"Made in America" + "Economic Stimulus Package" = "?"

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The GMC was made in 1991 and assembled in Shreveport, LA (my home city). The Ford is a 1997 and assembled in River Rouge, MI I believe. The Plymouth is a 1998 and who in the hell knows where that thing was born.

It just worked out that way. I had a Honda once.

All in all I have a slight preference for American brands but hold more loyalty to gaining maximum value to when I loosen my own purse strings.

In an ideal world I think a nation should strive to be as self contained and self sufficient as possible. The economics have changed so much it makes zero sense to me. IIRC our history one of the frustrations of the American colonies was England restricting their manufacturing so they would be a market for English goods. America humped herself up to the top of the nation heap through manufacturing. Now we have turned over our manufacturing base to foreigners and become just a consumer of foreign goods. WHACKED.

I am not big into protectionism but cost wise American industry is at such a disadvantage maybe there should be some equalizing tariffs to give them breathing space or a fair fight if it were. China in particular cares nothing about occupational safety, pollution control, insurance, workers compensation etc etc. It scares the hell out of me we are so dependent on a nation of a billion plus peasants run rough shod over by a bunch of totalitarian geriatrics with a sweet tooth for capitalism.
 
Borrowed from China?

Ken Grant wrote that this incentive money was borrowed from China. I have heard this rumor elsewhere, but I would like to see evidence that it is true, before spreading the rumor further. I tried to find info on the net, but came up empty-handed.
How about it Ken: where is this information confirmed?
Baldy
 
Technically, your last paycheck came from China.

There are world banks that buy and sell currency and leverage sums between countries. Somewhere, someone sold "American" dollars (through a bank) to an investor in China. At some point his investments pumped cash into the American economy and benefited the company you work for.

Hence, you were technically paid by the Chinese.

Technically my Sicillian stiletto was built by Chinese angel capital. Technically, pasta was invented by the Chinese and sold to Marco Polo.

You tell that to my Aunt Clara and you'll be dodging that "Chinese" stiletto.
 
Sans Authoritas wrote:
The government just prints more money whenever it wants.
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The Tourist wrote:
It's a little more complex than that. First, you have to get the populace to actually believe the money is worth something. During the 1950's and the 1960's most foreigners would happily accept American money from tourists on vacation, simply because it came from the USA.
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I didn't say it wasn't more complex. And I didn't say the money was worth anything. I said they print it, and let future generations take the kick in the gut, while today we have the illusion of prosperity. Say's law in effect. That's why some countries have to keep coming up with higher denomination bills every other year. Or the government introduces a "new" denomination, to inspire trust in the shares in the national debt. One of the reasons I'd like to see government to release its near monopoly grip on the business of money altogether.

The Tourist wrote:
FDR's CCC did not save us from The Great Depression, the war did. Up until that time we had no use for warplanes that could circle large sections of the globe or munitions by the ton.
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Indeed, F.D.R.'s socialist programs only worsened the Great Depression, which was already well on its way to correction by the early to mid 30's. He did grave damage, especially by confiscating gold. The country was already out of the woods before the war began. How do you suppose the war helped? War makes a very few wealthy: inflationary spending on disposables such as bombs, tanks and planes does not really benefit the economy as a whole.

The perceived "benefit" of the war in "ending the Great Depression" was likely due to the fact that for the past 14 years or so, just about nobody spent a dime on anything that wasn't essential: (new cars, tires, clothes, shoes, etc.) Rationing also "helped," things quite a bit, only insofar as once rationing was lifted, people began to open up the commercial floodgates. They were tired of it. And overall, lots of people had saved up money during the war. Wives were working, and the soldiers often sent their pay home in addition to that. Contrast that scene with today: we still have both married people working (if they're married at all) with no kids, and they're spending everything they make before they've made it. A new BMW every other year is mandatory, as is that huge house, bereft of the sound of children's voices and scampering feet. Is there any wonder the economy is about to tank? People as a whole have put an improper amount of value on the wrong things.

