John Ross speech - "things are better for us gun owners"

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bfason

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http://www.missourisportshooting.org/ms4.htm

"Throughout the country, people are talking about the horrendous gun bans in Canada, Great Britain, and Australia. 'It’s inevitable, America is next, we’re doomed,' is the message. It’s easy to be a doomsayer. If you’re wrong, no one minds. One of the riskiest things you can do is to say that things are good.

"I don’t want to trivialize the serious implications of these human rights violations in other countries and our own, but it’s time to say out loud something that’s been absent from the discussion. In many ways, things are better for us [gunowners] now than they ever have been in the past."

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What Would Darth Vader Do?
 
Maybe it's because I live in Jersey...

but I can't really identify with that. I acknowledge that things on a national scale are turning around, with the majority of states adopting shall issue, and 2 states returning to Constitutional fundamentals by doing away with the permitting process, but there's plenty of danger for 2a all around.
 
:what: :what: :what:

Positively mind-blowing.

I have chills after reading that.

I had absolutely no clue that things used to be so bad. Wow! We really have come a long way!!!

Is all that stuff accurate?

And WELCOME, JOHN ROSS!!! :)
 
In the context presented, yes, he is right...things are better. However, that's only if you maintain an overview of both the 'technological' and the 'political'. Yeah, we have much better, more refined, more accurate, and more complex things that go bang today. But when you remove the technological aspect from the equation, the variable change drastically modifies the conclusion.

I guess if someone wants to view 4473s, pistol purchase permits, NFA taxes, neighbor's witch-hunting gun owners, and massive ATF beaurocracy 'better', they're welcome to it. I mean, if Clinton can redefine the word 'is', who's to say someone can't redefine the word 'better'...

The one question I have is this.....we've made lots of strides in the realm of concealed carry over the past 70+ years, that is fact. I'm curious as to what the laws were back then regarding open carry, and if there might be a correlation....
 
To answer your last question, whoami, I'm pretty sure open carry laws are getting better in Virginia. It's always been legal state-wide, but lots of localities tried to prohibit carrying in public. With the recent move towards pre-emption laws (the most recent passed this year), localities no longer have that option, and on July 1 it will be legal to open carry in many places (such as parks), that have long been off limits.

I'd say that not is not necessarily looking at the technological aspect of firearms, but firearms ownership and widespread availability of technology. People on forums like this one often feel that this country is going downhill, with gun laws being just one example, and that we will soon reach the day when TSHTF :rolleyes: and we have another revolutionary war (or whatever). Those people should be overjoyed by Mr. Ross's article, because although laws may be getting worse, the laws will no longer matter in post-SHTF anarchy. Then, the only important thing will be the quality and quantity of guns and ammo in your safe, and has Mr. Ross shows, in many ways we are better off than in any previous time in our history.

The real point is that today we are more aware of our 2nd Amendment rights and the need to preserve them than any time since the Bill of Rights was written. The government will never be able to sneak another law past us like NFA '34 or GCA '68. We are watchful and ready to fight politically (and otherwise if necessary).
 
What about the mail order shiped right to your house full auto thompson? Things are better now? The Thompson was not expensive because it didn't get the government contract yet so it sold to anyone to make money.
 
Always look on the bright side...

Great speech, thanks for posting it--

And I too welcome John Ross to THR!

Soon I'll be returning to, well... not the USA, really, but to the People's Republick of California; so for me not all the good news & speculation in the article will apply. But it's nice to know that in MOST of the USA, things are not as bad as we sometimes think, at least in terms of the diversity (I'm using this word as it should be used!) of weaponry available to the average person, for reasonable prices.

I really, really do hope that the positive attitude rubs off on our congresscritters, but I am less sanguine about that. If Mr. Bush would push for 2A rights in the same way that he prosecuted the war effort, I'd feel a LOT better. But I'm not holding my breath on that one.

But then, if all of us keep the pressure on, with lots of letters, phone calls, faxes & emails, Mr. Bush and Congress may yet decide it's in their best interests to rescind those un-Constitutional laws violating our Second Amendment guaranteed rights.

Wow. Wouldn't it be great if even those of us living in the PRK, or New Yawk, or even the murder capitol of the world Washington DC, could keep and bear arms like the Framers intended!

