Lights and feeders at night for pigs

[Double Naught Spy]

I haven't really noticed one color of light inducing more "eye shine" than another, that seems to be more a feature of angle than anything else. Hogs lack a "tapetum" and their eyes don't reflect light anyway (as do Deer, Raccoons, etc), so you're lucky if you get much shine from the lens.

I don't know about visible light, but hog eyes do a fine job of reflecting IR light as seen with night vision. Fernando's pic shows this as well.

What you already have is more than sufficient. Learn the anatomy of the hogs. Their vitals aren't located in their body the same place as a deer. Avoid frontal head shots.

No reason to avoid frontal head shots. Just don't take the shot when they are looking right at you as you may end up with a shot that glances due to the acute angle of the skull relative to the trajectory of the bullet. If the hog's nose is down, the frontal is nearly vertical and the glance issue is mitigated.

 

[FLAvalanche]

Just don't take the shot when they are looking right at you

Which is what I meant. I could have articulated that better.

 

[Fernando]

Quoting Cosmoline: “... is a Mercedes?? What? That entire concept, and the photo of a Mercedes being used as some kind of off-road hog hunting vehicle, is hurting my mind very much. Are you going out there in suits with briefcases? Are you putting the hogs in the trunk?”

Yap, Mercedes, especially the older ones, are great off road vehicles.




And boars don’t mind traveling in the trunk, at least the ones I kill. And as you see, there is room in there for two pigs at least, or for a small rino, lololol




Meanwhile I found a picture of the 1,5-6x42 scope I had some years ago. At the time it was hanging on a streyr mannlicher sbs96 30.06 bolt action (previously was attached to a .300 win mag Winchester).




And talking about pics, I recently created a website called “As fotos escritas” or, in english, “The written photos” and launched many photos and small texts. The texts are obviously in Portuguese, as it is my native language, but you have there tons of images of landscapes, animals, bugs and other things, all taken by me with a Canon 350D. Use the menus on the left and then click the small photos on the right (they will enlarge if you keep clicking). It will only show up to 20 pics per page, so you may have to scroll down using the arrow.

Here is link to a pic of a boar:
http://asfotosescritas.net/index.php?it=278&sit=&img_esc=3&l=0

Normal link to the site: www.asfotosescritas.net

Have fun

 

[flipajig]

Years ago we used to spot light Jackrabits they were like wild pigs verry distrutive. we used Ruger 10-22 and 3-9x40 scopes worked like a charm. the larger front lense would gather more light this is what we had so that is what we used also snow on the ground and a full moon really helps. But we dont get much snow in TEXAS..

 

[Flintknapper]

Flint wrote:

I haven't really noticed one color of light inducing more "eye shine" than another, that seems to be more a feature of angle than anything else. Hogs lack a "tapetum" and their eyes don't reflect light anyway (as do Deer, Raccoons, etc), so you're lucky if you get much shine from the lens.

Double Naught Spy replied:

I don't know about visible light, but hog eyes do a fine job of reflecting IR light as seen with night vision. Fernando's pic shows this as well.

Flint wrote:

I don’t know that Fernando’s pic were taken under those conditions, he doesn’t say. However…if his camera does not have a Hot Mirror Filter to filter out IR or Near IR light.. then most photos taken under low light conditions will record it.

Even if his camera is filtered….some IR gets through the CCD.

But, that has nothing to do with the point I trying to make.

In order to clarify…I will reword what I wrote, since the original could be misunderstood (my bad).

The eyes of all mammals (if undamaged), are capable of reflecting available light under low light conditions. The lens alone will do this to varying degrees. How pronounced it is… (the reflection we see) depends more on intensity of the light and the angle of incidence….than it does on color alone.

Also, hogs lack a “Tapetum” (a reflective layer found behind or within the retina) as Deer, Cats, Dogs, Raccoons have.

So……. don’t expect to see THAT kind of eye shine with hogs...no matter what you use.

Hopefully, this explanation (however remedial) …will better make my point.

Thanks,

Flint.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The eyes of all mammals (if undamaged), are capable of reflecting available light under low light conditions. The lens alone will do this to varying degrees. How pronounced it is… (the reflection we see) depends more on intensity of the light and the angle of incidence….than it does on color alone.

So……. don’t expect to see THAT kind of eye shine with hogs...no matter what you use.

Hopefully, this explanation (however remedial) …will better make my point.

