Mac 10

[scracing]

I am new to the world of collecting Guns but I am interested in getting a Mac 10 (semi automatic knoc off) Couple questions?
What is the best one to get ($500.00 cost) Mac-10 semi automatic
Can I convert it to automatic and if so how?
Should I get the 9mm or .40cal I use it for target practice ?

 

[RoboDuck]

9mm ammo cost less to play with.

 

[TJ AK-74]

Hey, Welcome to the world of guns in general and THR in particular! When I first started out, I was also interested in MAC-10's. I have never bought or fired one. I would suggest renting a semi-auto one at a range and see if you actually like shooting it before spending money on one. Converting one to full-auto is a federal felony punishable by 10 years in jail and $250,000.

 

[baylorattorney]

Ingram was the best IMO. And it would be a MAC 11 in 9mm

 

[Positivity]

Continuing off what TJ said, you can obtain a full auto one though, but it will have to have been made prior to the 1986 machine gun ban and you will have to pay the $200 tax on it in addition to transfer fees and the original price of the gun.

 

[animator]

First post on this forum is asking if and how to convert a mac 10 to full auto?



That's all kinds of red flags...

 

[exavid]

Two problems with them as I see it. One - They are awkward to handle and not particularly accurate. The other is that it's hard to get ammo for them when you're in a federal slammer. Uncle Sugar really, really, frowns on people who convert semi autos to autos. You can have one legally in some states, not all, if it was built before 1986 but be prepared to pay the $200 federal tax and the cost of a well equipped midsized car for one. If you start your collection with this idea it's likely it will be a small collection and short lived.

 

[Robert]

I run into people, friends and folks I work with, that have no idea just how illegal doing that is. They figure that it is either easy to do, legal or both. Nothing wrong with asking a question. Even if the actions being asked about could be very illegal. The only way to learn is ask.

So OP to repeat, if you were able to do it you could very well land in prison for 10 years and pay a $250,000 fine. For that price you could buy an entire cargo container of NFA Mac 10s or 11s.

 

[animator]

Two problems with them as I see it. One - They are awkward to handle and not particularly accurate. The other is that it's hard to get ammo for them when you're in a federal slammer. Uncle Sugar really, really, frowns on people who convert semi autos to autos. You can have one legally in some states, not all, if it was built before 1986 but be prepared to pay the $200 federal tax and the cost of a well equipped midsized car for one. If you start your collection with this idea it's likely it will be a small collection and short lived.

Replace "well equipped midsized car" with "decent 5-year-old used econbox" and you'll be more accurate.

Full-auto Macs aren't too terribly expensive...

 

[MachIVshooter]

Replace "well equipped midsized car" with "decent 5-year-old used econbox" and you'll be more accurate.

Full-auto Macs aren't too terribly expensive...

This

M-16's may be upwards of $15k, but you can get a transferable MAC for about $3,000. About $2,800 more than they're worth, IMO, but that's me.

As an aside, best bang-for-the-buck FA is probably the Ruger AC-556. I see them regularly in the $6k-$8k range. Personally, though, I'd go with a registered HK sear. That way you can have anything from the MP5 to the G-3 based LMG's with only one tax stamp.

 

[scaatylobo]

Legal ONLY

I owned a Ingram Mac 10 back in the 1980's and it was in .45 ACP.

It had a fake suppressor and was fun at the time as I liked ' bullet hoses '.

If your trolling for converting a LEGAL gun to illegal,your in the wrong place.

Otherwise,welcome and hope you learn the gun laws.

btw,as a retired LEO,when I was "on the job" it was cool to shoot the full auto model with a real suppressor at the Buffalo P.D. as they had a few of them.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

Can I convert it to automatic?

I suspect the Opening Post interest is collector, education or just plain curiosity. So here's part of what I have learned.

The MAC semi-autos are closed bolt operation. When you pull the trigger, the firing pin is released.

The MAC full-autos are open bolt operation. When you pull the trigger, the bolt is released, and the firing pin ignites the primer while the bolt is moving forward for a cushioning effect known as advanced primer ignition API.
In other words, converting a semi- to full- auto is not only illegal without the proper compliance, it is impractical. Since the 1960s, the design requirements for a legal semi-auto replica of a full-auto military weapon make conversions to full-auto as difficult as possible.

Another thing that gets over looked is that full-autos usually have some sort of cyclic rate reducer because the cyclic rate of a semi-auto may be too fast for full-auto operation. For example, M16s have a heavier buffer system than AR15 rifles to slow the cyclic rate.