What a lovely dream. I dream it often.

Esky
who wishes Feinswein & Boxer would emigrate (to anywhere else but Australia, I've got friends here that don't need them either)
 
In Illinois we're still depressed

About all we have to celebrate in the last few years is that Daley didn't get all of his latest round of state wide gun control legislation passed with a rubber stamp legislature.

Otherwise ther is still no light at the end of the tunnel.

One of these days we need a real Republican party that doesn't play patty cake with Chicago before they do anything.

Woe is us ... for now anyway.

Don P.
 
There are, indeed, a couple of ways of looking at things related to guns. First is to look solely at gun rights (or lack thereof) and to become depressed. Mr. Ross has correctly pointed out that this should not be the only point of view. The second way is to look only at what is available for purchase (assuming that your local jurisdiction allows it, or that you can afford it after misc. gov't intrusions into the supply side of the supply-demand equation), information available, etc. As with gun rights, tunnel-vision in this regard is also incorrect.

From the latter perspective, we are clearly better off. There are a wealth of choices in handguns, rifles and shotguns that just weren't there 70, 40 or 20 years ago. And, yes, concealed carry was never as widespread since about 1900 as it is now. Further, there is a wealth of information out there on guns, whether it be monthly/quarter publications, books, internet sites describing the manufacture or burying of arms for the "inevitable SHTF" episode in the future, etc. BUT ...

IMHO it matters little to most people what is available, if those goods are either outlawed now for them (e.g. >15 round magazines in NJ), or very possibly will (given current trends) someday be outlawed ("sniper" rifles, .50s, "assault" weapons, etc. - whatever Feinstein, Schumer, Hitlery, Sarah Brady, etc. can think of). Yes, we have more stuff in our gunsafes, closets, waistbands, gardens, etc. than ever before - but the slow and inexorable creep of gun bans throughout the country tends to depress those of us who follow such things. Further, the gun culture, as Mr. Ross so eloquently described it in Unintended Consequences, is dying a slow death due to the constant anti-gun diatribes of the media and the schools. Finally, while it is great to be able to carry concealed, one must (outside of Vermont and Alaska, two of the lowest population states) get a license and be on a list. If a gun confiscation scenario ever unfolds, guess who "they" will start with?

Unless John Ross is thinking of some scenario like he put forth in his book, then ultimately it doesn't matter if some manufacturer can make a 20mm recoil-less handgun that can't miss its target because of some super advanced targeting system, weighs 10-ounces and costs $5.00 - if it is illegal to buy or own such a device, it simply doesn't matter.

I know that Mr. Ross is simply trying to get everyone in the pro-gun camp to look at the bright side, but we should always remember the dark side - the legal climate regarding guns is, at best, uncertain. I dread the day when we get another Dem in the White House with control over both houses of Congress - you can kiss your gun rights good bye, forever (unless there's a 2nd revolution or a 2nd Civil War, and no sane person wants one of those).

By the way, kudos to Mr. Ross for his book. I found it very entertaining and very informative. I hope that lots of people in government found a need for Imodium and/or Nytol after reading it - and I'm sure that this was exactly Ross' intention in writing it (besides making a few bucks, and nothing is wrong with that). Perhaps books like his (and another one, Enemies Foreign and Domestic by Matt Bracken is due out soon), other information published over the years and/or available over the Internet, and the sheer number of gunowners and guns (perhaps 85-90 million and 250 million +, respectively) will preclude the possibility of a SHTF scenario. I certainly hope so.
 
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The first thing I noticed is 1932: "MAGNUM FACTORY RIFLES: None.
",

I'm not sure of exact dates for the express/nitro express rifle cartridges but I do know that Holland & Holland patented the belted cartridge case in 1904.
 
IMO, the only way to look at it in terms of "progress" is what can the average consumer (i.e. without a special Class XYZ license) buy vs. what can a soldier get. This is how the issue of gun rights has always been framed. ("Well-regulated militia," right?)

At the turn of the 20th century, a resident of this country could pretty much get his hands on whatever the Army could. That gap has been widening ever since.

The fact that we are able to buy so many excellent weapons is more a testimony to the general progress of materials engineering than anything else. Ever since polymers came into their own and Glock invented their marvelous little Model 17, the handgun world has been turned upside down.
 
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