows what this is, however, if you're just getting into the game now you will have a hard time finding one and an even harder time finding .223 ammo until at least summer. 5.56 recoil is quite manageable and can be mitigated even further with recoil pads on the stock and a compensator/muzzle brake.

A cheaper option would be one of the Keltec 16's. (.223 caliber cheaper carbine)

-A .308 AR (AR-10) or Springfield M1A or a FAL/CETME/HK91 clone rifle. These are all proven rifles that use common .308/7.62x51 ammo. Though they tend to have an appreciable amount of recoil, especially the CETME/HK91 clones with delayed roller-blowback actions.
-A M1 Garand, which uses .30-06 ammo. Not quite as common as .308. However, it's a very popular deer cartridge. There are still bulk quantities available on the internet AND, while Cabela's, Bass Pro, and all the Walmarts around here are sold out of .223, they all still have .30-06 on the shelves. Garands also have noticeable recoil.

You say you won't be hunting with this rifle, but depending on what you're prepping for you might need to consider hunting. .308 and .30-06 would be much better suited for hunting medium to larger (deer & ^) game than a .223.

If you want ammunition commonality between your pistol and rifle, you have a few long gun options:

-You can look at a Keltec Sub-2000 which comes in 9mm or .40 S&W. http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/rifles/sub-2000/

-Or an H&R Survivor which shoots .45 Colt and .410 gauge shotgun shells: http://www.hr1871.com/Firearms/ShotgunsAndRifles/survivor.asp
(Note: There's also .223 and .308 versions of the Survivor and there are probably more .45/.410 firearms out there that I'm not familiar with, however the Survivors are all single shot. EDIT: There's also the Rossi Circuit Judge:http://www.rossiusa.com/product-list.cfm?category=15 The bottom two models on the page can shoot both .410 and .45 Colt.)

-Or you can get look at a Henry Big Boy which comes in .44 Mag/.44 Special, .45 Colt, or .357 Magnum/.38 Special: http://henryrepeating.com/rifle-big-boy.cfm

You said that you have moderate shooting experience, but you may not know that .357 Magnum is essentially a stretched .38 Special. So, you can shoot .38 special in a .357 Magnum firearm, but not the other way around. I don't know anything about .44 Mag/.44 Special, but I think it's probably a similar relationship given the Big Boy rifle.

If you're looking for minimum investment, I would suggest a .45/.410 rifle with a .45 pistol or a .357 Mag Lever gun with a .38 pistol. The pistol calibers are proven and there are some .410 self defense loads out there.

 

[akv3g4n]

Ryanxia alerted me that the 7.62x54R ammo is still out there but has taken a little bit of a price hike in the last several weeks. Bummer.

Seems like all of the usual online retailers are temporarily out too..

 

[JustinJ]

Taking all the advice into account I think I will go to my local range and rent a few different pistols before making a decision.

You may want to get a good book or receive instruction from a qualified teacher before doing even that so that you will be able to know what fits your hand/shooting style best. For example, what part of the finger you use to pull the trigger makes a difference in what gun will fit your hand best.

 

[Divine Rights]

Wow, the wealth of knowledge here is greatly appreciated.

So far everything thinks it's a good idea to have a Ruger 10/22. I think it would be wise to own one regardless of my future plan to upgrade. Or perhaps I will get a S&W M&P 15-22? Might be a good training rifle until I can afford an AR-15.

My main focus is now on a pistol. I really like Springfield XD, S&W M&P, and Glock brands for handguns. I think I will try to rent an assortment of these brands in 9mm/.40/45acp and go from there.

Thanks again.

 

[benEzra]

What would you say is the best rifle round for range shooting or preparedness and what corresponding rifle would you suggest?

For those purposes, .223 Remington/5.56x45mm would be a great choice. It is great for range shooting---accurate, high velocity for flat trajectory, light recoiling, and (when the current demand surge subsides) one of the least expensive centerfire rifle calibers out there. Until last December, I could get Tula steel-case .223 plinking ammo at my local Walmart for $5/box. .223/5.56x45mm with good civilian JHP or SP is also one of the best home-defense calibers out there, offering good performance with less chance of exiting an exterior wall than most guns.

