Is the .380 enough?

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M&PVolk

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My wife is interested in getting a semi-auto for her first carry gun. She has experience with the .40, .38, and .357, but it is the .380 that is interesting her for carry. She is interested in a Bersa, Baretta, or Walther.

My question is whether or not the .380 is worthy of trusting your life with. I would not carry anything smaller than a .357 myself, so I am not sure how to handle her fixation on the .380.
 
has she shot any of the brands you've mentioned? She might want to do that first before deciding.
 
Its the truth though. Sure the .25 doesnt have the stopping power of the .45acp or even the .38special. But its gotta be something she feels comfortable with and something she can fire quickly and accuratly.

Now if she was Norma the steel worker id say get something bigger but if she is the typical "soccer mom" light and quick is what she needs
 
It could be enough, but if your wife can handle a 380 I think there's a good chance she could handle at least a 9mm too. And 9mm does throw a heavier bullet, and faster.

Your wife probably will not like a KelTec P3AT, it has some snappy recoil although it's the smallest and thinnest carry pistol bigger than a .25

I would suggest taking a look at Bersa Thunder 380s, especially the CC version. Also look at Kahr pistols (I have a CW9 although there are several 9mm Kahr variants depending on your budget), the Glock 26, and the Springfield Armory XD9 subcompact.
 
My wife has a 22 because it is the only caliber she will shoot (any thing else has to much recoil or mussel bast). It is not what I would like but is better than nothing which is the only other choice. Have her try different guns and let her pick what she is comfortable with.
 
My wife carries this one. I told her not to fire untill the perp is close enough not to miss.
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Is any side arm caliber enough? Yes and No.

Might stop a fight...might even kill the BG...then again, might not do either.

Sometimes you can knock out an assailant with your fist first time...other times you just piss them off.

Every situtation is different.

Big question is: Do you think the .380 is enough? May your thoughts keep you safe from harm.
 
xsquidgator said:
It could be enough, but if your wife can handle a 380 I think there's a good chance she could handle at least a 9mm too. And 9mm does throw a heavier bullet, and faster.

Your wife probably will not like a KelTec P3AT, it has some snappy recoil although it's the smallest and thinnest carry pistol bigger than a .25

I would suggest taking a look at Bersa Thunder 380s, especially the CC version. Also look at Kahr pistols (I have a CW9 although there are several 9mm Kahr variants depending on your budget), the Glock 26, and the Springfield Armory XD9 subcompact.

The need for a tiny pocket pistol like the P3AT- which is in my front pocket right now- is the only reason IMO to go with the .380 over a 9mm. Anything much bigger than a P3AT or LCP, and I think you might as well go with the 9mm.

That said, I wouldn't want to get shot by either of them.
 
For self defense it is big enough, a lot of European cops carried it for their only sidearm for a lot of years. On the other hand if she wants to go moose hunting she might want to step up to a long barreled gun with a heavier bullet.
 
it's not that she can't handle a bigger gun, it's just that she likes the form factor of a smaller, faster pointing gun. I have an M&P compact, but it doesn't fit her hand well enough for her to put in the practice time she needs to properly defend herself. I thought maybe a Walther PPK or Bersa might be the way to go in this case, understanding of course that she has to like it for herself.
 
I usually CCW a NAA Guardian in .32 ACP. It's nice because it's so small and easy to carry.
 
The .380 will do its part, if Mrs. M&P does hers.

Among the .380's I lean toward the Bersa series. Don't own any .380 gun, but I have shot several of them, and I prefer the Bersa. Her Mileage Will Vary. See if the local range/shop has a few different .380's to try, or ask your Shooting Budds.
 
M&PVolk said:
it's not that she can't handle a bigger gun, it's just that she likes the form factor of a smaller, faster pointing gun. I have an M&P compact, but it doesn't fit her hand well enough for her to put in the practice time she needs to properly defend herself. I thought maybe a Walther PPK or Bersa might be the way to go in this case, understanding of course that she has to like it for herself.

