Is AK47 number 1 assualt rifle around world?
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10-Ring
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Nice round, good performance & inexpensive platform -- seems like a very cost effective way to arm a military.
Prince Yamato
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I say yes. I think the line, "well, if it was so great, then why don't police and military use it in the USA" is kind of a false argument. I honestly believe the reason we don't use it is because of the Cold War stigma attached to it. I think if you equipped the entire US armed forces with Kalashnikov (47, 74, 105, dragunov) rifles, we'd have the same number of kills and relative same accuracy. I think most of our troops accuracy has to do with training and not the rifle. Personally, I'd feel just as safe and confident in their abilities if I was being defended by US troops with AKs as I would with ARs.
As for police. They're not going to take risky shots with rifles due to legal liability, so why are we spending $1000+ to give them Colt Commandos or HK entry guns when we could give them an AK for half price and get the same result? TS if it scares soccer moms. I can't imagine that an AK couldn't do the same job in a domestic room sweep that a $1000+ AR could. Accuracy beyone 200 yards wouldn't matter. And for those that consistantly shoot beyond 200 yards, spend the money you saved on AR-15s and get them a sniper rifle. I mean, for heaven's sake, they do room sweeps with shotguns. That's not a weapon used for pinpoint accuracy, why do the other guys get a bunch of expensive bullet hoses?
As for police. They're not going to take risky shots with rifles due to legal liability, so why are we spending $1000+ to give them Colt Commandos or HK entry guns when we could give them an AK for half price and get the same result? TS if it scares soccer moms. I can't imagine that an AK couldn't do the same job in a domestic room sweep that a $1000+ AR could. Accuracy beyone 200 yards wouldn't matter. And for those that consistantly shoot beyond 200 yards, spend the money you saved on AR-15s and get them a sniper rifle. I mean, for heaven's sake, they do room sweeps with shotguns. That's not a weapon used for pinpoint accuracy, why do the other guys get a bunch of expensive bullet hoses?
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General Geoff
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For the budget- and logistics- conscious person? Absolutely.
There are better "assault rifles" out there than the AK, but the AK will always be the benchmark by which they're measured.
There are better "assault rifles" out there than the AK, but the AK will always be the benchmark by which they're measured.
Don't Tread On Me
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I believe the AK-47 / AKM has been the most widely produced assault rifle in the world.
However, more nations use the M16.
That simply means that when militaries have the choice, they mostly go with the M16, even though the M16 is more than 3x the price of the AK. Now, why they do is another topic entirely. It also means that the AK-47 has been the tool of many non-uniformed combatants around the world. This great production of AK's had to be made for someone somewhere. They didn't make them for nothing.
The why of that is probably related to the low-cost of the AK above all else. No, I don't believe that the average insurgent/warlord/militaman/terrorist/guerrilla chooses the AK because they feel that it outperforms the M16 in field tests based on reliability, accuracy or effectiveness. Those issues are secondary. It's probably because the Russians and other former communist states will do anything for money and sell to anyone, whereas the West is a little more discriminating about their arms sales. It also has a lot to do with being $150 (if that) a pop vs. $600. You can arm 4 fighters with AKs for the cost of one M16. Those in charge of procurement and logistics are concerned with getting armed. They're not the types who have big military facilities with scientists and statisticians doing evaluations for years like we do. They don't have these luxuries of time and money.
Fortunately for the 3rd world unprofessional forces of the world - the AK turns out to be a damn fine assault rifle even by Western 1st world standards. They bought it for the availability and low cost, and it turns out they also get one of the best ever devised.
However, more nations use the M16.
That simply means that when militaries have the choice, they mostly go with the M16, even though the M16 is more than 3x the price of the AK. Now, why they do is another topic entirely. It also means that the AK-47 has been the tool of many non-uniformed combatants around the world. This great production of AK's had to be made for someone somewhere. They didn't make them for nothing.
The why of that is probably related to the low-cost of the AK above all else. No, I don't believe that the average insurgent/warlord/militaman/terrorist/guerrilla chooses the AK because they feel that it outperforms the M16 in field tests based on reliability, accuracy or effectiveness. Those issues are secondary. It's probably because the Russians and other former communist states will do anything for money and sell to anyone, whereas the West is a little more discriminating about their arms sales. It also has a lot to do with being $150 (if that) a pop vs. $600. You can arm 4 fighters with AKs for the cost of one M16. Those in charge of procurement and logistics are concerned with getting armed. They're not the types who have big military facilities with scientists and statisticians doing evaluations for years like we do. They don't have these luxuries of time and money.
