Is the .220 Swift a useful round?

[kd7nqb]

So last time I was at a gun show there was a guy showing off some really awesome steel targets that he builds. The targets that he builds are made out of a very hard steel (I believed its called 440 Burell?) but thats not right, I know 440 was the number. Anyway his targets will stop just about any rifle round he showed me examples of 30-06, .308 and a few others. As well a many handgun rounds that did not stand a chance. However the .220 swift round zipped right through this target. He said that it was because of the extremely high velocity of the round.

I have been looking around and most people refer to this round as a "varmint" round. When I think varmint I think woodchucks and squirles, and many people use .22lr or sometimes even .17hmr.

I dont imagine that this round would much use for bigger game so I cant find a use for it, other than target shooting.

Also the Ammo seems to be very expensive, by just looking at online prices. I have never priced a rifle in that caliber?

What am I missing? What is the use of this round that I am not seeing?

 

[Mannix]

I know it was the first 4000fps+ round ever made, and not much else.

Wiki has some info.

 

[rangerruck]

typically, it is considered the fastest of the 22 centerfires ever, handloaders will juice it to over 4200 fps. Even the factory loads are close to 4100fps.
I know a lot of dudes over the years , that have hunted deer sized game with it, with no probs. "speed kills" which is what mr. Weatherby used to say, and that much speed carries a pretty good bit of energy downrange.
As far as what is considered a 'varmint round' most old timers or long time shooters will say, anything under 270 in dimension, such as anything 6.5 mm or smaller, is a varmint round. then, anything 6.8 up to about 8.5 is considered a mid size round, then anything from 350 on up , is a full size, or large game round.

 

[Twud]

I don't consider a 22LR or a 17HMR as groundhog medicine. At close range? maybe. If you want to step out to long range, say 300 yards, you need a centerfire. I shoot a 22-250 @ 3,800 fps, which is plenty flat for me.
IMHO the Swift is just unneccessary. It will shoot flatter but at what cost?
Everyone says they are hard on barrels, but I doubt most us will ever shoot one enough to find out.
This is a round that will only see it's best with handloads and good bullets.

 

[El Tejon]

I used to shoot crows, groundhogs, coyotes, and the occassional pigeon with a .220 Swift (A Ruger #1). I shot it because that it what my uncle gave me to shoot. I burned the barrel after a few summers.

What use is the round? To sell of course!

 

[Shawnee]

The 220 Swift is like a lot of the older cartridges. When it came out it filled a definite void and was the King of the Hill, so it had all the trigger jerks and gun scribes swooning. But its' monopoly on its' niche was eroded by technology over time.
Other cartridges came along that would reach out there well enough without the roar and barrel-wrecking heat/pressure. Yep, it will still kill prairie dogs at long distance as well as ever and it will still turn coyotes head-over-heels, and it will still kill a deer if the shot is placed okay. But there are plenty of other cartridges that can be used for those things that are easier and cheaper to shoot, and more available.
Of course there are those who cling to it - some because they just have to have "the fastest" or the loudest", or "the one that Good Ol' Dad and Grampaw and Great-Grand-Pappy used", or someone gave them an old rifle for it, or they want something "different", or the Walmart salesgirl assured them that "was the most popular gun", or they have heard and believe all the old wives' tales about its' magic.
The 220 Swift is here and chugging along because the gun scribes always need something to write about and the sales force always needs something to sell and hunters/shooters always need something to try and trade and talk about.

But as to it's real need in the hunting fields here today, the 220 Swift, just like the venerable 30/06, is a purely pointless dinosaur holdover from a century ago.
Is it "Useful"? Sure it can be used. A sledge hammer can also be used to swat flies.
Is it "Optimum", or even close? Nope, it's just an old sledge hammer.

 

[BruceB]

"Damning with faint praise..."

Gentlemen;

The .220 Swift is a VARMINT cartridge, pure and simple.

