No..the idea that Hornady says that their data is "max"....that is the real issue. Many new loaders will see that...see it's Hornady and "trust" them...without understanding that the Hornady data is anemic. Then you have old guys like us having to teach something to the young guys that shouldn't be there., but the insistence that a load isn't valid or useful just because it's not at top data is nonsense.
Many new loaders will see that...see it's Hornady and "trust" them...without understanding that the Hornady data is anemic.
Just like that stupid inrange video with commercial ammo BS.
lol. Yup, couldn’t agree more. Paper don’t care if it’s a barrel-busting hi-speed load or training wheels. Folks who are more about kaboom than bang kinda remind me of them city boys in their “Cali-Lean” pickup trucks that have never seen a honest day’s work. They’re so dang soopertuff they can’t even stand being in their own company.Sooooo.... a load that fires and cycles the Garand action while producing good accuracy... is 'training wheels?' That would mean light target loads in, say, the .38SPC and .45ACP are the same?
Honestly... I've come around on my thinking after reading your previous thread comments on .30-06 in the M1, it makes sense even if I don't do it myself, but the insistence that a load isn't valid or useful just because it's not at top data is nonsense.
I'm saying "anemic" in regards to actual milsurp loads etc. You want to shoot light loads or 100yd target loads I fully get that. However IMHO when you label it "garand" data...you should at least duplicate the actual "garand" ammo. If you understand what I'm saying.I see your point. One of the problems with new and newer reloaders is they sometimes don't fully research their load... comparing data, etc. I don't agree with 'anemic.' If it were so, in my mind, it wouldn't cycle the Garand's action. I understand you and I may disagree on that.
I must have been busy that day. Honestly, I rarely watch YT videos and such because about 90% of it is pap. Again, just me opinion.
i resent that! I like shooting .460 mag at paper targets so I can feel the power!lol. Yup, couldn’t agree more. Paper don’t care if it’s a barrel-busting hi-speed load or training wheels. Folks who are more about kaboom than bang kinda remind me of them city boys in their “Cali-Lean” pickup trucks that have never seen a honest day’s work. They’re so dang soopertuff they can’t even stand being in their own company.
And that’s why we got a ignore button on this forum.
I'm saying "anemic" in regards to actual milsurp loads etc. You want to shoot light loads or 100yd target loads I fully get that. However IMHO when you label it "garand" data...you should at least duplicate the actual "garand" ammo. If you understand what I'm saying.
Buy the app and they send you the book free. I prefer the app over the book. I use it more when people ask for data
Many of the older manuals are available free online. Hornady third and fourth editions can be found here http://marvinstuart.com/firearm/Manuals/Reloading/Reloading Manuals/. Fourth edition has data for the 160 gr RN you showed in many calibers, although I don't think I saw 6.5 creed in there when I skimmed it.I was just having a hard time finding loads for the old Hornady bullets, like these. I may never even shoot these, but still wanted some data for them, just in case.
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I received a physical book last year. It did take about 3-4 months after downloading the app.They send you the physical book or a PDF?
That is true.XTP data tends to be unique to Hornady bullets. Their rifle bullet data would be worth having. One distinct advantage of Hornady’s data book is that they pressure test all of their loads (despite not offering it on the page), so there’s greater confidence to be had than from, say, the Lee manual which doesn’t have any independent load development, nor pressure testing done behind the paper.
Yeah, I may do that out of curiosity. I don't need the manual part of it. I've been reloading for 35+ years, shotgun and metallic. I read my fair share of manuals when I first started, and they were helpful. I just want the load data now.I've had one experience with Hornady that convinced me their data is worth it. I loaded up a few 168 grain Amax bullets in 308 and went to test them. The load data overlaps with data for a 168 grain SMK at the bottom end of the Lyman data and the top end of the Amax data. I had pressure signs less than half way through the load range. Now I realize the Amax and SMK aren't the same bullet. However, it is now my policy to consult Hornady data for Hornady projectiles. I feel like their rifle bullets at least are different enough that even at the same projectile weight, pressure can be higher than expected. The load I used was the same charge as what I use in a 175 grain SMK load without any problems. I purchased the individual calibers on the phone app. I've got like $6 in them so far. I wouldn't buy the manual for the load data. I might for the manual part, but have 3 others already.