That sort of eyeshine is what I do see regularly with NG gear and IR lights, so it is something I do expect to see. Hogs may not have a tapetum, but IR reflects very well.

You don't get that sort of reflection with human eyes.

I am still trying to understand how it is that the lens is reflecting the light. You certainly may get some reflection off of a cornea, but I am not understanding how the light is reflecting off of the lens.

 

[Freedom_fighter_in_IL]

Maybe it is just because my eyes are damaged and maybe filter things differently than normal, but that is the kind of eye shine I see when I use green light on hogs. My Red vision sucks, where you see red (in real world lighting not on a monitor) I see almost a grey. Yes on an LCD monitor I can actually differentiate (damn I spelled that correctly!) red color. Now to me THAT is strange. You shine a red light in my face or on the ground and it looks almost grey but if you put up a red color on a monitor I can actually see it. I have never hog hunted with NV equipment so I couldn't tell you what it looks like to me, but with a green lens 12v wheat light, to me, their eyes light up just like a deer or a dog.

 

[Fernando]

Ai ai! The picture of the 8 small boars was taken with my Wildview 5mp IR and it’s the only stealth camera I got. The flash is IR (tiny red leds) and when it is dark a round filter elevates and cover the objective. But anyway, the eyes of the pigs shine when I light up the IR illuminator of my Yukon Sentinel 3x60 or the IR illuminator of my Yukon Ranger 5x42.

Another wildview pic:

 

[Flintknapper]

Double N/S wrote:

That sort of eyeshine is what I do see regularly with NG gear and IR lights, so it is something I do expect to see. Hogs may not have a tapetum, but IR reflects very well.

Perhaps with NG and IR lights. The very nature of NG is centered around multiplying the available light.

Also, with Fernando's pic(s) an IR flash was used and many digital cameras will pick up IR depending upon how they are filtered. The pic represents what the CAMERA can see... not what the unaided human eye can see.

The subject of the OP's original post was about about feeder lights (using visible light), how we got off onto IR and hunting by Moonlight....I don't know, but the mods have been generous to allow additional information and tangents.
(Thank you)

You don't get that sort of reflection with human eyes.

Nope, humans and most primates pretty much come in last (right behind hogs) for reflection from the eyes. Lemur's are an exception because they do have a tapetum.

I am still trying to understand how it is that the lens is reflecting the light.
You certainly may get some reflection off of a cornea, but I am not understanding how the light is reflecting off of the lens.

A hogs eye is capable of reflecting light (depending on the angle) from several sources starting at the wetted surface (tears that lubricate the cornea), next the cornea itself (which is simply the external lens), next the iris (depending upon pigmentation and light intensity), then the crystalline lens (which fine tunes the focus, least likely to reflect, but does), then finally the retina.

How much "eye shine" and which component of the eye most responsible for it...is a discussion we need take up in a separate thread. And I would love to discuss a Pigs Vision with you, (have PM'd you before requesting that).

So....I will reiterate, I am not saying a hog's eyes do NOT shine, I am simply saying the do NOT shine anything similar to the other common animals we see at night...that do have a tapetum, its physically impossible (all other conditions being the same).

In laymen's terms....that was the point of my initial post. At a "feeder" you are not concerned with being able to see the eyes of a hog anyway...if your light is stationed at that point, you will be able to see the body of the animal (your target).

In FFIL's case....he is basically Red Colorblind under field conditions...so a green light might be best for him.

Fernando can not legally use artificial lights at all, so he must rely on good optics combined with moonlight and weather conditions, unless NV is not a restriction.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The subject of the OP's original post was about about feeder lights (using visible light), how we got off onto IR and hunting by Moonlight....I don't know,

Actually, the OP didn't limit the discussion to visible light. He asked if anyone had experience using feeder lights and noted that he had read that red and green lights don't bother hogs as much as white light. He then posted a NV image from his camera.

Flint stated in response to DNS's comment on IR light being reflected from pig's eye as with with night vision...

So……. don’t expect to see THAT kind of eye shine with hogs...no matter what you use.

Well, we use night vision and you said we can't expect to see eyeshine no matter what we use, yet there it is. Then after seeing multiple pics of IR light being reflected off pigs' eyes, Flint said,....

Perhaps with NG and IR lights. The very nature of NG is centered around multiplying the available light.

So we go from being told to not expect such reflection no matter what we use, to it perhaps working with NG (NV?). There is no "perhaps" about it.

