Looking for an inexpensive trap gun - advice??

[Falconeer]

I'm looking for an inexpensive gun to shoot trap with. I'd like to stick to sub $250 if at all possible. Used is fine. I've been concentrating on Remington 870s, but am willing to consider other pumps. Any diamonds in the rough out there, model wise? What are the things to look for? I've been concentrating on 870s with a 30" barrel, but I can't find any locally (still looking but haven't had much luck) and online tends to break my price limit. Any and all suggestions most appreciated.

 

[Preacherman]

Right now is a great time to look for used shotguns: hunting season is just over, and folks are selling off their shotguns until next hunting season. I just picked up a nice Wingmaster for a great price (see here for the gory details). I paid only $175, and for a Wingmaster at that! The Express versions were selling for as little as $125, with cosmetic limitations, but still working fine.

As for a 30" barrel, I don't think you'll find one easily, as those who have them tend to hold on to them. I'd go with the standard 26" or 28" tube, with screw-in chokes if possible (common on Express barrels, but not so much on older Wingmasters). You can look for a 30" barrel as a separate item - again, I just got one for $70 from the same pawnshop where I found my shotgun.

 

[Starter52]

Preacherman has offered you some good advice. I'd go with an 870. Don't be overly concerned about the barrel length. A 26" or 28" barrel will work fine for trap. If you shoot from the 17 yard line (like me) you don't need the extra few inches in the 30" barrel.

Full choke is common in trap, but a lot of the good shooters at my club shoot a modified choke from 17 yards. You can experiment a bit if you get a barrel with screw-in chokes.

 

[Falconeer]

Thanks kindly for the advice! I'm glad to hear the barrel length isn't a 'barrier to entry' at this point. In regards to the 870 Express vs Wingmaster, what's the difference? As Preacherman said, I can always pick up a 30" barrel later on.

 

[New_geezer]

The Wingmaster and the Express are mechanically the same gun, however the Wingmaster typically has some engraving on a blued receiver, has much better wood and most importantly has had all the internal pieces deburred and smoothed out and in general a lot more attention has been paid to the fit and finish. Much of done by hand. Express's IRRC also use some inconsequential plastic parts like in the trigger guard. Classic Wingmasters were smooth and slick right out of the box. The Express takes some extended use before it is as smooth, though you could always take the Express apart yourself and fine finish the internals. While an Express may eventually become as smooth as a Wingmaster it will never look as pretty. The Express is a perfectly good pump but all the extras have been stripped out to get the gun to a low price point.

 

[MAURICE]

The first time I ever shot trap I shot it with my beater Mossberg Model 500A.
Scored a 19/25, IIRC. This is with the stock modified (I think) bbl. No choke tubes. I am sure if I had a tighter choke I would have done a lot better on the fast movers the longer shots. Some of the birds get out there fast.

 

[Falconeer]

The Wingmaster and the Express are mechanically the same gun, however the Wingmaster typically has some engraving on a blued receiver, has much better wood and most importantly has had all the internal pieces deburred and smoothed out and in general a lot more attention has been paid to the fit and finish. Much of done by hand. Express's IRRC also use some inconsequential plastic parts like in the trigger guard. Classic Wingmasters were smooth and slick right out of the box. The Express takes some extended use before it is as smooth, though you could always take the Express apart yourself and fine finish the internals. While an Express may eventually become as smooth as a Wingmaster it will never look as pretty. The Express is a perfectly good pump but all the extras have been stripped out to get the gun to a low price point.

Thanks for the info! It makes the express an option, if nothing better comes along.

 

[Falconeer]

Winchester 1300 for $200 - possibility?

I checked one of the local shops today and found a Winchester 1300 for $200. I believe it's a 30" barrel with removable choke. Very nice condition; almost no wear on the magazine tube. Any pros/cons with the 1300?