Fortunately for the 3rd world unprofessional forces of the world - the AK turns out to be a damn fine assault rifle even by Western 1st world standards. They bought it for the availability and low cost, and it turns out they also get one of the best ever devised.
kcmarine
Member
Uhhh...
Sunray
Member
By definition, the AK is the only assault rifle in widespread use. Everything else, the M-16 family included, is a battle rifle.
Slvr Surfr
Member
To quote the movie "Lord of War"
Nicolas Cages character Yuri Orlav:
"Of all the weapons in the vast soviet arsenal, nothing was more profitable than Avtomat Kalashnikova model of 1947. More commonly known as the AK-47, or Kalashnikov. It's the world's most popular assault rifle. A weapon all fighters love. An elegantly simple 9 pound amalgamation of forged steel and plywood. It doesn't break, jam, or overheat. It'll shoot whether it's covered in mud or filled with sand. It's so easy, even a child can use it; and they do. The Soviets put the gun on a coin. Mozambique put it on their flag. Since the end of the Cold War, the Kalashnikov has become the Russian people's greatest export. After that comes vodka, caviar, and suicidal novelists. One thing is for sure, no one was lining up to buy their cars."
http://unimaps.com/flags-africa/mozambique-flag.gif
And my personal other favorite is from the movie "Jackie Brown"
Samuel Jackson's character Ordell Robie:
"AK-47. The very best there is. When you absolutely, positively got to kill every mother****er in the room, accept no substitutes."
Nicolas Cages character Yuri Orlav:
"Of all the weapons in the vast soviet arsenal, nothing was more profitable than Avtomat Kalashnikova model of 1947. More commonly known as the AK-47, or Kalashnikov. It's the world's most popular assault rifle. A weapon all fighters love. An elegantly simple 9 pound amalgamation of forged steel and plywood. It doesn't break, jam, or overheat. It'll shoot whether it's covered in mud or filled with sand. It's so easy, even a child can use it; and they do. The Soviets put the gun on a coin. Mozambique put it on their flag. Since the end of the Cold War, the Kalashnikov has become the Russian people's greatest export. After that comes vodka, caviar, and suicidal novelists. One thing is for sure, no one was lining up to buy their cars."
http://unimaps.com/flags-africa/mozambique-flag.gif
And my personal other favorite is from the movie "Jackie Brown"
Samuel Jackson's character Ordell Robie:
"AK-47. The very best there is. When you absolutely, positively got to kill every mother****er in the room, accept no substitutes."
WolfMansDad
Member
First, when units armed with M-16s engage units armed with AKs, the guys with the M-16s almost always win. You could argue that this is training, and a lot of it probably is. Nevertheless, it happens.
Second, inside the US, AR-pattern rifles vastly out-sell AK-pattern rifles. When people (Americans, at least) have the choice, they usually choose to spend more money and get the AR.
These two data points have to count for something. Sure, the AK is more numerous, but that doesn't mean it's better.
Second, inside the US, AR-pattern rifles vastly out-sell AK-pattern rifles. When people (Americans, at least) have the choice, they usually choose to spend more money and get the AR.
These two data points have to count for something. Sure, the AK is more numerous, but that doesn't mean it's better.
Prince Yamato
Member
I think that may have been true in the late 80s and early 90s, but I'd really beg to differ about that today. I'm not saying ARs aren't great guns, I'm just saying I think AKs have more appeal and I think the growing number of domestic AK manufacturers speaks volumes to the gun's popularity. If AKs weren't popular, then all we'd have would be WASRs. Instead we have VEPRs and Arsenals, as well as Lancasters and Vectors. In short, the variety runs the gamut. They're practical, they're functional, they're (contrary to rumor) accurate, and hell, they're sexy. Frankly, I think that makes them the "All American Rifle". ARs still tend to be too expensive for someone just starting out with firearms ownership. There is no WASR-level AR-15. And no, WASRs are not junk, but they're pretty much all function and little on the form.
xd9fan
Member
on numbers alone
BADUNAME13
Member
Umm, No.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_rifle
An assault rifle is a selective fire rifle or carbine firing ammunition with muzzle energies intermediate between those typical of pistol and battle rifle ammunition. Assault rifles are categorized between light machine guns, intended more for sustained automatic fire in a support role, and submachine guns, which fire a handgun cartridge rather than a rifle cartridge. Assault rifles are the standard small arms in most modern armies, having largely replaced or supplemented larger, more powerful battle rifles, such as the World War II-era M1 Garand and Tokarev SVT. Examples of assault rifles include the AK-47 and the M16 rifle. Semi-automatic rifles, including commercial versions of the AR-15, and "automatic" rifles limited to firing single shots are not assault rifles as they are not selective fire. Belt-fed weapons or rifles with very limited capacity fixed magazines are also generally not considered assault rifles.
