LEO BUG

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petro

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I've just accepted an offer for an LEO job here in SE PA. I'm looking for a piece to possibly serve as a BUG for on duty, and an alternative for off duty. I currently shoot a P99 9mm, and my on duty issued weapon will be a G23, in a .40. I would prefer this BUG/off duty to be a .40 as well, but I will look at 9mm too.

Funds wise, I'm looking at about $300

Any Ideas?
 
Get a "Glock forty" if for no other reason than we one day might see you on the internet after having a AD in a school room while teaching kids gun safety:neener: :D :D .
 
Make sure they will allow you to carry whatever you want before you make a purchase.

With that said, I think having the common caliber of .40 is a very good idea. Having the common mag, as suggested above is also a good idea.
 
I spent 31 years in law enforcement, and initially carried .38 revolvers....an issued S&W model 15 and an authorized "bug" that was a S&W model 36. The 36 was "retired" when the model 60 came out (stainless steel).

When my department transitioned to pistols, I still carried the model 60 as a "bug". It was small enough to carry, and was still "enough" power for its intended purpose....a close-in "bug" for last resort purposes.

I've known 4 officers who have had to go to their "bug", and ALL of them were carrying "snubby" .38 special revolvers. They are ALL still alive, and their "bug" shootings proved to be effective.

There ain't NOTHING wrong with revolvers for "bug" purposes! Just realize that they aren't AS accurate as your primary weapon, but they will "do" at close-in "belly-gun" shooting!
 
Forget ammo commonality as you won't likely be carrying loose ammo. I can see an advantage there only if your department will supply ammo if it is .40S&W but not for a 9mm, .38spl, .45acp, etc. If that is the case I can see going for a .40 only, otherwise go for the best overall gun or for magazine commonality.

If it was me in your situation I think my first choice would be the Glock 27. If your G23 issue weapon fails but you still have mags left the ammo in them would be useless unless the mags will also work in your BUG- the Glock 27 can use the mags from the larger Glock .40s. It will also be easier than a different design to transition to mid-shooting. It is the same MOA and the feel and sight picture will be very similar to the larger Glocks.

If you don't feel that is much of a consideration, there are many good .40S&W and 9mm BUGs out there now that the CCW age is a couple decades old. The Kahr K9, K40, MK9 or MK40 are very good guns, and if you need lighter consider the P9 or PM9. I love my Taurus PT140 Milennium Pro, the Milennium Pro line are very good pistols and will be very near your price range (the Glock and Kahr will not). The Kel-tec P11 has a good following and will be under your desired price range.

You should also consider the small J-frame snubbies. They aren't easy to become particularly accurate with them, but then they are mostly for close in use anyway. New, you can easily get a Taurus 85 (.38spl) or Taurus 605 (.357mag) for your price range. Used, you can definately get the steel S&Ws and you may be able to pick up an alloy 642 or 442 for $300 or less (S&W has been discounting them lately so you can get one new for only a little more than your limit).
 
The department will supply all the .40 ammo I need. I do need to qualify with anything I choose to carry off duty, which would possible include the new BUG, and my P99.

All good suggestions so far. The G27 is out for price. I'm pretty much limited to the $300. I'll look into the others...

Thanks all!
 
For $300 and less I have to go with a snubbie. For what it's intended for it's plenty accurate. If you ever end up having more funds to work with a baby glock, or possibly a P7/P10 are great choices, a P7M8 is my backup gun. It's nice to have a BUG that's compact but still has a full size barrel.

-Jenrick
 
1. Get something with the same manual of arms as your primary, unless you plan on practicing extensively with both.

2. Plan on practicing extensively with both, anyway. ;) This still does not make #1 a bad idea. The "baby" version of your primary is a really good idea.

3. If you cannot afford it, wait a few paychecks. Do it right the first time.

4. Snub-nosed .38s/.357s are about the ideal BUG. They're sized right, they go bang every time, the manual of arms is dirt simple (the original point and click interface) and essentially the same as any non C&L primary, and they're powerful.

5. Ammo/magazine commonality is a nice plus, but hardly a dealbreaker. I carry a 4506 and use a 642 as a BUG.

6. Invest in a quality holster. Explaining to your supervisor how your BUG went AWOL on a footchase would not be fun. The Galco Ankle Glove is what I use, and it is rock solid.

7. Make sure your PD will approve whatever it is you decide to carry.

Assuming I had $300 on hand and I was allowed to carry a snubby .38 or .357 as a BUG, I would shop around for a lightly used J-frame, get it, and save up a few more bones for the Galco holster (assuming you want it on your ankle), and then a little bit more for an IWB one for OD.

My very close second choice would be the baby glock.

Do not skimp on the leather.

