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Long Range Rifle/Scope/PRS question(s)

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Walkalong, Dec 21, 2018.

  1. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    Which brings up another question, are there any scopes being discussed that do not have enough elevation on the reticle to hold for 1200 yards?
     
  2. taliv

    taliv Moderator Staff Member

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    lol yeah. i forgot he was going for production class. i thought we were just trying to stay in a budget

    i wouldn't get too spun up over production class. heck, they change the classes almost every year when they change ownership. if you come in 2nd place in production class and 58th place in the match, you're still going to be the 58th guy to walk the prize table most places. it won't change how much fun you have shooting the stages.

    at that distance, the challenge is field of view and the thickness of the reticle. at 35x the FOV in my NF allows me to see 5 mils of reticle. at 25x, it's 8 mils and at 15x it's 13 mils. my 6.5x47 needs 11.1 mils to get to 1200, but holding at the bottom of the FOV isn't optimal for lots of reasons.
    I'd say with a lot of scopes with smaller FOV, you'd need to dial down to 12x or so to be able to hold that. and to my old eyes, more magnification is welcome at that distance, to see impact if nothing else.
    however, in MOST situations, your targets might be something like 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1200. so you might dial for 800, which is 5.6, and so i'd only hold up 5.5mil for the 1200 target. and then i'd hold UNDER 4 mils for the 400 yard target which is 1.7. hopefully that makes sense
     
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  3. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    It does, thanks.

    Another question, zero. From what I read most folks zero their rifles at a "short" distance. What distances are common/advisable?
     
  4. LoonWulf
    • Contributing Member

    LoonWulf Contributing Member

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    It's built on the premier action rather than the B-14 the regular HMR uses. That comes with some special features and components. I've only handled a premier series rifle, never shot one, but it felt nicer than my already nice b-14.
     
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  5. taliv

    taliv Moderator Staff Member

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    i don't know anyone who zeros at other than 100 yards.
     
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  6. Bayourambler

    Bayourambler Member

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    My dad bought a Begara B 14 about 2 months ago in 6.5 cm. I shot it a couple of weeks ago and I'm very impressed with the level of quality for the price. It has a good trigger, stock, and smooth action. We didnt have much time to mess with it so we tryed 3 different loads we made up with some 129 sst's, and it stacked them real nice. .75" at 100. These rifles seem to be high quality for the price. As far as Ruger, I have not seen great accuracy on there Hawkeye's and predator's. I never shot one of their higher end rifles.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2018
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  7. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    My FN-SPR .308 is zeroed at 300 for the 300 yard F-Class with reduced targets I tried at our local range, and can be held under/over for anything to 500 easily without any dialing. Popping feral pigs isn't exactly precision though, and only have access to just under 500 yards for that. Just never got around to playing with dialing for the distance.

    Makes sense though if you are going to dial for distance, including what you described for dialing some and holding under for the rest.
     
  8. Txhillbilly

    Txhillbilly Member

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    Staying with the $2k rifle guideline,I'd say look at PVA's custom "John Hancock" rifle. They came out with it to compete in the Production class in PRS.
    https://patriotvalleyarms.com/john-hancock-bolt-action-rifle-deposit/

    For Optics,you might look at Athlon's Cronus BTR line to get the most for your money,and stay under $2k. I have one,and it doesn't give up much to my $3k scopes,and it's a well built scope with good usable reticle choices,and a great warranty if ever needed.
    https://athlonoptics.com/product-category/rifle-scopes/cronus-btr/
     
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  9. Coal Dragger

    Coal Dragger Member

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    Tikka T3x Tac A1:

    The SAKO TRG 22 barrel screwed into the receiver and the SAKO TRG 22 trigger bolted on the bottom don’t care that the receiver says Tikka on it.

    Comes with a muzzle brake, and currently 3 magazines.
     
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  10. cdb1

    cdb1 Member

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    I’m a member of Texas Hunting Forum and another member who posts a bunch says the same thing. He owns an 800 yard range and is a pretty serious long range shooter.
     
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  11. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    Another very interesting choice. Same stock, same trigger as the Seekins just a different action, maybe barrel. And a couple more caliber choices. Would love to hear more about this one.

    I wonder how the two actions stack up against each other. I wonder how the two companies stack up against each other.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
  12. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    Thanks, yes, they do look like a lot of bang for the buck.
     
  13. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    I have seen that, and it is likely a very good gun, but I find that style of stock unappealing, and would rather stick with the more conventional look.
     
  14. Llama Bob

    Llama Bob Member

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    If the scope is < $2K retail, a US made Steiner T5Xi would be VERY high on my list. I have two of the 3-15s, but would choose the 5-25 for PRS. I don't know what the inflated list is, but it's probably over $2K.

    I've had Burris XTRs. Sold them. Ultimately I decided the glass was a hindrance.

    I want to see the SWFA HD. The fact that retail IS list could be a huge advantage if list pricing is used.
     
  15. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

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    Yup. Zero at 100. It’s ALMOST irrelevant, since we dial our range anyway.