 

[Preacherman]

The Winchester 1300 is a perfectly adequate shotgun, but I hesitate to say that it will stand up to intensive long-term use as well as a Remington or a Mossberg. That's not a criticism of the gun - it's just that Remington in particular, and Mossberg in a close second place, have developed stellar reputations for running for years and years and years... There are numerous verified reports of Remington 870's running for over 200,000 rounds without a major rebuild. I don't think the Winchester would come close to that standard! However, if you're not planning on shooting thousands of rounds a year, it's probably a perfectly adequate gun.

One strong point on the Winchester is its very fast cycling - it's claimed to be the fastest-cycling pump shotgun out there, and from the few that I've handled, I see no reason to disbelieve this.

However, the Winchester 1300 is to cease manufacture soon, with the closing of the Winchester plant in Connecticut. It's not known whether production will be resumed elsewhere.

 

[jdseven1]

I just picked up a remington 1100 classic trap at a gun show for $375 it has the monte carlo stock with a 30" barrel. It was in exel cond. I was looking for a 870 or the 1100 the 1100 has a little less of a kick. The few 870's I found we a lower price but they were beat.

 

[riverdog]

My first round of Trap was with an 870 field gun with original wood and 30" fixed full choke. The gun was subsequently modified with a 30" Remchoke Barrel and Briley extended tubes. Stock was replaced with a Wenig New American Style. Another shameless plug from a satisfied customer.

 

[Falconeer]

The Winchester 1300 is a perfectly adequate shotgun, but I hesitate to say that it will stand up to intensive long-term use as well as a Remington or a Mossberg. That's not a criticism of the gun - it's just that Remington in particular, and Mossberg in a close second place, have developed stellar reputations for running for years and years and years... There are numerous verified reports of Remington 870's running for over 200,000 rounds without a major rebuild. I don't think the Winchester would come close to that standard! However, if you're not planning on shooting thousands of rounds a year, it's probably a perfectly adequate gun.

One strong point on the Winchester is its very fast cycling - it's claimed to be the fastest-cycling pump shotgun out there, and from the few that I've handled, I see no reason to disbelieve this.

However, the Winchester 1300 is to cease manufacture soon, with the closing of the Winchester plant in Connecticut. It's not known whether production will be resumed elsewhere.

Thanks again Preacherman! I think I'll keep the 1300 in mind and an eye out for an 870. I'd much prefer finding a solid 870 that I can 'improve' as money becomes available (Morgan pad, better sights, better stock, better barrel, etc). But that 1300 does seem to be a good deal....

 

[Falconeer]

I just picked up a remington 1100 classic trap at a gun show for $375 it has the monte carlo stock with a 30" barrel. It was in exel cond. I was looking for a 870 or the 1100 the 1100 has a little less of a kick. The few 870's I found we a lower price but they were beat.

Congrats on your purchase! I've never warmed up to autos for trap myself. The best trap gun I've ever shot was a Beretta over/under, with my father's 870 Wingmaster Trap as close 2nd.

BTW, he's told me I can have the 870 when I pry it from his cold, dead fingers (replace jeweled box with 870 in that early scene from 'Young Frankenstein').

 

[Falconeer]

Update!

I found a pair of 870s at a local pawn shop. The newer of the two is an Express magnum with plastic stock (and that lockable safety thing) for $250. The older (no lockable safety) is $205 with wood stock. I believe they're 28" barrels, but I didn't measure them when I was there. I called them back when I got home to get serial #s so I could check age and such, but they won't give them out. I found that odd.

Any thoughts, o' collective knowledge of the interweb?

 

[Preacherman]

If the 870 with wood fittings is a Wingmaster, grab it - that's a good price. Worth spending a bit more on to fix it up. However, if it doesn't have screw-in chokes, you may want to wait for a more suitable shotgun, as it's going to cost you to either fit screw-in chokes to the existing barrel, or buy a new barrel.

Your most cost-effective approach for a new gun (and better price than most used Wingmasters) is still going to be Wal-Mart, or something like that, for a new 870 Express, which will include a 26" or 28" barrel with screw-in chokes. An example can be seen here - print out that page, go to your local Wal-Mart, and if they don't have it, they'll be able to order it for you.