It was designed for that purpose in the 1930s (NOT "a century ago") and ever since its debut, other designers have striven just to EQUAL its performance, let alone improve on it. Consider that, at its introduction, factory varmint rifles went directly from the .22 Hornet to the .220, 2700 fps to 4000+....talk about a quantum leap!! This cartridge is the grandaddy of ALL our high-intensity varmint cartridges, and it is STILL equal or superior to many (most?) of them in its performance. To dismiss it as cavalierly as I see here is simply to ignore both its history and its current value. Advances in technology have enabled latter-day cartridges to approach the .220, but it's far from obsolete. The same advances have improved the Swift, as well.

I don't much care what supposed justification anyone uses for hunting deer or larger critters with .22 varmint rifles. The likelihood of clean kills is greatly increased by using more-capable rifles and larger/heavier bullets than the .22s offer. I recognize that many people are hunting with the .22s with success, but I have enough rifles (and opinions!!!!) that I won't do it.

I will also add that anyone who thinks the .30-06 is "a pointless dinosaur holdover" is a few rounds short of a full magazine.

My opinions are based on 30-plus years of handloading and shooting the .220, and over 150 big-game kills with the .30-06 alone, not one of which ever complained about the vintage of the cartridge. All these critters were killed with handloads, by the way, usually driving Nosler Partitions.

 

[skinewmexico]

Well gee Shawnee............now we know what you don't like. What do you like? Or do you just throw rocks at other peoples beliefs?

Personally, I think if someone enjoys shooting a caliber, it's useful.

 

[Shawnee]

Hi Skine...

"Personally, I think if someone enjoys shooting a caliber, it's useful."

We don't disagree. I wrote; "Useful"? Sure it can be used."

Personal preferences, whether they are yours or mine - are just fine - especially after one has had enough experience to form sound preferences. But claiming one should (or must) have a 220 Swift for varmints or a 30 caliber for deer and larger game is not only silly in the extreme but also a huge disservice to new shooters seeking good advice. Telling someone they should buy a 300 Winchester Magnum for deer is not one bit better than telling them they should buy a .22 Hornet for moose.

 

[JesseL]

Telling someone they should buy a 300 Winchester Magnum for deer is not one bit better than telling them they should buy a .22 Hornet for moose.

I gotta disagree with that.

While a 300 Win Mag is probably a little more gun than most folks need for deer, it will at least be legal and likely produce clean kills.

22 Hornet for moose may not be legal and has an unacceptable likelihood of yielding lost game and a long suffering death for the animal.

 

[Shawnee]

Hi Jesse...

Sorry Jesse... but deer can be (and are) wounded and lost when shot with a 300 Win. Mag. And a lot of that wounding comes from poor shooting which comes from the flinching that comes from the recoil and blast of the big Magnums.

As for your "a little more gun than most folks need for deer" - let's get real. Absolute trainloads of deer have been killed by the .257 Roberts - a 117gr bullet with about 1000 ft/lbs of energy at 200 yds. The 300 WinMag 168gr. bullet at 200 yds. is at nearly three times that amount of energy - and you want to call that "a little more" ? Sorry Jesse. That just doesn't fly.

 

[rcmodel]

All I know is the Swift is one heck of a long range Coyote cartridge here in the flatlands of Kansas !

And the comment about the 30-06 being a dinosaur?

May be a dinosaur, but it's still the one every other new cartridge that comes & goes is compared against.


rcmodel

 

[JesseL]

Sorry Jesse... but deer can be (and are) wounded and lost when shot with a 300 Win. Mag. And a lot of that wounding comes from poor shooting which comes from the flinching that comes from the recoil and blast of the big Magnums.

True, but a good hit with a 300 will likely result in a clean kill. A good hit with a 22 hornet might still make a very bad kill.

