Silver Bullet
Member
Send him to Gitmo.
Jihad at Chapel Hill (Merged thread on UNC hit-and-run)
- Thread starter Preacherman
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Echo Tango
Member
Forget that, send him to Pelican Bay.
Manedwolf
member
To make this even more relevant to this forum...question about that.
I know police can do it, but if you see someone deliberately trying to run down a crowd like this, especially if they do something like back up and do it again or circle around for another charge (obvious it wasn't just an accident), and there's lots of witnesses, CAN you call it assault with a deadly weapon on a third party and take a shot at them through their windshield to try to stop them? If your state allows you to use deadly force to stop use of unlawful deadly force on a third party, that is.
I know police can do it, but if you see someone deliberately trying to run down a crowd like this, especially if they do something like back up and do it again or circle around for another charge (obvious it wasn't just an accident), and there's lots of witnesses, CAN you call it assault with a deadly weapon on a third party and take a shot at them through their windshield to try to stop them? If your state allows you to use deadly force to stop use of unlawful deadly force on a third party, that is.
geekWithA.45
Moderator Emeritus
As a general rule, I'm pretty exasperated by the refusal of our society to deal with the fact that we've had a lengthy string of "incidents" that are clearly jihad related since 9/11, and an even longer list of other unexplained "incidents" for which the connection to jihad is more tenuous.
It seems clear to me that "cells of one" are operating in the US under their own initiative.
Let me see if I can think of all the events that have been swept under the rug and flushed down the memory hole, feel free to chime in:
Pretty Clearly Jihad Related:
---------------------------
-Maryland Sniper
-That student who accidentally detonated his 3 lb pack of TAPT outside the football game a few months ago
-Chappel Hill Attempted Mass Jeep Squishing
-Coptic Christian assassination in North NJ
-And I'm sure there's at least 3 or 4 more that leaked out from under my tinfoil.
Big, Big Questionmarks:
------------------------
-Anthrax attacks around 9/11
-Texas energy plant explosion
-Newark Refinery fire
-Around the same time as the Coptic Christian assassination, there was an AK attack on a social club in the same area.
It seems clear to me that "cells of one" are operating in the US under their own initiative.
Let me see if I can think of all the events that have been swept under the rug and flushed down the memory hole, feel free to chime in:
Pretty Clearly Jihad Related:
---------------------------
-Maryland Sniper
-That student who accidentally detonated his 3 lb pack of TAPT outside the football game a few months ago
-Chappel Hill Attempted Mass Jeep Squishing
-Coptic Christian assassination in North NJ
-And I'm sure there's at least 3 or 4 more that leaked out from under my tinfoil.
Big, Big Questionmarks:
------------------------
-Anthrax attacks around 9/11
-Texas energy plant explosion
-Newark Refinery fire
-Around the same time as the Coptic Christian assassination, there was an AK attack on a social club in the same area.
I should have written a bit more to make the connection that Manedwolf just made.
How long until an American civilian is in a position to have to deal with a jihadi or at least a jihad-sympathetic independent operator (like this guy appears to be) and is forced to use a personally owned firearm?
This situation would not be anything at all like dealing with normal, garden-variety robber or rapist.
Somebody on a jihadist-style terror attack doesn't want money or property, or to rape. A person on a jihadist-style terror attack wants to kill infidels.
I think this would be an order of magnitude even beyond a school shooter.
School shooters typically want to kill specific people at a specific school.
This guy picked UNC apparently because he was familiar with the area.
How long until this situation replays itself at a shopping mall or at a little league game or a rodeo, or anywhere else large numbers of infidels gather?
hillbilly
How long until an American civilian is in a position to have to deal with a jihadi or at least a jihad-sympathetic independent operator (like this guy appears to be) and is forced to use a personally owned firearm?
This situation would not be anything at all like dealing with normal, garden-variety robber or rapist.
Somebody on a jihadist-style terror attack doesn't want money or property, or to rape. A person on a jihadist-style terror attack wants to kill infidels.
I think this would be an order of magnitude even beyond a school shooter.
