J-frame trigger job
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First don't expect great changes in J-frames trigger jobs. They will never equal those of the larger frames.
Wolff sells the spring kits you require.
If you really don't know how to do the trigger job (which sounds like you don't by your post) I suggest you get a manual or video to assist you. No offense, but I don't think you want to trust your life on a handgun that's been modified by the unexperienced. Use the handgun as a range gun untill you are positive that the modifications are successful before carrying it.
Wolff sells the spring kits you require.
If you really don't know how to do the trigger job (which sounds like you don't by your post) I suggest you get a manual or video to assist you. No offense, but I don't think you want to trust your life on a handgun that's been modified by the unexperienced. Use the handgun as a range gun untill you are positive that the modifications are successful before carrying it.
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
Baloney. A gun is a gun is a gun. It ought to have the most dependable, predictable, comfortable trigger possible for the sake of accuracy.
Speaking strictly as a guy who's always preferred light triggers, I carry a pre-agreement Smith & Wesson model 60 with a very light, crisp single action trigger. Speaking strictly as a responsible firearms owner, you can bet your last nickel I'm thoroughly familiar with the gun, have put plenty of lead down-range with it, keep it clean, and can shoot it both quickly and accurately enough to stake my life on it if needed.
A carry gun with a good trigger is always and everywhere better than one with a bad trigger—like all other guns.
The baloney is that you need light springs to get a smooth trigger pull, THAT is a crock! The springs that came in the gun are strong enough to ignite any primer that you might encounter that is capable of getting set off. Lighter springs are not. I prefer to have a gun that works, but that is just me...
If you need to lighten the trigger pull to shoot well I suggest practice instead of shortcuts. If you can't shoot a smooth trigger of normal weight something is wrong with you, not the gun.
If you need to lighten the trigger pull to shoot well I suggest practice instead of shortcuts. If you can't shoot a smooth trigger of normal weight something is wrong with you, not the gun.
My first 642 was polished and slightly lighter springs were installed. It is a huge improvement over stock. It's my daily carry and has been %100 reliable. My former smith, who did the work on the 642, has since moved so I'm considering doing it myself. I might just send it to him but hate to pay overnight shipping.
JPM70535
Member
J frames are somewhat different from the other S&W revolver lines in that they employ a coil mainspring instead of the leaf spring of the K,L, and N frames. Good smooth trigger pulls are still possible without resorting to cutting coils off the main or trigger rebound springs. (Not a good idea for a gun used for CCW) Judicious polishing of the rebound block and its mating surface along with the bearing surfaces for the trigger and hammer yields an incredible improvement without changing the spring values or compromising reliability. Just takes a little time and effort.
Smooth is more important than light. So polishing is the way to do it . Reducing mainspring risks ignition problems.A gunsmith doing a trigger job should be asking what the gun is for . If it's for defense he should be doing it differently.
Josey
member
I suggest a set of snap caps and dry firing in front of the TV. You will be surprised how fast parts will wear and improve the action. I did say snap caps.
Having been inside quite a few of them, I am now to the point that I would either leave them alone or send it into S&W to do the job. Most--but not all recent Js are pretty good and don't need much if any work. As pointed out smoothness is the issue, not weight. and yes, Js are normally harder to get drastically improved pulls with. The majority are quite usable as is.
In addition to probably not being worth the effort, there is the issue of reliability. The factory thinks it is a priority and so do I.
The last J fame I bought was a 442, and in the seven years I have owned, carried, and shot it I have never felt a need to pull the sideplate. Not many guns I can say that about.
If it ain't broken, don't fix it.
In addition to probably not being worth the effort, there is the issue of reliability. The factory thinks it is a priority and so do I.
The last J fame I bought was a 442, and in the seven years I have owned, carried, and shot it I have never felt a need to pull the sideplate. Not many guns I can say that about.
If it ain't broken, don't fix it.
You will find those in both camps. A carry gun will most likely be shot with one proven ammo in it anyway, unlike a range gun that will eat just about anything. If your choice in carry ammo is compatable with your lighter trigger then there is no problem. That's why most of us test ammo for carry purposes. I personally prefer smoother and lighter triggers. All my handguns have had their internals reworked. I shoot mainly my reloads, but for the factory fodder in my carry handguns I only use the brand that ignites on every trigger pull with accuracy. If I find a problem with a certain brand during testing then my simple solution is to not ever use that one again.
Brian Williams
Moderator Emeritus
Swapping out a trigger return spring will lighten the trigger pull but will not lighten the hammer strike. I have a S&W mod 60-4 that has a horrendous trigger pull weight due to a too strong trigger return spring. The hammer spring is just right. But I am too cheap to swap it out right now.