The M16's all over cause the US Gov't GIVES them away...
DMK
Member
I'd love to hear the explanation for that.Sunray said:
DMK
Member
As far as I know only Yugoslavian AKs hold the bolt open on the last round. And that requires special Yugo mags at that. It would work with a semi-auto converted Yugo AK too if built properly.
Prince Yamato
Member
Actually, any AK will do that with a Yugo mag. Just look for the mags with the rib on the back and two small lines (as opposed to 2.5) above the floorplate = Yugo mag. Has the bolt catch on the follower.
MisterPX
Member
Choice
The number one choice would have been the FAL, adopted (and paid for) by a whole lotta countires. The AK was distibuted, sometimes for free, and adopted by a handful of countries. Would you rather arm your outfit with $500 rifles, or free ones? Especially when you don't have any money.
The number one choice would have been the FAL, adopted (and paid for) by a whole lotta countires. The AK was distibuted, sometimes for free, and adopted by a handful of countries. Would you rather arm your outfit with $500 rifles, or free ones? Especially when you don't have any money.
nvshooter
member
I think so, in terms of sheer numbers produced. I was at the NRA museum in Fairfax, Va about a month ago. The info on the gun says that easily 100 million of them have been produced by various countries in various designs. Too bad most of them weren't made here and put into the hands of US citizens...
sfmittels
Member
Clearly, the AR is by far the more "elegant" weapon. It's got more accuracy and significantly greater flexibility to be configured for a variety of missions. We Americans like our elegance.
That said, the AK will send a 123-grain 7.62 slug down the barrel every time the trigger is pulled. Parts tolerances are so loose that you can create a Frankengun, mixing parts made in a dozen different countries. And it will still shoot. Beat it, whip it, kick it, drive over it, it will still shoot. Required training time is zilch. No, it's not terribly accurate, especially the many Frankenguns that are out there.
So, which is better? It depends on whether you're outfitting a trained, professional army that will train with and maintain the weapon; or whether you're outfitting a bunch of villagers who are intended to be cannon fodder anyway - they can spray and pray all day, and once in a while they'll hit something if the volume of fire and ammo supply is adequate.
That said, the AK will send a 123-grain 7.62 slug down the barrel every time the trigger is pulled. Parts tolerances are so loose that you can create a Frankengun, mixing parts made in a dozen different countries. And it will still shoot. Beat it, whip it, kick it, drive over it, it will still shoot. Required training time is zilch. No, it's not terribly accurate, especially the many Frankenguns that are out there.
So, which is better? It depends on whether you're outfitting a trained, professional army that will train with and maintain the weapon; or whether you're outfitting a bunch of villagers who are intended to be cannon fodder anyway - they can spray and pray all day, and once in a while they'll hit something if the volume of fire and ammo supply is adequate.
TimboKhan
Member
Nope. Not even close. The AK is used by several larger nations, and virtually every backwater s-hole uses them almost exclusively. The AK-47 is hands down the most prolific battle/assault rifle ever created and issued.
Well, if my roommate had wings, he could fly. The question wasn't what they wanted, it's what is. The FAL was at no point in it's history more prolific as a issued rifle than the AK.
MisterPX
Member
The OP was CHOICE, if you can't afford something, you don't have much of a choice. Did all these 3rd world countries say "we WANT AK's', or did they just take their only option, free ones?
TimboKhan
Member
Well, Russia obviously chose it, and my guess is that if Russia chose it, a lot of other countries actively chose it as well. Whether the thing was free or not is sort of immaterial, because cost obviously has some bearing on what a country will choose. If M-4's cost $350,000.00 dollars apiece, we would still be using M16A2's. Anyway, cost, reliability, ammo availability, and ability to get large numbers of weapons easily all lead me to say that the AK is still the king of the hill. I don't buy that certain countries had only one option. Maybe they excercised the free option, but I guarantee that they could have gotten "better" weapons if they really wanted them. Heck, there are civilians in this country who can afford any gun they want that choose the AK.
cracked butt
Member
Number 1 assault rifle?
Number 1 assault rifle found in the hands of dead soldiers/insurgents maybe.
Number 1 assault rifle found in the hands of dead soldiers/insurgents maybe.
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