School shooters typically want to kill specific people at a specific school.
This guy picked UNC apparently because he was familiar with the area.
How long until this situation replays itself at a shopping mall or at a little league game or a rodeo, or anywhere else large numbers of infidels gather?
hillbilly
NeverAgain26
Member
We got to make sure that Chrysler is sued by New York City because their car was used in the commission of attempted murder. Why not? Oh, because it wasn't done with a gun. Stupid me
NA26
NA26
Manedwolf
member
With the borders unsecure and no real checking on student visas STILL...probably not all that long.
I'm just glad that I'm in a state where a would-be jihadist in a mall is far more likely to be met with return fire from a number of other individuals.
TexasRifleman
Moderator Emeritus
I'm shocked it hasn't already and I fear we are overdue.
Manedwolf
member
My fear is that if such a thing happens in a shopping mall or major theme park, it will SERIOUSLY damage the economy, as people will be afraid to go to large retailers.
I'm sure the jihadists know that, too. That, along with a successful attack on a major Saudi oil depot (think airplane) could be, for us, the economic equivalent of stepping on a land mine.
And really, I do wonder when/if the gun laws will change. If this really is an asymmetrical war, and it come here, if you shoot an enemy combatant that is trying to perpetuate an act of terrorism...an act of war...what do the laws have to say about that?
It's never happened here before.
I'm sure the jihadists know that, too. That, along with a successful attack on a major Saudi oil depot (think airplane) could be, for us, the economic equivalent of stepping on a land mine.
And really, I do wonder when/if the gun laws will change. If this really is an asymmetrical war, and it come here, if you shoot an enemy combatant that is trying to perpetuate an act of terrorism...an act of war...what do the laws have to say about that?
It's never happened here before.
shootinstudent
Member
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Oh no, I can see the strategies and tactics threads already:
"What gun for IJATMATTEMK"? (If Jihadists Attack The Mall Trying To Eat My Kids)
I can't imagine why the rules for attacking would-be terrorists would be any different than self-defense laws now. Shooting a guy who is shooting little kids at the mall will likely leave you in okay shape; shooting a suspicious looking guy with year-round-tan because "his coat was too warm for this weather" won't.
Just_a_dude_with_a_gun
Member
The jackass attacked people at random, with the knowledge and intent to kill, for a cause. That is terrorism. Burn him, he's a witch.
FWIW, Geekwitha.45,
-Maryland Sniper - I'm not convinced this is Jihad related. The plan was to kill a bunch of random people for a false motive, and to throw off the scent, and then go back to his hometown and whack his wife, so he'd get everything, and custody of his kids.
-Coptic Christian assassination in North NJ - Robbery gone wrong. They caught a hispanic guy with the Dad's ATM card a few weeks later. This was Jersey City - and other than blind sheiks and terror mosques, there is much gang activity that dwarve any terror related issues.
FWIW, Geekwitha.45,
-Maryland Sniper - I'm not convinced this is Jihad related. The plan was to kill a bunch of random people for a false motive, and to throw off the scent, and then go back to his hometown and whack his wife, so he'd get everything, and custody of his kids.
-Coptic Christian assassination in North NJ - Robbery gone wrong. They caught a hispanic guy with the Dad's ATM card a few weeks later. This was Jersey City - and other than blind sheiks and terror mosques, there is much gang activity that dwarve any terror related issues.
Camp David
member
Latest=>
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,186946,00.html
CHAPEL HILL, N.C. — A University of North Carolina graduate from Iran, accused of running down nine people on campus to avenge the treatment of Muslims, said at a hearing Monday that he was "thankful for the opportunity to spread the will of Allah." Mohammed Reza Taheri-azar was accused of driving a sport utility vehicle through The Pit, a popular campus gathering spot, injuring nine people Friday.
We may have to spead the Will Of God against these jihadi folks soon... more likely the will of Smith, Wesson, Ruger, Colt, and Kimber!