Mike
 
another vote for the G27. Although I carry a G26 as a 'concerned citizen', I think the G27 would a perfect off-duty match for a G23 or G22.
 
Coronach is a LEO who has BTDT for what you are about to be doing. He has much wisdom.

Still...
Assuming I had $300 on hand and I was allowed to carry a snubby .38 or .357 as a BUG, I would shop around for a lightly used J-frame, get it, and save up a few more bones for the Galco holster (assuming you want it on your ankle), and then a little bit more for an IWB one for OD.
Click to expand...

I love my snubbies, and I do have an IWB for one (when in PA it is often IWB paired with another lightweight snubbie in my pocket). But, I'm thinking with the Glock 23 as his issue weapon that should also be his main OD pistol. A lot of non-LEO folks seem to carry the G23 or G19 as their CCW pistols. IWB it seems a good size for a primary carry for a non-LEO CCW or LEO OD pistol. The snub seems more suited for backup and/or ultra-deep concealment when the larger pistol just won't do. I think if it was me I'd spend the $ on a nice IWB for the G23 first (I'm assuming most police departments let you carry your issued pistol when off duty of course) and get a cheaper pocket holster for the snub (you can get a DeSantis leather pocket holster for the snubs for under $30).

I also want to reiterate my advice to check out the Taurus PT140 Milennium Pro if the price limit is pretty hard and fast. MD prices are pretty high and I only had to pay about $30 more than petro's limit for mine. It is accurate, it feels well made, and it has been 100% reliable through the 640 rounds I've put through it (many of them JHPs of 3 different makes and designs). The snub does have one big advantage over the M. Pro though, it is much better suited to pocket carry (especially in the lighter weight aluminum versions).
 
I was a LEO for over 35 yrs. Carried the blued S&W 49 for a bit over 20 yrs. I then got the 649 and carried it for the remainder with the 49 being used for a 2nd squad car gun. I carried them everyday, all the time, for backup / second / undercover / off duty. They tend to conceal a shade better than models like the Glock 26/27 since there are no sharp corners. As Oldtimer and Coronach said the J frames have worked well for a lot of years. They're about as reliable of a gun as you'll find anywhere.

649-49.jpg
 
For me, the perfect BUG would be a lightweight snubby in 357 mag. My thinking being that if I ever had to draw that thing it would be a close quarter last resort, gut shot and I could fire that wheelgun through a vest or trouser pocket if I had to.
 
First, congratulations on the new job.

Second, my first semi-auto duty weapon was a GLOCK 22 and my off duty/undercover weapon was a GLOCK 27. In your case I think it would make sense to go with a model 27 to back up your 23. The fact that the magazines from the 22 could be used in the 27 was a great benefit.

However, I am with Oldtimer that you should consider a snub-nosed revolver as a possible back-up/off duty gun. They are super easy to conceal and carry and they are great in an emergency. The hammerless models like the S&W 640 or 642 are great. Once I retired and could carry anything I wanted, I went back to revolvers and now carry a S&W model 640 loaded with Speer Gold Dot 135 grain .38 Spl. +P rounds.
 
The G27 is the obvious logistical choice, but I don't think you'll find one for $300. The Kel Tec P11 has a .40 conversion available from time to time, but they don't make the P40 anymore. It's about the best under $300 compact auto available, best off duty gun period in the price range IMHO. But, I think I'd budget a little more for the G27 for the same manual of arms as your duty gun and the compatibility with your duty magazines. That one there is a no brainer way I see it.

Trying to approach this logically, without gun prejudice. :D
 
I'm pretty much limited to the $300.
Get a used S&W 642. For a BUG, you want something light enough to always carry with you, and something that will always go "bang" when you pull the trigger.
Nothing beats the 642 for that purpose (unless its the 342 ;) ). Lightweight. Can wear it on your ankle or throw it in your pocket. I work in law enforcement (10 years now), and can't tell you how many cops I've known who carry one.
It is the "go-to" BUG.
-David
P.S. Be safe out there. And remember, when in doubt, its better to be tried by twelve than carried by six.
 
ISP 2605,

How did you manage to keep the finish that nice after 20 years of use? I also carried one of these fine revolvers for years, both on, and off duty, and later as a second in the cruiser case, and mine doesnt look nearly as good as yours!:eek:
 
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factory direct LEO price from glock on the G27 is $398 with fixed sights.... must be on department letterhead and will be shipped ONLY to the department, not to an FFL or any individual officers.
 
I would suggest that you contact whoever is in charge of training at your new place of employment and see what they advise. Some agencys have approved lists of weapons for off duty/backup duty. That being said, I think that you should be able to locate a used Glock 27 for around $300.00
 
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