As far as what kind of rifle, I really like the AR-15 design. My own has a 16" barrel, midlength gas system, flattop upper receiver, adjustable stock, a configuration that is pretty good at both target shooting and defensive use. Unfortunately, AR's are pretty hard to find right now, but if you can wait, they are an excellent choice.

If you can't find an AR, my local Walmart had Sig 556's until the recent buying spree cleaned them out, and those piqued my interest. A basic Ruger mini-14 is a decent gun in the same caliber, but sighting and accessory options are more limited out of the box, and it is somewhat less accurate than an AR.

For even cheaper target shooting, you could pick up a detachable-magazine semiauto .22LR (e.g. Ruger 10/22, Remington 597). I am personally leaning toward picking up a 597 as it is reputed to be more accurate than an out-of-the-box 10/22, and you could pick up a few *quality* 30-round magazines for defensive purposes if you so choose. The only way to shoot more cheaply than .22LR is to shoot an airgun.

Whatever long gun you get, do think about getting a light for it at some point.

What type of pistol round would you recommend for home defense and what corresponding pistol would you recommend?

I strongly prefer 9mm. Performance with good JHP loads (I like Speer Gold Dot 124gr +P, but right now am carrying Hornady 135gr +P since that's all I can find) is almost as good as .40 or .45, with better capacity and less recoil, and practice is cheaper with 9mm than with .40 or .45.

If you're on a budget, the police-tradein Smith & Wesson 5906's are really good deals (I picked up one for $299 plus shipping) but if you have the funds then any midsize or full-size 9mm from a reputable manufacturer would be a good choice. If I were in the market for a new one, a Smith & Wesson M&P, Glock 17/19/34, or Springfield XD would be some options I'd lean toward, but there are many more. If you think you might want to get a carry license, you might consider a midsize pistol like the Glock 19 or similar.

Whatever you get, learn to shoot it well. Get a decent holster and a double mag carrier (I use a Bianchi holster, and mag carriers by Galco and Fobus) and a decent belt. Look up the closest IDPA or USPSA pistol matches near you and show up to one to see what it's like, then start shooting the matches for fun and practice.

Can you suggest an easily accessible and secure bed-side safe for a pistol?

I've heard a lot of people who like Gunvaults, but I've never personally used one.

If you're on a tight budget, something like this might work at a more affordable price:

http://www.walmart.com/ip/SentrySafe-Model-X031-Security-Safe/8251471?findingMethod=rr

 

[jim243]

Devine Rights, Welcome to THR.

Boy did you pick the wrong time to get into shooting. (LOL) Not so much the availability of firearms, but the lack of ammo. Things will get better in about 12 to 16 months or maybe sooner. We went trough this 4 years ago on BO's first election. We should have a big change in Congress with the 2014 elections, hopefully for the better.

But back to your question. From a ammo availability stand point, I would suggest that you get a pistol and rifle in the same caliber. Most available will be the 9mm. While not a hunting round for the rifle it is a good target round to 50 or 100 yards, for self defense it will do the job, if not the best out there (45 ACP would be my choice). But we are talking about general shooting. There are many good 9mm pistols out there and you should choose what works best for you. As to rifles in 9mm, I would recommend the Hi-Point 995 carbine. A lower cost rifle that can take you where you want to go for now. Another suggestion would be to look at the Hi-Point 9mm pistol, the advantage is that both the Hi-Point 9mm pistol and Hi-Point 995 carbine both use the same magazines (each comes with two of them). Finding magazines now is a PITA (pain, you fill in the rest)

Good luck and again welcome.
Jim

 

[Baldman]

Divine Rights,

As most have said there is a lot of personal preference on what weapons you buy along with exactly what you'll use them for. One idea that some folks like is to get a rifle and pistol in the same caliber (as jim243 said), an example would be in .357. You can pick up a 5 or 6 shot revolver (or more based on what you're looking to spend) and a lever action rifle. You can then share .38sp & .357 rounds for each. There are some limitations as the .357 in lever action doesn't have great range to (100 / 150) so if you're looking for something for a distance past that it would not be a good option. Again many good options not matter what caliber or type you pick, the best thing is once you get your guns becoem very familiar with them and practice. The "best" gun in the world won't do anything for you if you don't know how to use it effectively. Best of luck in your search and welcome aboard.

