Is majoring in Mechanical Engineering in attempt to design firearms unrealistic?

[TMiller556]

I have always been interested in designing firearms as a career, mainly due to my fascination with the inner workings and operations of them. In addition, I've always had the ability to grasp mechanical concepts.

My question is: Is majoring in ME simply to try to land a job in firearm design for a manufacturer an unrealistic goal? I know with the current economic situation as well as many other factors, the likelihood is slim.

I am interested in the discipline of Mechanical Engineering itself. However, I honestly wouldn't enjoy the majority of careers that the degree leads to.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

[fallingbird]

I would think that a degree in ME could land you a job basically anywhere on earth, if your primary goal didn't pan out.

 

[BradN]

I would try to contact designers at modern day firearms manufacturers and ask which educational/trade course they would suggest. Perhaps you could offer to intern for one of them.

I would also search out biographical information on Browning, Pedersen, Garand, Stoner, Ruger, and Glock (for example) and see what their backgrounds were.

Good luck!

 

[Lex Luthier]

That is awesome. You could also get your J.D. after all the math classes and become a patent attorney. Good luck.

 

[carbine85]

I would think that a degree in ME could land you a job basically anywhere on earth, if your primary goal didn't pan out.

What he said.
I would think you could pick and choose a few directions to go in with a ME Degree.

 

[USAF_Vet]

Fundamental firearms design hasn't changed much in a long time. It doesn't seem likely too, either. I suppose you could go work for KelTec and design their latest vaporware.

I don't know, spending a lot of time, effort and money on what is essentially a pipe dream doesn't jive with me. But, you could go work for any number of different corporations as an ME.

 

[Big Mike]

I would think that a degree in ME could land you a job basically anywhere on earth, if your primary goal didn't pan out.

^This. Almost a win/win career choice. Good luck!

 

[LeonCarr]

Engineers in virtually all disciplines are in very high demand right now with some starting salaries near six figures with a Bachelor's Degree.

Do it.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

 

[Sniper66]

I would encourage you to keep your options open and try to visit with as many gun companies as you can. I was an executive recruiter for a few years and learned that companies welcome enthusiastic and curious inquiries. Some have programs that offer training and education in exchange for future commitments. You may discover, after spending some time with a company, that your vision changes slightly or significantly. You may also decide that getting the degree is the most important first step. You could also get some training in gunsmithing.

 

[vamo]

To echo previous comments engineers are in very high demand in the professional world, if you could not get a job at a gun company you would still be well positioned for a successful career. There is a general perception that somebody with an engineering degree can do basically any job.

 

[barnbwt]

Firearms are extremely simple machines; basically single-piston engines without the complication of a driveshaft . Their manufacture is what's complicated. An engineering degree, honestly, is overkill for mere gun design; engineering as we know it now didn't exist when most designs we use today were perfected, and hundreds of self-taught inventors and machinists design and build excellent weapons everyday. Check any gun building forum for examples. But making designs that can be mass-produced cheaply and effectively while satisfying customer needs is what engineering is all about.

That said, a Mechanical Engineering degree is about the broadest type of engineering qualification there is, and can get you entry into any field requiring design, manufacture, optimization, or maintenance (pretty much everything). I would think that if you wish to end up designing firearms (or ultimately managing those who do), you'll need a good background in mechanical design (from the degree), machine work (from extra-curricular experience in a shop), as well as knowledge in the field of marketing, so you can effectively pitch your ideas and contributions. Ironically, those attributes (plus some courses in business management) are basically what you need to strike out on your own.

If you go to work in any organization where you will be responsible only for part of the process, you will find "design" and "engineering" are two different things. In a field as competitive and non-innovative as firearms (by which I mean there are few new products that can't be directly compared to old ones), I imagine the marketing guys are the primary drivers of design goals, while the technical guys' job is to figure out how to produce that design fast and cheap enough. Try to determine if you have a preference for either (there's plenty of creativity in both, but different kinds, and there is much wider need for the latter).

With the massive sustained increase in demand for guns (and ammo), there's a lot of shops trying to tool up for expanded production right now. If you can convince them you're qualified to help with that (degree or otherwise), that's your "in". Good luck.

TCB
--BS Aerospace Engineering

PS-most mechanically minded guys are drawn to firearms, but I think it's more because they are the last remaining purely mechanical system around anymore, than because the design challenges themselves are anything particularly special.