I think that someone who takes bad advice and gets a 300 Win Mag for deer hunting will more likely see the error of their ways when they try to sight in the rifle,experience the recoil, and see how well (or poorly) they shoot it; than the person who takes bad advice and gets a 22 hornet and has no idea that it's less than ideal until they see their deer running off after their bullet blows up on his shoulder.

Don't worry, I won't be recommending either caliber to new hunters. My current personal favorites lie in the 6.5mm range.

As for your "a little more gun than most folks need for deer" - let's get real. Absolute trainloads of deer have been killed by the .257 Roberts - a 117gr bullet with about 1000 ft/lbs of energy at 200 yds. The 300 WinMag 168gr. bullet at 200 yds. is at nearly three times that amount of energy - and you want to call that "a little more" ? Sorry Jesse. That just doesn't fly.

Yes it was an understatement. I went deer hunting with a 6mm Remington last year, so you don't really need to preach the virtues of milder calibers for deer to me.

 

[JesseL]

The 220 Swift works as well as any cartridge within it's niche (long range varminting). What else is there to say?

 

[Shawnee]

"What else is there to say?"

Well... it's comparitively hard on barrels, it's disturbingly loud for those who hunt varmints in relatively settled areas, there are comparitively few rifles chambered for it, and the thousands of shooters who don't reload can find ammo for other good cartridges at much less expense.

 

[taliv]

sounds like someone else's problem
i like my swift just fine. i don't think it's all that loud either.
i bought a new swift in a rem700 vssf for $540. not very expensive and a heckuva value

 

[rcmodel]

It is no harder on barrels then any other 4,100 FPS .22 cartridge.

Whoops!
There aren't any other 4,100 FPS .22 cartridges!

Plus, a lot of the barrel burner reputation was earned with 1940's barrel steel, shooting 1940's powder.

Load it sensibly with a heavier bullet then the old 48 grain factory load, in a modern barrel, and it is no worse then the 22-250, or several other modern Magnum calibers.


rcmodel

 

[JesseL]

Well... it's comparitively hard on barrels,

I don't think that's particularly true any more.

it's disturbingly loud for those who hunt varmints in relatively settled areas,

What other cartridge in that class isn't similarly loud? .223 WSSM, .22-250, .204 Ruger, .17 Remington, etc. are all pretty loud. If it's really a problem, any centerfire is probably too loud.

there are comparitively few rifles chambered for it,

How many do you need?

and the thousands of shooters who don't reload can find ammo for other good cartridges at much less expense.

True. But what long range varmint cartridge isn't pricey and tough to find? The only one I can think of is .22-250 (which is what I have), but there's no harm in having choices.

If you want to talk about a cartridge in this class with no good reason to exist, look at the 225 Winchester.

 

[BigG]

Cartridges were the bread and butter of manufacturers back in the day when they were integrated manufacturing organizations. Winchester had their own line of cartridges, Remington had theirs, Savage had theirs.

220 Swift was a wildcat. I think Winchester was the first to chamber it in the Model 70.

 

[Shawnee]

"Load it sensibly with a heavier bullet then the old 48 grain factory load, in a modern barrel, and it is no worse then the 22-250, or several other modern Magnum calibers."

OR... simply buy a 22/250 and go hunting.



What other cartridge in that class isn't similarly loud?
ALL of 'em. No production .22 centerfire caliber is as loud as the Swift and most aren't even close.


"How many do you need?" LOL ! You are the one who says "... there's no harm in having choices."


Hey, if someone prefers the Swift - great - may they use it in good health. But, like the 30/06, it is not needed for anything.

 

[JesseL]

But, like the 30/06, it is not needed for anything.

Name me one cartridge that you can't say that about. There is redundancy among cartridges at every level.

I could probably get by just fine for everything I'll ever need to shoot with 3 cartridges, but what fun would that be? I enjoy choosing between .22 long rifle, .380 ACP, 9mm, .40 S&W, .45 ACP, .38 Special, .41 Magnum, 7.62x39mm, .223 Rem, .22-250, 6mm Rem, 6.5x55, .30-40 Krag, 7.62x54R, .30-06, & 308 Norma Mag.