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,186946,00.html
CHAPEL HILL, N.C. — A University of North Carolina graduate from Iran, accused of running down nine people on campus to avenge the treatment of Muslims, said at a hearing Monday that he was "thankful for the opportunity to spread the will of Allah." Mohammed Reza Taheri-azar was accused of driving a sport utility vehicle through The Pit, a popular campus gathering spot, injuring nine people Friday.
We may have to spead the Will Of God against these jihadi folks soon... more likely the will of Smith, Wesson, Ruger, Colt, and Kimber!
Manedwolf
member
I don't think it's that at all. That sort of attack is an everyday occurence in much of the world. We've had it easy, here.
Nobody but BS kmart commandos would fantasize about that.
For the rest of us, it should be a serious question. Of, if it happened, do you practice enough with your firearm that you would actually be able to help stop a fanatic who is NOT afraid to die and simply wants to kill as many people as possible in being a "martyr"?
This isn't your typical criminal who wants the cash and wants to get out alive. They're not likely to stop and flee once hit. It's just something to think about that can happen.
seeker_two
Member
This incident will be swept under the rug just like the Egyptian Muslim shooting up the El Al terminal at LAX was...
...don't want to ruin Bush's "perfect record"... :banghead:
...don't want to ruin Bush's "perfect record"... :banghead:
longeyes
member
Repeat after me: there is no home-grown jihad.
For those outside the area, UNC and the surrounding town of Carrboro are basically a liberal hotbed in an otherwise conservative North Carolina. So it's not at all surprising that the campus Republicans rally against terrorism was met with a bunch of folks claiming he wasn't a terrorist.
couple examples:
Town Resolution against Iraq War
http://www.ips-dc.org/citiesforpeace/carrboro.htm
Leaf blower ban
http://www.wral.com/news/3762350/detail.html
Manedwolf
member
>>So it's not at all surprising that the campus Republicans rally against terrorism was met with a bunch of folks claiming he wasn't a terrorist.
Here's an idea. Find a locked impound yard. Put those protestors in it. Put the suspect in it at the wheel of a truck.
Sit back with popcorn. See if they still think he's not a terrorist.
Here's an idea. Find a locked impound yard. Put those protestors in it. Put the suspect in it at the wheel of a truck.
Sit back with popcorn. See if they still think he's not a terrorist.
spartacus2002
Member
How could this happen? I thought there were laws against this sort of thing? Aren't colleges safe zones where nothing bad happens?
Yes, that was sarcasm.
Yes, that was sarcasm.
OrvilleYertleson
Member.
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Just be glad his weapon of choice was not a firearm.
shootinstudent
Member
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- 786
I tend to agree with c_yeager. This goes hand in hand with another thread I saw recently on "hate crimes"....what's the difference between terrorism and a hate crime, if you call this terrorism?
Terrorism is apparently becoming a perjorative that really means "we don't want to follow the long established constitutional principles in how we treat this guy", rather than a description of any specific crime.
Agreed. Like suicidal teenage school shooters. Judging by the reports I've seen, we are all much more likely to encounter one of those than a "jihadist."
Terrorism is apparently becoming a perjorative that really means "we don't want to follow the long established constitutional principles in how we treat this guy", rather than a description of any specific crime.
Agreed. Like suicidal teenage school shooters. Judging by the reports I've seen, we are all much more likely to encounter one of those than a "jihadist."
cliffstanc
Member
The weird thing is, this wasn't a guy who was suicidal. You can listen to the 911 call he made after the attack here.
This guy was creepily calm, true. But he also was very emphatic that he wasn't armed, he wasn't going to flee, etc. In other words, he seemed to go out of his way to make sure the cops wouldn't try to shoot him. He wanted to live.
This guy's not the typical suicide-minded jihadist. I don't know what his deal is.
- Cliff
This guy was creepily calm, true. But he also was very emphatic that he wasn't armed, he wasn't going to flee, etc. In other words, he seemed to go out of his way to make sure the cops wouldn't try to shoot him. He wanted to live.
This guy's not the typical suicide-minded jihadist. I don't know what his deal is.
- Cliff
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