 

[rockhopper46038]

As an ME myself, I can tell you that the course of study can lead you to a wide variety of opportunities. To your original question; I don't see why not. Wilson Combat has/had a posting for a mechanical engineer either last week or the week before. Of course if we don't get our <deleted> together politically, there may not be any firearms manufacturers operating in the US in 4 years. The current Bozo in office is going to try at least one more bite at that apple before he leaves, and the Bozette that is most likely to be our next President (if the press has anything to say about it, and they do) will give banning firearms a go as well.

 

[119er]

I am in my third semester heading towards a bachelor's in ME. I have always had an interest in, and have been proficient with mechanical things my whole life. I'm 31 and starting has been easy except for a few mathematical concepts that I lost through the years but they're coming back.

To your point, you really can't go wrong with engineering. I have seen that there are a lot of younger(not implying you are) people not willing to put in the effort to earn this degree. Therefore, the job is in high demand and is being filled by immigrants that have the education. I work with ME's and I can tell you that if ME is your thing there will be no shortage of things to become interested in. I find myself being pulled towards ICE's and gas turbines currently. Very interesting.

Just go do it and your goals will adapt. It will change the way you see the world around you!

 

[Reloadron]

I am interested in the discipline of Mechanical Engineering itself.

I just retired from over 40 years in Electrical Engineering and if I had it to do all over again I would have went the ME route. I always enjoyed working with our ME group and there is always a high demand for good mechanical engineers.

While designing guns can be a nice touch if I were you I would just focus on mechanical engineering and let the cards as to specialty fall where they may.

Ron

 

[gym]

Coming from that background myself, working under my dad in a defense plant that did subcontracting work for every major aircraft manufacturer. I think you better really like the job description and be good at math and disciplined when it comes to studying "hitting the books", in order to get a degree in electromechanical, or Mechanical engineering first.
The takeaway I get is you like designing guns. This is not really what a mechanical engineer does. Perhaps a designer or part of a design team for a large company might be what you are looking for. The principal of how a gun works is pretty basic. Unless you come up with a new way to change the way guns work entirely it's just a matter of enhancing what is already there.IE: the Rhino.
I think you like the idea of designing more than engineering.

 

[Mike OTDP]

ME is fine. That being said, I'd start contacting everybody in the industry - not just the normal small arms makers, but the manufacturers of heavy ordnance and accessories - and the agencies that buy the firepower. Watervliet Arsenal. Aberdeen Proving Grounds. Etc. Get a co-op job if you can, it's a tremendous edge.

 

[230RN]

barnbwt said,

Firearms are extremely simple machines; basically single-piston engines without the complication of a driveshaft . Their manufacture is what's complicated. An engineering degree, honestly, is overkill for mere gun design; engineering as we know it now didn't exist when most designs we use today were perfected, and hundreds of self-taught inventors and machinists design and build excellent weapons everyday.

Agreed. That's where I was headed in this thread.

"Designing" a small part of a product like the dovetail in a rear sight is relatively simple, which is probably a good example of the kinds of tasks you'll be assigned at first.

You specify depths, angles, tolerances, from some other designer's drawing of the rear sight itself.

But getting all those simple dimensions and cuts into a smooth production process is what's hard. Especially when it is discovered that the heating of the slide (or whatever) from the cutting disrupts the angles and tolerances you specified and pressing in the sight has to wait until a later step, after the slide cools.

Otherwise the sight either can't be pressed in easily on the production floor, or the sight falls out after the product gets out the door. (Just an imaginative rhetorical example, but stuff like that happens.)

Terry

 

[Guns&Religion]

Here is a link to the Ruger Website regarding employment
http://www.ruger.com/footer/employment.html

They want engineers and technicians.

I say go for it, if that stuff interests you.

 

[Officers'Wife]

Perhaps, many will tell you that firearms are simple machines that hardly need an engineer to design and they would be correct. However, the machines needed to mass produce them are complicated and always have room for improvement. A rifling lathe alone will send quivers of ecstasy down the spine of even the most blase OMB.

Item last, of the chem eng, com eng and mech eng types I went to school with very few of them are working the industry they had planned on. But to a person they are all working.

 

[hey.moe]

If the only reason for pursuing a degree in ME is to work as a firearms designer, I think you'd be spending a lot of time and money hoping for an outcome with a low probability of success. On the other hand, if you constantly find yourself wondering what makes things tick, and would be willing to consider using the degree in other ways, I think you'd find it's a fascinating field with wide applications and almost limitless possibilities.

Now, if you were to get hired by a firearms manufacturer in some other capacity and convince the company to send you to engineering school ...

-Stan-

 

[ugaarguy]

It's not overkill, and it is in fact one of the best ways to work your way up to being a gun designer. We have a member here who has done exactly that. In the interest of maintaining his privacy I'll leave it at that unless he wants to comment on it further.

