DocRock
member
And ditto @dogtown tom
Yet, as I demonstrated with the similar situation on vehicle sales tax in Colorado, all it takes is a challenge. If you act like doormat, you will be treated like one.
Is FFL required to collect sales tax on out of state purchase?
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And ditto @dogtown tom
Yet, as I demonstrated with the similar situation on vehicle sales tax in Colorado, all it takes is a challenge. If you act like doormat, you will be treated like one.
dogtown tom
Member
No sir, it takes a successful challenge......which hasn't happened. You can pontificate all day long about doormats, what the law should be, the ultra vires of tax codes and other sillyness.... but as long as the law is on the books.........IT'S THE LAW whether we like it or not.
cjwils
Member
https://www.nmsd.wednet.edu/userfil...le & Purchasing/Use Tax Guidelines.pdf?id=901
Washington state use tax is supposed to be paid on any purchase that a Washington resident makes anywhere, when that item enters the state, unless full Washington sales tax has been paid. Most people never pay on most items, but with guns they have you over a barrel, because you cannot avoid the state paperwork at the time of transfer.
Washington state use tax is supposed to be paid on any purchase that a Washington resident makes anywhere, when that item enters the state, unless full Washington sales tax has been paid. Most people never pay on most items, but with guns they have you over a barrel, because you cannot avoid the state paperwork at the time of transfer.
dogtown tom
Member
No, it didn't.
The sale or purchase may have occurred in Colorado, but the transfer could not take place in Colorado...........because California prohibits out of state transfers to their residents.
Riomouse911
Member
Man, when folks try to apply their local rules to other places they just don’t get it.
Here in Ca, you won’t get your transferred firearm from the FFL unless the tax is paid, either to the original seller or to the FFL doing the transfer. Since every private party or original purchase gun transfer must go through a FFL, they have to collect the sales tax (if the seller didn’t) or they will get zoinked by the state and lose their license to conduct business.
The State controls who actually gets to walk away with the gun even though many think it’s strictly the feds. Some states have more restrictive laws than others, and those jurisdictions have set their rules. Those rules may not apply to you, but they apply to us.
If you have standing and want to litigate it, feel free to file suit. I’ll even take the time to file an amicus brief on your behalf.
Stay safe.
Here in Ca, you won’t get your transferred firearm from the FFL unless the tax is paid, either to the original seller or to the FFL doing the transfer. Since every private party or original purchase gun transfer must go through a FFL, they have to collect the sales tax (if the seller didn’t) or they will get zoinked by the state and lose their license to conduct business.
The State controls who actually gets to walk away with the gun even though many think it’s strictly the feds. Some states have more restrictive laws than others, and those jurisdictions have set their rules. Those rules may not apply to you, but they apply to us.
If you have standing and want to litigate it, feel free to file suit. I’ll even take the time to file an amicus brief on your behalf.
Stay safe.
George P
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NOW they do, correct. It wasn't THAT long ago - (or my old age and time references are going) when you could. When I lived in northern NV, we had a great gun show in the Reno area where dealers and buyers came from all over the West. A LOT of buyers were from CA who bought their long guns and went home with them.
Riomouse911
Member
Because the Reno sellers let them leave with them, in Nv that was ok. Ca made it illegal to private party purchase all guns many years ago, so returning to Ca with such a gun is a crime for the person bringing it into the state.
Now all FTF sales classified ads I see in Nv require a Nv issued ID card for the buyers, sellers won’t private party sell to Ca residents.
Stay safe.
Now all FTF sales classified ads I see in Nv require a Nv issued ID card for the buyers, sellers won’t private party sell to Ca residents.
Stay safe.
dogtown tom
Member
Since 1968's Gun Control Act it has been illegal for nonlicensed residents of different states to buy/sell/trade firearms without involving a licensed dealer.
George P
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I
don't recall it being THAT many years ago, but then, as I said, when you get older, perspectives of time change
DocRock
member
You are correct. However, that is not the assertion of those who support CA’s illegal effort to get FFLs to tax farm on behalf of the state.
DocRock
member
If CA does not collect CA sales tax, in addition to CO sales tax, then CA has recognized that the transaction was completed in CO. Therefore, CA cannot force FFLs to tax farm on their behalf in transactions to which they were not a party.
DocRock
member
Are you a CA department of revenue employee, a CA state official, or just a dude who has painted himself into a corner and has ego investment?