Then NV was apparently dismissed because it does something not right. It multiplies available light. I have news for you. Any time a lens is used to concentrate light to a smaller area than from which the light was sampled, you have amplified the light. Virtually all cameras that use a lens to concentrate a field of view down to a very small area (film or photoreceptors in a digital camera) are using relative amplification.

After Flint stated that the light reflected from a pig comes from the lens, DNS said...

I am still trying to understand how it is that the lens is reflecting the light.
You certainly may get some reflection off of a cornea, but I am not understanding how the light is reflecting off of the lens.

Flint replied...

A hogs eye is capable of reflecting light (depending on the angle) from several sources starting at the wetted surface (tears that lubricate the cornea), next the cornea itself (which is simply the external lens), next the iris (depending upon pigmentation and light intensity), then the crystalline lens (which fine tunes the focus, least likely to reflect, but does), then finally the retina.

Okay, so above it was just light reflecting off the lens. Now, it is off several structures of the eye including the one that that reflects the least and functions to focus light that passes through it, the lens.

Your adaptive abilities are impressive.

 

[Flintknapper]

DNS wrote:

Your adaptive abilities are impressive

No adaptation going on, just an effort to clarify/expand for the sake of the readership, forced by your relentless Nit Picking and challenges.

Everyone seems to be following along just fine except you.

Any "abilities" I might have.....pale in comparison to your desire to be argumentative....and your need to show us what you know (or think you know).

But, Thank you....for your posts, as you have exposed yourself quite well.

Hopefully a mod will administer the "Coup de grace" to this thread, since it has degraded to silly argument.... void of any substance.

Now, run along....and find another thread to derail. I'll provide the popcorn.


Regards,

Flint.

 

[Blue Brick]

Yap, Mercedes, especially the older ones, are great off road vehicles.

How???

 

[Freedom_fighter_in_IL]

They are pretty heavy and have pretty hefty suspension Brick. Most of the older ones had positive differentials so you got pretty good traction as well. You have to remember they are designed in Germany, LOTS of slow in Germany and not near the snow removal they have in the states so they always designed that into their passenger cars.

 

[Blue Brick]

OK, thx.

 

[Fernando]

How are Mercedes, especially the older ones, great off road vehicles?

They have very simple but highly reliable engines that keep on running no matter what if you keep the diesel in the tank. And it does that with mechanical parts and not electronic junk.




Below the engine you have a steel plate so you can hit rocks without break or make holes in important parts; they have a phenomenal suspension that allow us to seat our asses comfortable even in rough terrain and they manage to do that with no jingle noises (mine has 28 years and more than 1.000.000km and no parasite noises from plastics or other loose ****s). Those things can cruise on snow, sand and shallow water lololol.

The germans used to build great cars. Nowadays a new Mercedes stops on the highway and no one knows why, and there is nothing you or other guy from miles around can do to get that piece of crap running again. Older ones just don’t break. Electronics gave us allot of luxuries, but delivered us a big bag of troubles too.

And you want to know something funny about cars and innovations? I also have a Mitsubishi. But instead of being made in Japan was assembled in Netherlands with a Volvo S40 chassis (Swedish) and a French Renault turbo charged diesel engine. It only drinks 5 liters for each 100km (and it flies!) but I cannot cross a small river with it. But I can, if I take the 28 years old Mercedes instead lolol

 

[alsaqr]

Fernando:

This is that last big boar that i killed.

http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=6917170#post6917170

 

[Fernando]

!Huge boar, Alsaqr!!! I can’t even imagine what a .50 cal is! We cannot use such calibers here Not even in short guns like pistols and revolvers - civilians are only allow to carry small arms in very special cases and we are limited to 6.35mm (.25) in pistols and .32 in revolvers. Only security forces and the militaries can use bigger calibers in small fire arms.

 

[alsaqr]

!Huge boar, Alsaqr!!! I can’t even imagine what a .50 cal is!

Fernando: Its a .50 caliber muzzleloading rifle.

 

[47dodge]

alsaqr ..that is a nice looking kill...did you eat it..

I have been hog hunting a few times .but not at dark..i see where they have been but never seen one yet....I like the mercedes...My sons first car was a 69 280s with a gas engine and 2. 2 barrel carbs and an aotomatic ..still have it,,,been tweaking on the thing to make it run a bit better....he is 17 now..

 

[harryheadshot]

have you guys been to elusivewildlife.com, they"ve got some really trick kill lights and their not that expensive at all, I was considering trying to use one of their set-ups and bait some yotes in. You all think it'd work?