Larry Vickers & Ken Hackathorn on the HK45

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HK-Freak

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If you don't know who LAV and KH are, you're wrong.



Here's the whole transcript...

http://pistol-training.com/articles/hk45-interview-with-ken-hackathorn-and-larry-vickers



Here's a short excerpt...

Todd: How would you compare the HK45 to a top-quality custom 1911?

Ken: You’ve got a pistol one half or even one third the price of a top 1911 pistol today that is more reliable and every bit as accurate. For most anybody I can imagine if you said you need a pistol to stake your life on and you’re going to be someplace you can’t run to a pistolsmith every time you need it, if your choice is between an HK45 and a 1911 and you don’t take the HK45, you’re ****’ing brain dead.

Larry: Yeah, I agree 100%. Ken is spot on. For the average guy, it’s a far better choice. The 1911 is an enthusiast’s pistols. In order to keep that gun running you have to, it’s not optional, you have to become your own armorer to a degree. You have to be able to diagnose and fix minor problems on an end user level. If you’re not willing to sign up for that, frankly you have no business running a 1911 for anything other than occasional recreational shooting. If you’re going to put yourself in harm’s way with that gun and you’re not willing to sign up for that, then you need to avoid it. The HK45 is clearly the better choice. For the overwhelming number of people who feel like they need to have a .45 the only two real choices are the M&P45 and the HK45 and push come to shove if I’ve got to trust my life to one or the other, it would be the HK45.

We both are in agreement that if you had to go to Afghanistan for a year with just a handful of spare parts, what do you have confidence in getting the job done? The HK45. That would be my first choice. I think it is the most bomb-proof service pistol on the market. And we just saw SEAL Team Six go with the HK45 Compact for those reasons.
 
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Larry Vickers often recommends the Glock, but I am under the impression he prefers it in 9mm (He has his own Glock extended mag release through Tango Down). Also, Larry had a hand in the overall design of the HK45, and I believe this interview came from a recent 50,000 round torture test of the HK45 going at least 7000 rounds between cleanings.
 
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What about the .45auto that invented the word reliability...??? The Sig P220 just happen to slip through the cracks in their minds....?
 
Larry had a hand in the overall design of the HK45, and I believe this interview came from a recent 50,000 round torture test of the HK45 going at least 7000 rounds between cleanings.
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Which makes him somewhat less than objective IMHO. As others have pointed out Larry Vickers & Ken Hackathorn both work for HK. They have a vested interest in recommending this pistol. It does not invalidate the fact that the HK45 is a good if not great pistol it is simply a fact that needs to be considered.

I think that their glowing recommendation also has to be taken within the context of the statement. They are couching their statements quiet a bit.

If you’re going to put yourself in harm’s way with that gun and you’re not willing to sign up for that, then you need to avoid it.
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In the end the HK45 is a good if not great gun but there is no one size fits all pistols. I liked the HK45 I had. Sold it because I like 1911s better which in the end is the most important thing for me. :)
 
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Wow. I'll be keeping my 1911. Thanks anyway.

HK45 feels like an old fashioned DA/SA gun to me.
-bad SA pull when compared to 1911's.
-good DA pull, not as good as Kahr.
-fat
-harder to conceal than a 1911.
-feels good in my hand, nice fat grip and all.

I don't get it.....maybe I'm just biased against DA/SA guns? :rolleyes:

Now the P7 is a thing of beauty.
 
Vickers was SpecOps-Delta. Renowned 45/1911 gunsmith. One of the principal designers of the HK45. He knows of, therefore, what he speaks. But I will keep my National Match.__________________
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I do not think people are questioning Vicker's qualifications its his motives that might be in question.
 
Larry Vickers quoted from OP
The 1911 is an enthusiast’s pistols. In order to keep that gun running you have to, it’s not optional, you have to become your own armorer to a degree. You have to be able to diagnose and fix minor problems on an end user level. If you’re not willing to sign up for that, frankly you have no business running a 1911 for anything other than occasional recreational shooting. If you’re going to put yourself in harm’s way with that gun and you’re not willing to sign up for that, then you need to avoid it.
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While I grew up with the 1911, after I really began to study the gun and it's abilities, I've come to agree with this. I've shot them as duty guns and for training and have found them to be jealous mistresses when it comes to attention. I still own them, but they are surely not the first I would pickup when answering the door (I actually pick up a S&W M-696)

I do agree that the two top choices in a .45ACP pistol for hard use are the M&P45 and the HK45...and this is from someone who last carried a Sig 220 as a duty gun and teaches with a Sig 220ST
 
Curious if Larry has ties to Smith and Wesson as well since he brought up the M&P45.
 
Just as a rule of thumb, 50-65K rounds a year...about what you would expect Spec Op or SWAT guys to use in practice, maybe serious USPSA competitors
 
Just as a rule of thumb 50-65K rounds a year
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Using that rough number what % of shooters/gun owners would you put in that category?

What % of "enthusiasts" would you put in that category.

I consider my self and enthusiasts but I am no where near that a year total round let alone through 1 gun.
 
I've heard Vickers refer to the G17 as (to him) the worlds most perfect fighting pistol.

He understands his reputation and opinion (and their subsequent value) are scrutinized when he speaks. That he is not hocking Hi-Points or Rossis is what keeps people from thinking he's sold out.

While he may have assisted with R&D for the HK and while he also assisted in creating a beautiful 1911 presented to President Bush he left the smithing of his personal carry HK to one David Bowie of Bowie Tactical who favors the M&P. Go figure.
 
It's awesome how so many guys on THR know more than a guy who was in charge of product testing and acquisition for Delta Force, and a former Special Forces operator who is currently an FBI SWAT and HRT instructor. I also had no idea that people who consult gun manufacturers receive royalty checks for every gun they sell. :rolleyes:
 
HK freak stop being a shill. Your bias is showing. We read your screen name you like HK we get it. You really are not improving your image by pandering to your favorite pistol maker.
 
The 1911 was designed ca. 1910 I would hope modern H&K would be just as accurate and more reliable weapon.:uhoh: I have held $1500 Les Baer and as anyone would expect in terms of fit and finish it was head and shoulders above H&K .45Auto.
 
HK-Freak said:
It's awesome how so many guys on THR know more than a guy who was in charge of product testing and acquisition for Delta Force, and a former Special Forces operator who is currently an FBI SWAT and HRT instructor. I also had no idea that people who consult gun manufacturers receive royalty checks for every gun they sell. :rolleyes:
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So, which one did you say you like better? You're being far too subtle for me to figure it out.

I'm a 1911 guy myself, but I can afford to be (what with the not rescuing hostages or putting 65,000 rounds down range/yr).

Different strokes for different folks.
 
Yeah, I agree 100%. Ken is spot on. For the average guy, it’s a far better choice. The 1911 is an enthusiast’s pistols. In order to keep that gun running you have to, it’s not optional, you have to become your own armorer to a degree. You have to be able to diagnose and fix minor problems on an end user level. If you’re not willing to sign up for that, frankly you have no business running a 1911 for anything other than occasional recreational shooting.
Click to expand...

I agree 100% and Im a 1911 fanboy who has several $2k 1911s. I also love the H&K 45. The only downside IMO is it is a little large to CCW but it can be done.

Also Larry Vickers builds custom 1911s when he has time that sell for several thousand dollars.

THIS IS MOST DEFINATLEY NOT A CASE OF SOMEONE JUST TRYING TO SELL THIER DESIGN.
 
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