Is having a 223 and 243 Redundent

[mdchambe]

Thanks for the help everyone. After reading people's thoughts and the discussion of potential barrel wear (which I don't think will be an issue for me given the number of rounds it might take to take place and the number i expect to fire annually) I went ahead and purchased the rifle.

It is a Kimber 84m Classic. Cant wait to get it. Pictures look like it has really nice wood and got it NIB for $800 shipped, which appears to be a pretty good price.

Thanks all for your help! Now on to bases and glass.

 

[KodiakBeer]

Kimber makes a fine rifle and I'm sure you'll be very happy with it, and your kids too!

Federal Premium makes a 100 grain Nosler Partition that I've found to be just deadly on deer. That's the partition, not the Nosler ballistic tip.

Between my son and myself I've seen at least a hundred deer taken down with that 100 grain partition, and it just doesn't fail at any range. Take that for what it's worth!

 

[Bluehawk]

Maverick I never said anything about .22 LR...we are/were discussing centerfire cartridges and was referring to such when I mentioned high velocity....and you had to know that.
If you are truly concerned with barrel erosion use single base powders and back off slightly from max loads...it's all so easy!!!!!!
So far I haven't seen one iota of proof that a .243/6mm is a barrel burner!!!! The OP's intent of questioning, if I'm correct, was not anything to do with formal target shooting, but with redundancy and it seems that has been answered.
Concerning overbored cartridges...that is neither a scientific nor true technical term and according to definitions of it, almost any cartridge can be considered over bored depending on the powder used. (not my words...comes from a Speer manual) Now them I believe!

 

[Zak Smith]

FWIW, I use the term "overbore" for relative comparison, IE, X is more overbore than Y is shorthand for X has a higher case capacity to bore area ratio than Y.

 

[Bluehawk]

why not make it simpler and show the numbers?
Pi X Radius/squared X barrel length vs. volume of burning gases of ignited powder in cartridge.
The problem is you can't show the gas numbers unless you have the proper measuring equipment! I don't have that, do you? So who determines what overbored is??

 

[Float Pilot]

Most simply put, the 243 will do anything the .223 can do and then some. The .223 cannot do all the 243 can...

 

[Zak Smith]

The problem is you can't show the gas numbers unless you have the proper measuring equipment! I don't have that, do you? So who determines what overbored is??

So because we can't directly measure every physical cause contributing the effect, the concept of the qualitative difference is invalid? I somehow don't follow that logic.

The first step in making a predictive model is making qualitative statements like: When I increase input X, then output Y goes up/goes down/doesn't change.

Throat wear is caused by high pressure and temperature applied over a time period. We know the general conditions that cause high pressure and what causes the "high pressure" portion of the burn curve to be sustained longer, or peak and fall quicker. A more "overbore" cartridge (using my shorthand from prior post) causes more throat wear than a "less overbore" cartridge for these reasons.

 

[KodiakBeer]

If it has averaged 100 rounds a year for 35 years since then, that'd be 4000 rounds total. If it shot "an inch" 10 years ago (ie around 3000 rounds) but it's now at 1.5 MOA, that's well within the criteria I listed-

It was always at 1 1/2" or so with hunting loads. I've been shooting the 100 grain partitions (sometimes store bought, sometimes handloaded) since at least the early 90's. The better groups were when I was playing around with target loads - not that I was ever a serious match shooter. I haven't done that for a long while, but there's been no change in the hunting loads. They always grouped that way, and that's plenty good enough for hunting at any range the .243 is capable of.

I do take your point that over time a rifle will erode the throat and become less accurate. And I believe you that a .243 is more prone to that, for the reasons you've stated. But, let's just agree that in case of a deer rifle, it shouldn't be of any concern.

 

[jmr40]

Quote

Most simply put, the 243 will do anything the .223 can do and then some. The .223 cannot do all the 243 can...

This is true. If he already had a 243 and wanted to step down and add another rifle in 223 most people would say it was redundant.

But he already has a 223. Moving up .44mm in bore size is a baby step up in performance. I have nothing against the 243, but there is not enough gain in performance to have 2 rifles so similar.

It's not that I underestimate the 243's performance, I feel that many underestimate what the 223 will do with good bullets.

 

[Maverick223]

After reading people's thoughts and the discussion of potential barrel wear (which I don't think will be an issue for me given the number of rounds it might take to take place and the number i expect to fire annually) I went ahead and purchased the rifle.

Sounds like you made a good choice, most folks will never notice the wear when used for hunting. Don't forget to add pics when it arrives.

why not make it simpler and show the numbers?
Pi X Radius/squared X barrel length vs. volume of burning gases of ignited powder in cartridge.
The problem is you can't show the gas numbers unless you have the proper measuring equipment! I don't have that, do you? So who determines what overbored is??

So because you don't understand it, or haven't the tools to directly measure it...it can't exist...yep, that makes sense.

But, let's just agree that in case of a deer rifle, it shouldn't be of any concern.

Yep, agreed 100%.

 

[tactikel]

Much wisdon in the above posts, there is overlap in .223 and .243- The .243 is dyamite on varmints (coyotes). As far as deer it will take any deer in Iowa at reasonable ranges. If you are not recoil sensitive IMHO a .25-06, 260 Rem, or a .270 would be great choices. If you stumble across one of those monster Whitetails Iowa seems to churn out (I lived in central Ia for 5 years), or you need to tag one across a 400 yard cornfield in a stiff wind you will really appreciate the heavier bullet. Paramount is you ability to hit-If you have any problems with recoil - you cannot go wrong with a .243.

 

[Art Eatman]

See Post #51.