(Of course, if you want something absolutely tailor-made for the job, they also offer this one... drool! )

 

[riverdog]

I found a pair of 870s at a local pawn shop. The newer of the two is an Express magnum with plastic stock (and that lockable safety thing) for $250. The older (no lockable safety) is $205 with wood stock. I believe they're 28" barrels, but I didn't measure them when I was there. I called them back when I got home to get serial #s so I could check age and such, but they won't give them out. I found that odd.

Any thoughts, o' collective knowledge of the interweb?

Assuming the wood stocks belong to a Wingmaster, buy it. $205 is a good price assuming the gun is solid. In my opinion you need more than one barrel anyway, one for HD and one for Trap. So get it and buy whichever barrel it doesn't come with. A 30" LC RemChoke barrel swings very nice.

I've got too many issues with the Express to consider any of them a good deal. YMMV

 

[Falconeer]

If the 870 with wood fittings is a Wingmaster, grab it - that's a good price. Worth spending a bit more on to fix it up. However, if it doesn't have screw-in chokes, you may want to wait for a more suitable shotgun, as it's going to cost you to either fit screw-in chokes to the existing barrel, or buy a new barrel.

Your most cost-effective approach for a new gun (and better price than most used Wingmasters) is still going to be Wal-Mart, or something like that, for a new 870 Express, which will include a 26" or 28" barrel with screw-in chokes. An example can be seen here - print out that page, go to your local Wal-Mart, and if they don't have it, they'll be able to order it for you.

(Of course, if you want something absolutely tailor-made for the job, they also offer this one... drool! )

Unfortunately, it's not a Wingmaster. It's an older Express. Based on the prices at Walmart and such, I figure it's worth it to spend the extra $45 or so and get new. Full warranty, etc. My wife is going to let me spend $250 or so for my birthday present, so now I have to find the best $250 can get me.

 

[jdseven1]

Falconeer, Before I picked up that 1100 I was looking into buying an 870 express for $238 at wal-mart and putting in an extented full choke and adding an limb saver pad. I hear you on the O/U but like you I wanted to get into trap shooting for a little less money to start. Maybe later I will go for a single barrel trap or the O/U. I saw a number of 870's at the gun show but they were beat. Good Luck finding what you want

 

[sm]

Rem 1100

Etchen used a 870 to take the Grand, Fifty years later he took it again with the SAME 870.

Misseldine shot both Skeet and Trap. He used 1300s in all 4 ga's in Skeet. He used these in Trap as well...again all 4 gauges.

Mosseberg, never saw one growing up. In my Competition days, never seem 'em hold up, 9200s (semi) made a 11-87 look reliable, and 11-87s used by my kind did not hold up. The pumps a bit better...not much. Though I shot skeet, I hung with a crowd and some shot Trap. WE in our repective games may shoot 1k-2k rounds a WEEK.

I personally have over 200k rds thru one gun alone. 1974 SX1. There is a 870 in 28 ga with best guess over 300K rds...just a few examples of what works and what does not.

Gun fit to shooter, Proper training. If you can find a used Rem 1100 - these run, proven and my first recommendation for a new shooter in your / near your price range.

Beretta 303 is another. IF...IF can find one, these are hard to find as folks that know of it, have one will not part with it. Possible could be found in your price range if someone did not know what they had - or needed the money to buy skill and targets in the form of a Tack-Tickle shotgun.

Lay-a-way a Newer Beretta, or, if one used make arrangements with someone on a payment plan. Barter, work out a lay-a-way, horse-trade something in your business...there are ways.

Good Luck

s

 

[Falconeer]

Thanks for all our assistance! I took the plunge and went over to wallyworld. I picked up an 870 Express Magnum with a 28" barrel for $238. I also purchased the full RemChoke, so I'm set for trap.



I like the looks of her. No fancy scroll work, etc. Just solid and dependable. Next up, Morgan pad. Is that something that's going to need to be drilled, or do they make adapters to use the existing holes?