If one could properly convert a semi-auto MAC 10 to full auto, they would have the equipment and expertise to build one from sheet metal and blocks of 4140 steel. That is the goal of ATF's lab in approving semi-auto designs: to make "kitchen table" conversions impossible..

Since the federal machinegun registry is closed, you cannot build and register a machinegun on a ATF Form 1 (you could do that before 19 May 1986). Today you would have to get a Federal Firearms License, IIRC add a 07 Special Ocupation Taxpayer manufacturer endorsement, get a letter from a law enforcement agency wanting to see a dealer sample of a full-auto MAC, very long and drawn out process (contact ATF if you are really interested for the legal details). Plus to keep the license you must have a volume of steady legitimate business. Some machine gun dealers are collectors, but few collectors become dealers just for the purpose of collecting.

 

[InkEd]

Buy a Masterpiece Arms Defender in 9mm.

 

[Prince Yamato]

Honestly, when it comes to Mac-10s you might as well get the real thing. Yes, they cost 10x their original price, but they are relatively low cost in the context of the full auto realm. Also, the gun has no real purpose in semi auto form.

 

[scaatylobo]

@ Carl N.Brown

Sorry to burst a bubble.

But the Mac 10 that I owned was from Ingram and it was an open bolt.

It was stopped due to the ease of making it full auto [ I believe ].

And the "kits" were for sale at all gun shows and all you needed was a bending gig to make um.

I wonder how many are still around.

I bought mine at a local gun shop and it was a registered pistol in NYS.

 

[forindooruseonly]

The older semi-auto MACs were an open bolt design, but the ATF forced them to change when it became apparent how easy it is to convert. The closed bolt system which they changed to is now what Masterpiece Arms makes. The older open bolt semi-autos now bring a premium from collectors.

The MAC subguns start at about 3k, but to get the full experience you really need a suppressor on one. It makes a world of difference in how it handles and shoots. It turns a really uncontrollable, ungainly bullet hose into a more manageable package. They were designed from the start to use a suppressor, the old and big sionics can. They are cheap these days, a couple hundred bucks, but still effective. If you shell out for a transferable full-auto, you might as well get the suppressor too.

 

[Tim37]

http://www.impactguns.com/mack-10-9mm-45-transferable-m10a1a.aspx

 

[baylorattorney]

It is so easy to break the law and convert one of these machines to operate as they were intended to. From quick fixes with a dime coin and bobby pin to the real deal sears etc. to do such tho is a serious crime with a real penalty, simply not worth illegal conversion. You will get caught. People firing full auto are heard and talked about by neighbors and that's it. You will do time too, even a first offender. Manufacture of a machine gun - 10 years fed. Possession of a prohibited weapon - another ten years federal. Plus a half million dollar in fines. Count on pleading out to a 3-5 year deal in the pen.


Waste not want not.

 

[scracing]

Looks like I will stay with the semi auto..............thanx for the help

If I understand this right in some states you can purchase and use a full auto, but you can never convert a gun from semi to automatic in any state?

 

[F-111 John]

If I understand this right in some states you can purchase and use a full auto, but you can never convert a gun from semi to automatic in any state?

You cannot convert a gun from semi to full automatic because the Federal Government hasn't allowed any new automatic weapons to be registered since 1986. So if it was registered before 1986 then you can transfer it to another owner (state laws allowing,) but you cannot create a new automatic.

 

[jmorris]

I wouldn't waist $500 on a semi MAC. You can get a FA one for under $3k. Out of all the folks that built them the original powder springs MAC 10 is the best. If you get the M10 45 you can convert it to 9mm. The M10 9 can only be a 9mm.

You can spot the PS M10's from a distance by the front sight (there are other internal differences as well) the original is adjustable and narrow allowing better accuracy than you would think. The knockoffs just bend a hunk of metal up.

 

[exavid]

In this case I doubt it makes much difference how the sights are made, the accuracy of a full auto is pretty much spray and pray.

 

[jmorris]

Its select fire, so you can turn off the bullet hose. Using the wire stock to add stability, my PS 9mm MAC can keep a group inside 6" at 80 yards. Impressed the hell out of me for an open bolt gun.

 

[InkEd]

$500 and $3000 is alot of difference in money. Plus all the NFA paperwork. If you just want a fun range toy the MPA closed bolt ones are great. You can "bump fire" them rather quickly too, if you're in to blasting ammo super quickly and just staying on the paper target for accuracy.

 

[dcarch]

Honestly, there's very little advantage to full auto anyway. I can pull a trigger almost as fast as full auto (granted, not accurately), and there's just way too many legal hurdles to make full auto practical for me. Maybe an auto could be a fun range toy, but that's about it...