 

[Harley Quinn]

22-250 took much of the glory from the 220, if I was buying I'd go with the 22-250 rather than the 220.

220:
I knew a person that hunted with it all the time any kind of animal he mentioned was dead meat, on the North American even dangerous stuff

Well the thing was bullet construction and placement on what he was hunting. No wild running shots just boom it is dead shots. Grizz attacking from a few feet away I don't think so. But looking at a fresh killed salmon and enjoying the meal was dead due to the placement and the bullet design.

He then punched a few holes thru a piece of 3/8 steel plate. Mentioned it was friction (heat and melting and pushing the material through) doing that trick. Velocity is the answer for sure. Many of the faster bullets can do that today.

 

[rcmodel]

OR... simply buy a 22/250 and go hunting.

Some of us still prefer to hunt with Pre-64 model 70's over todays plastic fantastic crap.


rcmodel

 

[.38 Special]

So last time I was at a gun show there was a guy showing off some really awesome steel targets that he builds. The targets that he builds are made out of a very hard steel (I believed its called 440 Burell?) but thats not right, I know 440 was the number.

The gentleman was probably talking about the Brinell hardness scale. It's not a type of steel but a measure of the hardness of a particular metal.

Anyway his targets will stop just about any rifle round he showed me examples of 30-06, .308 and a few others. As well a many handgun rounds that did not stand a chance. However the .220 swift round zipped right through this target. He said that it was because of the extremely high velocity of the round.

I think the fellow was selling you a bill of goods, at least to a degree. Penetrating a target like hardened steel does take some velocity, but it also takes energy and hardness. The typical projectile loaded into a .220 Swift is a lot less likely to penetrate such a target than a harder, larger bullet moving at less velocity. A light, fragile, super-fast bullet typically fired from a .22 centerfire is going to explode on contact with a hard target. Maybe he loads his Swift with depleted uranium...

I have been looking around and most people refer to this round as a "varmint" round. When I think varmint I think woodchucks and squirles, and many people use .22lr or sometimes even .17hmr.

There's a whole world that revolves around high velocity .22 centerfires for long-range gophers, woodchucks, etc., and the Swift was an early entry into the "hypervelocity" cartridges. It was seen as a breakthrough at the time, and was also touted as doing double duty for game like deer -- with a longer, heavier, tougher bullet, of course.

I dont imagine that this round would much use for bigger game so I cant find a use for it, other than target shooting.

It gained a reputation, early on, as being innacurate, at least as far as target competitors were concerned, so never saw much use as a competition round, IIRC. It was always championed as the top of the heap for long range varminting, and still serves admirably in that capacity. It is matched, if not superceded, by several other wildcat and factory rounds. And yes, these cartridges can be perfectly effective against lightly-constructed big game animals, given a suitable projectile and correct placement thereof.

Also the Ammo seems to be very expensive, by just looking at online prices. I have never priced a rifle in that caliber?

Both rifles and ammo have become somewhat rare, as they are percieved as "dinosaurs" by the unknowing.

What am I missing? What is the use of this round that I am not seeing?

It fills the same niche as any other large capacity .22 centerfire -- long-range varmint hunting and, in the hands of the knowledgeable handloader who chooses his shots carefully -- a precision "recoilless" big game rifle.

HTH!

 

[ZeroJunk]

I had a customer that killed about 20 deer with a Swift which is legal in this state, never losing one. Everybody told him he had to get a 270 Win. The first deer he shot with the 270 wandered off a couple hundred yards after being shot through the lungs. So much for a 270 in his view, so he went back to the Swift.

They may start to open up after 1000 rounds or so.Most people will never approach that number of rounds fired through a hunting rifle.But,it's something to consider if you plan to.