It's funny how everyone in the same hobby is so different. I started handloading in 1977 - for the mathematically challenged, that's 45 years ago - and would have started sooner but my uncle who taught me felt like I needed to be at least 12 before I was allowed in the reloading room and at least 13 before I was allowed to operate the press unsupervised. I did not start out studying manuals. That came later. I started out observing and doing the monkey-see-monkey-do thing. After I got good at doing what I was told, I was "allowed" to read the Lyman's No.45 and learn that there was more than one way to get things done and I'd have to learn to THINK for myself. I still read old manuals and new ones, periodicals like Handloader and the Hodgdon's annual publication, and some REALLY old, like the Ideal manuals. To me, there's a lot to learn I don't know and it goes way beyond learning a new "recipe." I don't buy a recipe book because I don't know how to cook a hamburger or to learn the latest-greatest way to put mustard on a bun... I buy a new cookbook to learn the techniques. Once I get the techniques down pat, I can apply them to new recipes of my own creation.Yeah, I may do that out of curiosity. I don't need the manual part of it. I've been reloading for 35+ years, shotgun and metallic. I read my fair share of manuals when I first started, and they were helpful. I just want the load data now.
It's funny how everyone in the same hobby is so different. I started handloading in 1977 - for the mathematically challenged, that's 45 years ago - and would have started sooner but my uncle who taught me felt like I needed to be at least 12 before I was allowed in the reloading room and at least 13 before I was allowed to operate the press unsupervised. I did not start out studying manuals. That came later. I started out observing and doing the monkey-see-monkey-do thing. After I got good at doing what I was told, I was "allowed" to read the Lyman's No.45 and learn that there was more than one way to get things done and I'd have to learn to THINK for myself. I still read old manuals and new ones, periodicals like Handloader and the Hodgdon's annual publication, and some REALLY old, like the Ideal manuals. To me, there's a lot to learn I don't know and it goes way beyond learning a new "recipe." I don't buy a recipe book because I don't know how to cook a hamburger or to learn the latest-greatest way to put mustard on a bun... I buy a new cookbook to learn the techniques. Once I get the techniques down pat, I can apply them to new recipes of my own creation.
But that's me and everyone's different so, it's all good.
I had an uncle that reloaded. I found it beyond interesting. But we lived several states away, so no OJT there. I got into reloading because I wanted custom loads for pheasant hunting, and to save money for all the trap shooting I was doing. So it was manuals first in my case. And I go back to them when learning to load something different that what I'm used to.It's funny how everyone in the same hobby is so different. I started handloading in 1977 - for the mathematically challenged, that's 45 years ago - and would have started sooner but my uncle who taught me felt like I needed to be at least 12 before I was allowed in the reloading room and at least 13 before I was allowed to operate the press unsupervised. I did not start out studying manuals. That came later. I started out observing and doing the monkey-see-monkey-do thing. After I got good at doing what I was told, I was "allowed" to read the Lyman's No.45 and learn that there was more than one way to get things done and I'd have to learn to THINK for myself. I still read old manuals and new ones, periodicals like Handloader and the Hodgdon's annual publication, and some REALLY old, like the Ideal manuals. To me, there's a lot to learn I don't know and it goes way beyond learning a new "recipe." I don't buy a recipe book because I don't know how to cook a hamburger or to learn the latest-greatest way to put mustard on a bun... I buy a new cookbook to learn the techniques. Once I get the techniques down pat, I can apply them to new recipes of my own creation.
But that's me and everyone's different so, it's all good.
There is a rich amount of reloading information on YT, and the internet in general. This forum is a great resource also.I learned reloading on YouTube. I’m not good with manuals
I learned reloading on YouTube. I’m not good with manuals
My mother's brother (uncle) lived in Ocoee and we lived in Indian River City so I only got to see him three or four times a year but I spent a summer break with him and his five boys and that's when the handloading bug bit. I think it bit him harder'n me, to be honest. His youngest boy was close to my age and never got the hang of making a decent pot of coffee. Attention span of a fruit fly.I had an uncle that reloaded. I found it beyond interesting. But we lived several states away, so no OJT there. I got into reloading because I wanted custom loads for pheasant hunting, and to save money for all the trap shooting I was doing. So it was manuals first in my case. And I go back to them when learning to load something different that what I'm used to.