JNewell
Member
I am from the school of sceptics on lighter springs. I've installed Wolff kits in revolvers and had several cases where the gun started having a lot of FTFs -- very bad. Even replacing the trigger return spring is a trade-off. If we're talking about a gun that might be used for defense, you may need a very positive spring to help you reset the trigger under high-adrenaline conditions. I'd say that HSSmith's comment about practice was right. Having a nice, light trigger and weak return spring works great on a square range...could be a disaster in several different ways in a defensive situation if you have a negligent discharge or if the gun chokes because you didn't fully reset the trigger.
Coltdriver
Member
I have two j frames that came with stock triggers.
If you treat the trigger parts with a good liquid moly the results are amazing.
In both guns (940 and a model 38) I did put a slightly lighter replacement spring in the trigger return but left the hammer spring stock.
Nothing radical and both of mine have never failed to fire or work normally.
If you do decide to polish the parts be very careful not to polish through the surface hardening, especially with a mim part.
If you treat the trigger parts with a good liquid moly the results are amazing.
In both guns (940 and a model 38) I did put a slightly lighter replacement spring in the trigger return but left the hammer spring stock.
Nothing radical and both of mine have never failed to fire or work normally.
If you do decide to polish the parts be very careful not to polish through the surface hardening, especially with a mim part.
JNewell
Member
Agree on cleaning and lube. My experience with S&Ws generally and J-frames in particular is that they always benefit from being cleaned out and relubed. They don't seem to clean 'em out very well after manufacturing 'em, and most have been dry inside, too. :banghead:
bountyhunter
member
Agreed. I "down tune" the springs on all my comp guns and I can tell with a feel if they are right. But, every now and then you will get ammo that needs extra whack to light.... and it doesn't go off. Imaging hearing a loud click when your life depends on having a gun that shoots......
As to trigger job: about 90% of the improvement in smoothness is obtained in a SW by polishing the two faces of the rebound slide that ride against the frame and polishing the sorresponding frame surfaces it rides against. Lube with a good grease (RIG +p) mixed about 50-50 with FP-10 and the pull will feel like glass and you won't need to lighten springs.
I recommend buying the Kuhnhausen manual on SW's to learn how to work on them, if for no other reason: you need to be able to remove the side plate and take out the internals to properly clean and lube the gun (spoken as a man who has popped the plate on some and seen something that looked like black tar). Polishing the RB slide is not that hard to do once you get the hang of taking the gun apart.
bountyhunter
member
The hammer and trigger are surface hardened. In general, just don't touch them. The rebound slide (the ones I've seen) are not surface hardened so you can polish them with a fine stone or 600# paper and oil.
Coltdriver
Member
My j frames are older and have machined parts in the trigger internals.
I have never taken a newer one apart. But, with so many manufacturers going to MIM parts it is something to be careful about.
All mim parts that have a wearing or bearing surface are surface hardened and it is very thin. It is easy to cut through with a stone. Once you do the underlying part is relatively soft and will wear with use.
I have taken apart every gun I have ever owned. For me it is part of the fun of owning the "pyro-mechanical" machines. I am not a gunsmith so I am extremely careful about modifying much of anything. But for a person who is relatively new to guns, taking them apart is a natural curiosity. It is fairly easy to ruin something without being aware that you have done so when it comes to improving on the factory configuration.
I have never taken a newer one apart. But, with so many manufacturers going to MIM parts it is something to be careful about.
All mim parts that have a wearing or bearing surface are surface hardened and it is very thin. It is easy to cut through with a stone. Once you do the underlying part is relatively soft and will wear with use.
I have taken apart every gun I have ever owned. For me it is part of the fun of owning the "pyro-mechanical" machines. I am not a gunsmith so I am extremely careful about modifying much of anything. But for a person who is relatively new to guns, taking them apart is a natural curiosity. It is fairly easy to ruin something without being aware that you have done so when it comes to improving on the factory configuration.
bountyhunter
member
The vast majority of MIM parts used in guns are not surface hardened. The requirement for hardening applies strictly to the part's desingn/usage, not the method of manufacture. MIM parts are no harder or softer INHERENTLY than forged, it depends on the heat treatment applied to the MIM part and it's material formula as to how hard it will be. They can be surface hardened after machining, just the same as a forged part can be.
The triggers and hammers in SW's are surface hardened because of their design: the sear faces have very small surface areas that are cycled thousands of times under heavy load and must not wear. A rebound slide has the stress applied over a large surface area, so hardening would not be necessary and would make the part more brittle for no advantage.
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