    We aren’t shooting MPBR games here, and rarely shoot under 300-400yrds anyway, so your zero really is ONLY for establishing zero to know your baseline for dialing. The check zero range at most matches (night before, not day of) will be 100yrds almost exclusively, and at most of these, it’s just going to be a bunch of shoot-n-c targets in an array on a white paper backer, without the ability to walk down, so you’ll want to check a dead nuts 100yrd zero - not play some game where you estimate a .2 vs. .15mil high 100yrd impact for your 200yrd zero. It’s amazing how bad a bad zero will ruin your day at 1,000yrds, even on huge targets.
     
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  16. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

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    The John Hancock PVA and the Seekins Havak both use Rock Creek barrels, and they both come with KRG Bravo chassis/stocks and Timney 510 triggers. Both are replaceable bolt heads available in multiple bolt faces. Only difference is the action, both are 700 pattern actions.

    The PVA is a rebranded ARC Nucleus, whereas the Seekins is an in-house designed action. The Nucleus/JHR is a 3 lug action, 60deg controlled round feeder, whereas the Seekins is a 4 mini-lug 90deg push feeder. I own the Seekins, but have handled a Nucleus (was bouncing around lower cost custom actions this summer). They’re both smooth, I might get a little nervous, as I mentioned above, about a controlled round feed rifle for PRS type matches, even if it does allow push feeding, I haven’t found one drop as easily and reliably as a push feeder. Both should feed out of AW mags very well, assuming the Nucleus is cut for them, since they both have a bottom lug to reach down into the mag for improved feeding from AW’s. I didn’t love the bolt stop on the Nucleus, and I do prefer an integral recoil lug, which the Seekins has and the Nucleus does not. Both companies make fantastic products, and while PVA might be a little less solid in market than Seekins, PVA and especially American Rifle Company are more focused on bolt guns, while Seekins is obviously more spread in products. Personally, I like the Seekins action better, but neither is a wrong answer. Seekins still isn’t selling their drop in aftermarket barrels, however, so that’s one bummer. They are telling me a few months out to catch up on inventory.

    The KRG Bravo is an inexpensive chassis - which is to say it really is a plastic stock with an integral bedding block. The only complaint I have heard about the KRG bravo is the plastic feel and the short forend.
     
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  17. z7

    z7 Member

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    If you want the “best” production class rifle, look no further than the John Hancock from PVA
    https://patriotvalleyarms.com/john-hancock-bolt-action-rifle-deposit/

    It’s right at $1999.95 total I believe

    American rifle company nucleus action, rock creek barrel and available in all the favorite prs calibers

    I can’t help with optics, I only have one “nice one” and it’s a vortex razor gen ii 3-18, but I strongly recommend that you make 3 distinct choices when picking a scope

    1st, use a Mil based scope. Most shooters in this game use a mil scope, so talking with each other it really helps, also, my mind works much better on a decimal system, 4.2 miles ups and a .5L wind hold I can remember, 11 and 1/2 Moa up and 1.5 Moa left is weired to me

    2nd- go first focal plane, i rarely shoot on max power and consistent holds are vital in the prs game where you are shooting multiple targets at multiple ranges off of all sorts of support

    3rd, find a reticle that YOU like, it needs to make sense to you, if you love the Horus variants and they make sense to you, go for it. If a simpler reticle speaks to you, get it

    Nightforce, vortex, Kahles and Schmidt are the most popular in the sport but won’t be production class optics

    Nightforce shv 4-16 f1 should be production class though

    I think Burris Xtr lines qualify for the production class (any scope below $2000 mark)
     
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  18. cheygriz

    cheygriz member

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    Too bad you're limited by priced.

    My dream rig (If I won the powerball:D) would be a Georgia Precision "Hospitaller" in .300 WinMag topped with a S&B 5-45X56, 34mm PM ll.
     
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  19. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

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    Fun Fact: GA Precision stands for Gnat’s Ass, not Georgia.
     
  20. cheygriz

    cheygriz member

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    :D Somebody forgot to tell Chris Kyle!:D

    But they sure make some nice rifles!

    I had the pleasure of shooting a few rounds through one of their M40A5 rifles a while back. Kinda the same feeling you get when you drive a Lamborghini around the block!:)
     
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  21. taliv

    taliv Moderator Staff Member

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    imho havak > hancock

    GAP is in KC, MO btw
     
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  22. RugerOldArmy

    RugerOldArmy Member

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    I don't know about the rest of you, but to me that Savage barrel nut is a sexy beast, that makes it so easy to put on a really good barrel.
     
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  23. taliv

    taliv Moderator Staff Member

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    then you'd love AI and impact. they're even easier to change barrels. a tad more $ though lol
     
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  24. RugerOldArmy

    RugerOldArmy Member

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    AI, absolutely!

    Rebarreled frankenSavages, however, have been very good to me.

    AI someday.
     
  25. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

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    The Seekins Havak also have regulated headspacing as well - drop in barrels with consistent shanks. Order a barrel, bingo bango, fits right up, no ugly barrel nut, not gunsmithing costs.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
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