CA is acting illegally. I have demonstrated that fact. A state could pass a law (and CA has not passed a law authorizing sales tax collection by a non-engaged party, this is regulatory guidance by the state) tomorrow allowing slavery. It would not however be legal. If you wish to be treated like a doormat, you will be. If you wish to be subject to illegal regulatory guidance, you may.
dogtown tom
Member
Nope. I'm an FFL in Texas. Even a 3rd grader could have figured that out by reading my sig line.
The only thing you've demonstrated is an inability to comprehend what you've read. You seem to believe that because YOU believe that CA regulation to be illegal regulatory guidance that makes it so. Again, move your law practice to Cali, they need someone with your legal knowledge.
Anyone who reads this thread can choose to read the WA & CA tax codes or follow the advice of some guy in Colorado that thinks he knows what legal and whats not.
dogtown tom
Member
No, he's not correct. While the sale may have been finalized in Colorado, the transfer cannot legally be completed in Colorado. If you knew one shred of Federal law you would know why this is.
But keep digging your hole of derp.
"Those"? Be specific when making an accusation.
Who in this thread supports CA tax codes? No one has written any such thing.
I don't agree with the USSC decision in South Dakota vs Wayfair either.
DocRock
member
@dogtown tom , you are dug in and ego-invested. Your're wrong and I've demonstrated why you are wrong to accept CA's illegal enforcement in requiring persons who are not party to a transaction to collect sales tax for them. Places like CA are the way they are because people like you let them get away with these things. Rant on and enjoy. Stay well.
dogtown tom
Member
I could say the same thing about you.
You confuse knowledge of a states laws with agreement. I've posted links to current CA & WA laws that clearly show what those states require of licensed dealers.
Your argument of "You're wrong" is factually incorrect. It isn't my opinion, I justed posted the actual tax codes. Now, do I believe you are wrong? Heck yeah, you aren't an attorney and your "thems illegal laws!" rant doesn't help anyone. Anyone taking your advice may find it pretty darn expensive.
People like me? Dude, I'm not in California, I'm in Texas. I don't have much authority to make California behave any more than I do Colorado. You know....Colorado with its magnificent Governor and state legislature and mag bans. WHERE YOU LIVE.
Elkins45
Member
Does anybody really think a behemoth company like eBay (in California) would be collecting and forwarding Kentucky state tax on the sale of a $2.99 widget from some guy in New Jersey unless their lawyers told them they had to?
Get this straight. Your opinion that California (or any other State) is acting illegally means exactly squat. No one cares what you think, and the world will continue to go about its business without regard to your opinions.
No you have not. The only way to do so that could possibly matter would be to cite a decision of a court of appeal specifically ruling that what California is doing is illegal. Your opinion on the question is meaningless.
Now drop the subject.
Insignificant bill
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Huh? 1968 was a really long while ago.
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Insignificant bill
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Dude just stop
wbbh
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PSA: Know the laws in YOUR state. FFL businesses would be wise to consult a tax lawyer or an accountant so they know what the requirements are for their individual state. "Internet lawyers" will not argue your case in court or when the tax officials come asking questions.
Steel Horse Rider
Member
As was stated early on in this thread, the South Dakota vs Wayfair decision had a huge impact on sales tax collections. It created a nightmare for my office manager in her monthly sales tax reports as we now have to file a report for every taxing entity in Colorado that we work in, which extends from Denver to the Wyoming border and from Walden to the Nebraska border. If you do sell to someone in any taxing area you are required to collect and remit the tax. What a pain....
Kevin Rohrer
Member
Not in Ohio
George P
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That would depend on who the seller is; example: If I buy a gun online from the Cabela's library, I will be charged sales tax for Florida - even though there are zero Cabela's in Florida. Why? Because their new parent company, BASS Pro DOES have stores here.
When my wife buys something from Amazon, we pay sales tax because Amazon has distribution centers here in Florida
Your statement may be correct in some instances and not in others; it is too "broad-brushed" to be stated empirically as a total fact.
Some states have passed various laws in this regard in an effort to accumulate the lost sales tax revenue. Before the explosion of the internet, interstate "catalog" sales really didn't amount to a lot compared to in-state retail sales, so no one pursued them. Now, states are losing millions and they want that money for their special pet programs so laws have been passed in an attempt to capture those funds.
Most states have a state-level sales tax, then allow counties and cities to add another percentage for local use. I feel sorry for some companies if they have to collect, and remit, any and all of the various amounts prevalent around a particular state as opposed to the base state sales/use tax.
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