I like both, but is the hi-power an improvement over his 1911 design? Disregard the cartridge it's chambered for, 45acp vs 9mm. If the hi-power is a fundamentally better design, then why are the 1911's so popular? Almost every major manufacturer makes a 1911. Why is the hi-power not as successful as the 1911?
Browning experts chime in.
I wonder what Browning himself would say?
Thanks in advance.
The BHP and the 1911 were both contract guns. When he designed them he was not looking to create a gun solely based on his own personal preferences he was working to meet a spec that was presented to him. You have to understand the world that JMB was working in when he designed the 1911 and the BHP. The 1911 is a Colt because it was Colt who contracted with JMB to design a gun for the Army pistol trials started in 1907 and completed in 1911 JMB was hired to meet the design spec and requirements of the 1907 pistol trials.
Colt and FN had a special relationship with JMB. R. Blake Stevens explains it nicely in the first chapter of his book "The Browning High Power Automatic" In July of 1896 the Browning Bros granted exclusive rights to Colt to manufacture use and sell within the US, Great Britain, Ireland all automatic pistols and their improvements designed by JMB.
In July of 1897 the same rights were granted to FN To se ll in Austria-Hungry, Spain, Belgium, France, Germany and everywhere else not covered by the Colt agreement. This was done because Colt and FN saw each JMB pistol as a leap forward in design and function. Each design was considered a better mouse trap and Colt and FN knew it was better to divide the JMB world between each other then fight over it. A contract to this effect was signed in July of 1912. The exact details of the contract can be found in the Stevens book but I will highlight a few details.
-Colts are to mark their Pistols as "Colt Automatic Pistols" and FN as "Browning Automatic Pistols."
-Colt agrees to maintain in force American and British Patents, and FN maintains all European contracts.
-The contract was for 5 years with 5 year extensions.
So in reality the 1911 was built for Colt to meet the US Army's spec just as the BHP was build to meet the French Spec. These pistols were contract guns. If the French wanted pink grips JMB would have built it with pink grips. The US Army wanted a thumb safety so JMB put a thumb safety on it. The original BHP mag was designed by Saive JMB did not believe that the "capacity" was needed in a side arm but the French wanted a high capacity pistol so JMB made one. It was not about what he wanted it was about what the contract said. JMB was a contractor who would be paid a royalty from Colt and FN. He was never a employee of either company.
One can argue that the 1911 is not JMBs most famous design but it is certainly his most popular design in the US. We tend to be a little US centric and consider what we think of as the most famous to be the case internationally. I believe the 1911 is his most famous pistol design inside the US but the BHP has sold more units world wide when you consider the number of military contracts FN had at one time.
I know this will come as a shock to many and many will disagree but the FN Hi Power was not designed by JMB. It was designed by Saive. JMB's last pistol design was IMHO the Grand Rendement not the gun which was named the FN Browning High Power Automatic Pistol AKA P35, Browning Hi Power, Grande Puissance etc...
The Grand Rendement:
Repost of Submoa's comments on the subject which I believe nail it. He is a member here and one of the most knowledgeable BHP shooters I have had the pleasure to meet on the forums.
The pistol we know as the BHP was created by Saive after JMBs death in 1926. Saive at the direction of FN took up the abandoned pistol project after the French started to drag their feet. He started with a clean slate using the magazine he designed for the Grand Rendement and built a new pistol using his own ideas and incorporating many of JMBs design concepts IMHO.
"The only salient features of JMB's original locked breech design of 1922 that made it to the actual BHP pistol are the barrel lock-up everyone seems to like, the multi-articulated trigger everyone seems to dislike...and of course the signature “High Capacity” magazine. Remember though, Dieudonné Joseph Saive designed/prototyped...and forwarded to JMB, the staggered column/single feed “High Capacity” magazine JMB subsequently used in that 1922 design. And though important…and perhaps not so important , design features such as the lock-up and trigger linkage…even taken together, do not a legendary pistol make.
JMB's original 1922 locked breech prototype...again, using the DJS magazine design, was delivered to FN by JMB's son Val…along with a near identical blowback prototype which FN immediately dismissed. The remaining pistol was a large/heavy, hammerless/striker fired, cylindrical interrupted screw-modular/removable breech bolt design in which the slide reciprocated within the frame (a' la CZ75), with a sliding safety catch situated at the rear face of the slide (a' la...position wise if not operation wise, HK P30) and no external slide lock...it even lacked the signature “BHP cut” at the front of the slide. With Val’s input, FN immediately modified the JMB 1922 locked breech design and produced a pair of tool room pistols to be used for the French Military Trials of 1922. The FN tool room design drawings for this 1922 FN improved JMB pistol became the US Patent drawings JMB submitted in 1923…which weren’t approved until 1927. Immediately following the "promising" initial 1922 French Trials…in which Val assisted FN’s Captain Chevalier, FN undertook major design modifications in an effort to satisfy the next…and subsequent, French Trials. While this design evolved, improved and got smaller/lighter in efforts to satisfy the French...it even got a hammer, it retained the complicated cylindrical interrupted screw-modular/removable breech bolt design, the slide still reciprocated within the frame, the sliding safety catch situated at the rear face of the slide remained and there was no external slide lock. It did get a new name though; "Grand Rendement", BUT it still operated like the FN improved JMB 1922 design.
Now here is where...though fully documented, the direct lineage of the BHP gets "blurred":
Eventually, tiring of the obvious French run around, FN finally instructed DJS to design a 9mmP service pistol intended for the wider Military market…over a year after JMB’s 1926 death. DJS took elements of JMB's 1922 design…along with the many subsequent FN/Saive improvements, elements of JMB's 1911 design, of course DJS’s own design ideas…and a healthy dose of "start with a relatively clean slate…if the French like it fine but if they don’t screw ‘em”, to come up with the “Saive/Browning 1928” design…the actual direct ancestor of the BHP we know today. This was the first design that mimicked...mechanically, practically, size, contour, profile, operation and appearance wise, the BHP we know today. Have a look at the Grand Rendement of 1927 v. the Saive/Browning of 1928...then compare the Saive/Browning of 1928 with the BHP. (ADD: For a real moment compare the original prototype JMB designed...and his brother Ed machined, and Val brought to FN with a BHP)