 

[c4v3man]

I'd highly recommend that you shoot a .40 prior to purchasing one. I've found the recoil to be snappier than 9mm/45acp. It's not a bad round, and if you go with a glock in .40, you can (with proper research) convert to 9mm for practice, so that's a plus.

 

[IdahoSkies]

I am going to go out a limb and say, take a look at a .357 revolver, like a Ruger GP-100 or Sp-101 (can use both .38 special and .357 rounds in it), both have a number of different barell lengths and .357 lever action carbine.

From a prepper perspective the .357 carbine gives you the ability to use the same ammunition in your pistol and your carbine, but the .357 round is a totally different beast in the carbine. It is powerful enough to take small and deer sized game, and .357 and .38 special are generally easy to find (especially now).

Guns are personal, but seriously take a look at this combination. I think it might fit your needs. (FYI I don't own either, but this for your stated needs and wants).

 

[9mmepiphany]

I am going to go out a limb and say, take a look at a .357 revolver, like a Ruger GP-100 or Sp-101 (can use both .38 special and .357 rounds in it), both have a number of different barell lengths and .357 lever action carbine.

That really isn't that far out, as it was common is the days of the Wild West, especially when you consider cost and functionality.

I have a Marlin 1894CB carbine with the longer octagon barrel that I can pair with my 2.5" M-66...you don't need much barrel, when you have a carbine too

I have a friend in the state who went as far as to mount a red dot on his Marlin lever gun, which he pairs with his GP-100

 

[Divine Rights]

It sounds like I've picked the absolutely worst time to get interested in shooting. Should I wait a few months (or a year?) to begin?

I may buy a Ruger 10/22, but otherwise I will wait for prices to drop a little and consider purchasing what I really want.

On to pistols, can anyone give me a quick rundown and maybe some pros/cons of the 9mm, the 45 ACP, and the .40 S&W? Before I go out and rent/try a few, It'd be interesting to know what the differences are. Im not very interested in revolvers.

One last thing, I want a full size pistol. Should I get a 4" or a 5"+ and what are the advantages to getting a longer one?

I understand a pistol is a very personal choice, but what brands and calibers do some of you prefer for pistols?

Again, thanks for all the help.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I had initially considered an XD 5.2" 45ACP, but a friend advised me to pick a smaller caliber for my first pistol. So I was considering the S&W M&P .40

From a recoil standpoint, the .40 actually kicks more than a .45 ACP. I know it doesn't seem like it should, but it does.

It sounds like I've picked the absolutely worst time to get interested in shooting. Should I wait a few months (or a year?) to begin?

True, your timing would ideally be a little better, but no, you should not wait to get started. There is no time like the present to take steps towards protecting yourself. There are still guns to be found at reasonable prices. Just the other day, there was a used Ruger P85 9mm in great condition at one of my local gun shops for $229. That just goes to show that deals can still be found.

On to pistols, can anyone give me a quick rundown and maybe some pros/cons of the 9mm, the 45 ACP, and the .40 S&W? Before I go out and rent/try a few, It'd be interesting to know what the differences are. Im not very interested in revolvers.

To tell you the truth, as far as effectiveness goes, I don't think there's nearly as much difference as people like to think. There are pros and cons however.
The 9mm pros are light recoil, high magazine capacity, and generally cheap ammo. (I know that really doesn't apply right now, but usually it does).
The .45 ACP has great knockdown power, but a con is less rounds. You go from 12-15 with the 9mm to 7-9 with the .45 ACP. Recoil is also greater than the 9mm.
The .40 is a great round IMO. It's what I have on the nightstand. I think it splits the difference between the other two. More power than a 9mm and more magazine capacity than a .45 ACP. However, on the con side, it recoils snappier than either of the two.
If you're recoil sensitive, I would go for the 9mm.

And o yeah. Welcome to THR.