The war didn't do a thing to help the U.S. or Britain economically. Britain languished for two decades afterward: the result of a command economy that had not been allowed to return to its pre-war status, as opposed to the U.S., where companies like Grumman stopped making torpedo bombers and started making canoes: things people actually could use in a regular economy.

-Sans Authoritas
 
Sans Authoritas, we're probably on the same side of the debate at the end of the day. I do find your comments quite learned.

Let me ask you one defining thing. Do you disagree with anything that I have said as a working element of economy?
 
The Tourist,

I think we're on the same page, but I think we both misinterpreted each other a little. I think the safe route would be to say that if you agree with Ludwig Von Mises, then I don't think I disagree with you. ; )

-Sans Authoritas
 
I would go with a Marlin model 60 .22, great rifle and last I knew they sell for about 130 bills. I'm not of much help on the handgun subject. I'm not really sure which American manufacturers use foreign parts and which don't.
 
I second the recommendation of the Marlin 60 for a 22. Or, you can look into building your own AR15. It can be done for close to $600.
 
Sometimes you just don't know what is made here in the states, even our dog food has ingredients from China...WHY???
 
We are going to "monkey wrench" them two different ways with the same money. We are NOT going to spend it on "stuff", instead we will pay down some consumer debt. Ha! Take that Bankers!

Russ
 
Sans Authoritas said:
if you agree with Ludwig Von Mises, then I don't think I disagree with you.
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LOL. I don't know if I'm a poster-child for laissez-faire style thought in business. I'm not really a Deming-lemming, and I know it takes me more than one minute to be any type of a manager. I do know that I think Darth Vader is "too soft" on crime, but I digress.

For most of my career I was a credit manager for distressed companies. I would get called (usually too late) as an employee or consultant in deciding what varnish to use on Titanic deck chairs. Within one quarter I had to find problems and implement change, by the end of the second quarter I had to have found some new cash and by mid-third quarter the sales staff was burning me in effigy.

I actually have a plastic lightsaber I used for "business meetings," hence the joke.

If I had to bet all of my money on one shake of the dice, I would bet that most corporations fail because the owner/CEO is both a good inventor and a lousy businessman, coupled with the fact he thinks the CFO worries too much.

One owner, caught with a woman on his desk during business hours, actually bought himself a new Jaguar the first quarter I put him into the black. It happened the same month my boss--the CFO--informed me we had to lay-off 75 family men three weeks before Christmas.

So, I have some very strident views on economy and re-establishing wealth. What I first thought was simply of a singular case of idiocy as a younger man trying to save my initial corporate client, turned into what I came to believe was just an "average company" by the time I saw middle age. If people knew what whims directed most of their employers they simply wouldn't be so careless with the jobs they have. I'm surprised any company lasts more than five years.

Truth be told, if my sharpening business ever grows beyond the confines of my desk, I'll simply hire family. There are too many guys who just show up for paychecks and fake their jobs.
 
I second the recommendation of the Marlin 60 for a 22. Or, you can look into building your own AR15. It can be done for close to $600.
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I second the AR... nothing more American than an Evil Black Gun.

The $1200 the Wife and I get will go into saveings, I can't participate in the 'gun buying'... she said "no more guns till I get a house", I already have 3 AR's, I'm a reciever and LPK short of a 4th and still have parts to go onto a 5th... I have to listen to the Old Ladys wants for Kids and a House... I should be getting a 2 or 3 car garage out of this deal :)
 
Ken Grant wrote that this incentive money was borrowed from China.
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You mean the economic stimulus checks? It's an oversimplification but arguably true. We buy products from China with American dollars. What does China do with all those dollars we send them? They buy US debt in the form of treasury bills or bonds or notes depending on their amounts and maturity dates. Those obligations of the US have to be paid off, and they are, with more US dollars. Where do those dollars come from? You and I earn them by exchanging the value of our labor and skills for them. Of course, no nation on Earth ever really pays off its debts, they are paid with currency that becomes devalued by this principle.

The economic stimulus checks are more US debt. You and I bear that debt while grantor nations like China hold the note. Eventually, the dollar may not be enough for them and they're going to want hard assets, hence the amount of foreign interest in American corporations and land.