 

[double bogey]

My industry (hvac) employs a lot of ME's. Large contractors use them for everything from system design, to project management.

 

[gearhead]

While there probably aren't more than a few hundred engineers working in the American firearms industry nowdays it's safe to say that if you DON'T become an engineer you won't ever get the opportunity.

I earned my ME degree 30 years ago, I've designed and helped put products ranging from Naval warships to electric power tools to household appliances to gasoline dispensers to, yes, firearms into production. If you enjoy knowing WHY things work rather than just working on things, if you love finding better ways to do something, if you aren't afraid to tackle challenges that appear to be impossible then you might make a good ME.

Take every opportunity to get practical, hands-on experience while in school and be willing to take jobs not necessarily in your area of experience if they involve the same skills you will need if an opportunity in firearms presents itself later. Tight tolerance machining, design of complex injection molded plastic parts, project planning, and testing are skills that will be very helpful. If you really want to improve your chances you can identify the largest firearms manufacturers and see who hires the most entry-level ME graduates and enroll in a university where those manufacturers recruit heavily.

 

[eldon519]

I'm an ME. As stated, I don't know how much engineering is really required for a lot of small arms designs these days, but it if you also have interest in things like cannons, missiles, bombs, tanks, aircraft, UAVs, jet engines, etc, there is plenty you could work on. I don't know how much things like small arms will evolve, but something like a rail gun...there will definitely be MEs working on that project.

ME is kind of the jack-of-all-trades engineering degree. There are all kinds of things you can get into with it. If it doesn't work out, you could get into space, cars, energy, medical devices, robotics, manufacturing, etc.

 

[Owen]

Mechanical engineering was the technical liberal arts degree for about 100 years. My opinion now is that electro-mechanical engineering, with a good knowledge of micro-controllers is the current title holder for "most-employable."

The gun business is really a pretty small industry with, I'd guess, fewer than 1000 folks involved in design that would be considered players (meaning capability and financial backing to get into production) and a whole crap load of interested amateurs. And that is the problem: the pool of people that want to the design job at one of the larger companies is enormous compared to the number of jobs. This means the gun business, at least in my experience just doesn't pay as well as other industries, like aerospace, biomed, etc.

The next problem is that the business as a whole is relatively low tech. Because the end items are relatively cheap, most of the industry uses the fine art of "make it and break it" and doesn't bother with some things that most industries would consider good practice, because for the most part, it just isn't necessary. This means that when you leave, you may have trouble finding that aerospace or biomed job, because your skillset is obsolete.

Third: if you really like guns, and lovingly caress your beloved hunting rifle every time you pick it up, say good bye to that experience. Guns might as well be toasters after a several years. They'll still be interesting, but any romanticism about them will be long gone. One of the problems with turning a hobby into a career, is the hobby ends up not being much fun anymore.

However, there are a number of perks to the business. Meet strange and interesting people, lots of prestige with other gun nuts, and it you manage to stick it out for a while in the industry, you end up, at the very least, meeting everyone that matters.

Some of the highlights for me have been:

Dr. Dater (founder of Gemtech) calling me to talk about a presentation I gave.

Receiving a personal tour of Reid Knight's museum from Mr. Knight himself. Drinking beers with ST6 plankowners.

Realizing the revolver barrels I was making were going to be put on guns for Jerry Miculek.

Getting fired from S&W by Bill Clinton (sorta).

Laser marking a Savage logo on my thumb (by accident, working in a shop that supplies the industry)

Spending weeks in Belgium and Portugal.

Visiting PGM in the French Alps (Annecy is a beautiful town)

Sending magazine covers featuring items I've designed to my Mom

Shooting a .44 mag until there was blood running out of my gloves,

Shooting assault rifles until my shoulder was bleeding, and then shooting for 3 weeks more,

Eating dinner with a table of SF guys, talking about wound ballistics, and realizing I had their rapt attention, and they weren't throwing anything at me.

But right now, the thing I like the most about my job is passing on the wisdom and skills I've gained to the new engineers we've hired recently and realizing how far I've come.

Anyhow, I'm rambling.

If guns are what you want to do, then go ahead and get the mech eng degree or an electromech degree. That said, getting into the business isn't very easy and there are some significant opportunity costs: relatively low wages, non-portable skillset, etc.

If you just want to tinker with guns, grab one of those jobs in a higher paying industry (which is all of them, as far as I can tell), and do your gun design and prototyping on the side. CNC is getting cheaper every day, and you only need an FFL if you plan on manufacturing weapons to sell, or NFA items.