Understood... but the only size gun where it becomes a necessity to go .380 is a little mousegun. Anything larger than that, a couple millimeters of cartridge length isn't going to affect the form factor. Heck, there are even pistols on the edge of mousegun territory chambered in 9x19, like the Kel-Tec PF9 and P11, or some of the Kahrs.

There are plenty of compact pistols available in 9mm that I think will fit the criteria you're looking for. And even discounting discussions about "stopping power" between the .380 and 9x19, one thing to consider is the relative cost of ammo for practice. A quick look at the Georgia Arms site shows that .380 costs about 30% more than 9mm for their Canned Heat stuff.

Now, I don't want to get too far from the original question. There's nothing wrong with .380 for defense IMO. However, I based on reading this thread, I don't think there's any need for you to go with .380 in this case.
 
.380

The .380 is considered by experts to be a sufficient self defense cartridge. Wild Bill Hickok made his reputation with .36 cal. cap and ball revolvers, same basic power as a .380. I also would suggest you look at the new Ruger .380, very impressive. But in the end buy what she likes. To each his/her own. If you think the .380 is too wimpy do a web-search on Wild Bill.
 
I would consider the .380acp to be the absolute minimum caliber you should carry for self defense. I would not consider it to be an effective duty use caliber as it lacks the ability to effectively penetrate FBI testing protocol barriers such as windshields, sheet steel, and appendages prior to impacting the torso or head.

The .380acp does just fine when it comes to penetration if you use good ole hardball(FMJ) ammunition. This is why Wild Bill's .36 caliber revolver was able to be effective in addition to his outstanding marksmanship. However, when using hollow point ammunition you need to be very selective. The .380 90-95gr bullets have very low sectional density, which means that they have very low momentum behind them relative to their bullet diameter. So, they are fairly weak penetrators and when you add the parachute effect of a hollow point you get marginal penetration. A lot of hollow point .380s don't meet the minimum penetration depth in testing gel of 12". There are a few that do, such as the Hornady 90gr XTP and the Speer Gold Dot 90gr JHP.

Like all calibers, shot placement is the primary prerequisite of handgun wounding effectiveness, but the other important part of the equation is that the ammunition must penetrate deeply enough to hit the large blood bearing organs of the body. In 1986 special agent Jerry Dove had perfect shot placement on gunman Michael Platt, however his 9mm Winchester Silvertip did not penetrate deeply enough to kill Platt. That same round had an average testing penetration of 11" in ballistic gel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout

Here's a good quote by Urey Patrick at Quantico many years ago on shot placement and the importance of good penetration and expansion and it still rings true:

"Shot placement is obviously critical, and our test criteria presume that the shot is placed in the vital area of the body, which contains the brain, upper spinal cord, heart and aorta/vena cava. This area runs from just above the eyes to the diaphragm, and is about 4 inches wide. But, as our experience in Miami amply illustrates, shot placement is only the first part of the equation. Jerry Dove placed his shot perfectly(he was using a P226 9mm with 115gr Winchester Silver Tips). Bullet performance is critical to translate shot placement into an effective, incapacitating wound. If shot placement was all that mattered, we could arm all Agents with .22's. Secondly, perfect shot placement may be difficult to attain in the stress and dynamics of a shooting incident. The larger calibers offer a "margin of error" in that where a smaller bullet may just miss the aorta, for example, the larger one in the same placement will damage it. A good example is killing a 400 pound pig with a .22, something commonly done on the farm. If the shot placement is exactly right, the pig is instantly killed. If it is off less than an inch, the pig goes wild and the process of killing it becomes rather lengthy and involved, whereas a larger caliber would succeed with a larger margin of miss than an inch.(Larger calibers are not used because they ruin too much of the pig - a consideration that does not come into play in a shooting incident - and besides which, nobody is going to die if the pig is not instantly killed anyway. In shootings, just the opposite is true)."

I would use the .380acp for a CCW, but I would also take into account the penetration limitations of the round. I would choose to use Hornady 90gr XTP JHPs if possible.
 
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