Remember the Louisiana Purchase? The territory was purchased from France who desperately needed to pay its debt for the Napoleonic Wars, and was too broke to defend it against the British anyway. (France had come to acquire the land from Spain, in exchange for its debts!) The difference between then and now is that the US paid for the land with $5M in gold, and the rest in bonds. Since nearly all land and gold is now in private hands, their use to settle debts among nations has fallen out of favor, and pretty much all debts today are paid with... more debt... until that becomes unsatisfactory giving rise to dictators like Tito and Chavez who confiscate land and other private assets to bail out their sorry economies.

It's not a pretty picture. If you're going to use your economic stimulus checks to buy guns, great, as long as you appreciate where it comes from. In this context perhaps it's the best use of the money after all.

We are NOT going to spend it on "stuff", instead we will pay down some consumer debt. Ha! Take that Bankers!
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The "bankers" will be more than happy to take your money. That's how they earn it and return value to their shareholders. If you don't, and default on your debt, we've all seen what happens - our government bails them out (minus their shareholders - they get zip) and sticks you with the bill. A win-win for them. Must be nice.
 
I'm not sure that saving that money is a good idea (edit: at the moment), given the rate of inflation. No amount of interest you earn on a savings account is going to keep up with the Fed's continuous printing of greenbacks.

Paying off credit card debt (especially the high interest ones and then cancelling them so there is no temptation to put that debt back on) is a pretty good idea.

Essentially, you want to put that money to use while it still has value (but not for buying useless junk). Buying American is a good idea, but I still say that if you have any debt, now is the time to pay it off.
 
"Made in America" + "Economic Stimulus Package" = partial payment on insanely high property taxes. Sorry, no gun, must keep roof over head. Taxes are "Made in America".
 
It is important and still possible to buy all American Made in USA. That would be firearms llike RUGER, MARLIN , COLT, SAVAGE, BARRETT, SHILO SHARPS, USFA, ammo makers, reloading tool makers, the list goes on...... Maybe we should compile a comprehensive list.
When it comes to electronics or underwear then it's imported.

I believe in the information in this video explains alot:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936
 
we made good money at those jobs (textiles etc) .
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The reason these jobs don't exist at these wages is..... no company can survive paying $40 an hour to sew tennis shoes when your competitor is doing it for much cheaper. Simply put, Unions and high paid factory workers priced themselves out of the jobs.
 
The Tourist,

There should be laws against force, fraud, and coercion, in the business world. Everything else, to me, should be off limits. This is because government bureaucracy is utterly incapable of doing anything to improve corporate bureacracies. The government doesn't have a monetary incentive to do a good job and treat the customers well, while corporations do.

To this day, there are people, who, along with thinking their money is backed up by gold in Fort Knox, think that without the FDA, people would be eating rat-dung encrusted meat. They think this because they don't realize that people are not stupid enough to keep buying from the same place that sold them bad food! Branding is everything, and if your name gets blackened, the bottom line is hurt. Nobody will forget the Ford Pinto, the Yugo, or ConAgra. All the fraud in the world can't stop people from finding out the truth about products. But they know what the government sells, and eat it up. In fact, they're literally forced to buy the products and services the government sells. I don't like artificial monopolies.

-Sans Authoritas
 
Giving the average American $600 for economic stimulus is like giving an alcoholic a 12 pack of beer.

It's appreciated but it wont last long and it doesn't help the root problem with the economy/addiction.
 
+1 plexreticle.

All the qualities of a good post. Succinctness, accuracy, relevancy, and humor.
 
A new front sight for a Stevens rifle for me, and putting the other $585 towards a laptop computer :barf: so I can work on my masters anywhere I choose to. Of course the laptop won't be "Made in America" so I really shouldn't have posted.
 
Giving the average American $600 for economic stimulus is like giving an alcoholic a 12 pack of beer.

It's appreciated but it wont last long and it doesn't help the root problem with the economy/addiction.
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+1. Put it into savings. They're just trying to distract you from the economic recession with some milk money. (Speaking figuratively)
 
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