Also, is anyone familiar with Stock Fitting Secrets by Rollin Oswald? It sounds like a good 'do it yourself' method of fitting a shotgun. As you may be able to tell, I'm on a tight budget.

 

[Dave McCracken]

Congrats on your new and good 870. A couple things....

Shoot it first before adding a Morgan. It fits the screw holes on your shotgun, so no mods needed. You may want to work the base plate down to fit your wood.

Do what the manual says about getting the preservative off before you shoot.

I've no experience with Rollin's book, but the crew on Trapshooters.com regard it highly.

Add an open choke like Skeet or IC, and you're set for most stuff flying.

BA/UU/R and enjoy.....

 

[Falconeer]

Congrats on your new and good 870.

Thanks kindly!

Shoot it first before adding a Morgan.

Is this just so I have a baseline before changing geometry, or is there a break in type deal?

Do what the manual says about getting the preservative off before you shoot.

I didn't see anything in particular about getting perservative off except it says to clean the barrel. I'm going to pull the whole gun down tonight (not total disassembly, but what's in the manual) and make sure everything is clean, etc. I cleaned the barrel last night, but I want to give it another pass to make sure I get all the brown crud off. BTW, anyone have suggestions for this? I've been using #9.

I've no experience with Rollin's book, but the crew on Trapshooters.com regard it highly.

Thanks for the input. Sounds like that's a good purchase along with the Morgan pad.

Add an open choke like Skeet or IC, and you're set for most stuff flying.

The club I'm joining has trap, skeet, and five stand. I HAVE to get that MEC 600 jr from my dad...

BA/UU/R and enjoy.....

Thanks, but what's 'BA/UU/R' mean?

 

[Preacherman]

BA/UU/R is Dave's mantra... Buy Ammo, Use Up, Repeat!

Basically, Dave's advice (and mine too!) is to shoot your shotgun "as is" for several hundred rounds. Find out how you do with it, where (if?) it's uncomfortable, etc. Don't add gizmo's, bells and whistles unless and until you know you need them. If your shotgun has an R3 pad on it, as many new-production Remington's do, you won't need anything else - the R3 is the Limbsaver pad made for Remington under that name. If you have a less-recoil-absorbent pad than that, by all means look at more modern alternatives.

Congratulations on your first 870! I daresay there will be more in your future. I've owned a total of more than a dozen over the years, but I have this unfortunate habit of giving mine away to the disabled and handicapped shooters I teach. I found myself down to only two a few weeks ago! Fortunately, I was able to get another one at a great price, so my 870 angst is eased for the nonce...

 

[Falconeer]

BA/UU/R is Dave's mantra... Buy Ammo, Use Up, Repeat!

Ah! Got it, though I'll modify it to 'Buy Components, Use Up, Repeat!'.

Basically, Dave's advice (and mine too!) is to shoot your shotgun "as is" for several hundred rounds. Find out how you do with it, where (if?) it's uncomfortable, etc. Don't add gizmo's, bells and whistles unless and until you know you need them. If your shotgun has an R3 pad on it, as many new-production Remington's do, you won't need anything else - the R3 is the Limbsaver pad made for Remington under that name. If you have a less-recoil-absorbent pad than that, by all means look at more modern alternatives.

Sound advice. There's definately a recoil pad of some type on there already, so I'll use that for a while.

Congratulations on your first 870! I daresay there will be more in your future. I've owned a total of more than a dozen over the years, but I have this unfortunate habit of giving mine away to the disabled and handicapped shooters I teach. I found myself down to only two a few weeks ago! Fortunately, I was able to get another one at a great price, so my 870 angst is eased for the nonce...

So it's people like YOU who are keeping me from finding a Wingmaster Classic Trap for $200!! Evil person!!

Thanks again for all the help!

 

[Dave McCracken]

Try, "Build Ammo, Use Up, Repeat"....

Remington recommends disassembly of a new Express before shooting, spraying with Remoil, letting it sit for 30 minutes then wiping off all one can with paper towels, etc. This prevents rust and so on.

Do pattern, it's as needed as oxygen to get the most out of your purchase.

Enjoy.....