Madness after girl, 4, draws gun pic at school

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beatledog7 said:
Yes, it does, which makes me wonder you say it is in any way self contradictory. Perhaps I should have should said, "or worse." By "better, " I meant a better question.

My point was quite simple: give the school an inch, it takes a mile. Say one overreach is ok, and they all are. Result: the schools get to tell parents how to rear their children.
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That argument as posted is the fallacious form of the slippery slope. The examples include existing abilities of the school to report possible criminal activity or to set rules on student behavior on site. There is no argument provided showing the transitive dependencies between those acknowledged abilities and "telling parents how to raise their children".

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That argument as posted is the fallacious form of the slippery slope. The examples include existing abilities of the school to report possible criminal activity or to set rules on student behavior on site. There is no argument provided showing the transitive dependencies between those acknowledged abilities and "telling parents how to raise their children".
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Au contraire, mon cherie.

When a child's parent-prepared lunch is declared unsuitable or a child's innocuous behavior "on site" results in a parent's arrest, there is a direct connection to parental control being made subservient to state/school control.

The child's drawing raised alarm bells for what reason? Fear that her parent might be breaking a law? Or fear that the child might be in danger based on a parent's "inappropriate" behavior? Both answers are arguably correct, so it's matter of which answer was the one that drove the events.

Project the case onto, say, Virginia. Would the Virginia teacher still go to battle stations over the drawing, even though Virginia allows unregistered handgun ownership and even open carry? Sadly, I think she would. This case, being pretty well publicized, will serve to fuel that tendency.

I think you'll disagree, but c'est la vie.
 
beatledog7 said:
When a child's parent-prepared lunch is declared unsuitable or a child's innocuous behavior "on site" results in a parent's arrest, there is a direct connection to parental control being made subservient to state/school control.

The child's drawing raised alarm bells for what reason? Fear that her parent might be breaking a law? Or fear that the child might be in danger based on a parent's "inappropriate" behavior? Both answers are arguably correct, so it's matter of which answer was the one that drove the events.
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Any perceived subservience only exists as an inconsistent perspective, as far as those cases are concerned. With the lunch example, it has already been explained that the school is exerting its authority to control what students do while on the premises. This is no more "telling parents how to raise their children" than having a dress code or banning the chewing of gum in class, and yet there isn't outrage about those expressions. As to a child's innocuous declaration of a parent's violation of the law, it seems odd to make an exception for that specific case when it would be a severe lapse of judgement for schools to ignore an indication of crime(eg. child abuse).

Project the case onto, say, Virginia. Would the Virginia teacher still go to battle stations over the drawing, even though Virginia allows unregistered handgun ownership and even open carry? Sadly, I think she would. This case, being pretty well publicized, will serve to fuel that tendency.
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Given the amount of the outrage being based on the police actions, that component would be absent in a place where ownership and carry is legal. That leaves the school principal and child welfare being involved. Which would largely be conversations and maybe a visit to the house to check on safe storage methods.
 
Isnt this world just going downhill? Back then you would get called crazy to not have a firearm. Now you get called crazy for owning one.... Even Jesus said (If you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one)..
 
Certaindeaf said:
Ah, you must be referring to the King James version and Nebakanezer, or you're just feeling cross.
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I was just adding onto the levity of the faux culture war interjection into an otherwise boring explanation of the fallacies of the most recent moral panic.

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...a child's innocuous declaration of a parent's violation of the law
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She made no such declaration, nor was there any such violation.

That leaves the school principal and child welfare being involved. Which would largely be conversations and maybe a visit to the house to check on safe storage methods.
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Really? There would be indication of the child's warfare being in jeopardy in the Virginia scenario, nor was there in the Canada case.

Overreaction, pure and simple. Western society has become focused on making up rules to deal with what-if's. This is a bad plan.
 
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I'm not concerned about any overreaction by any social or bureau-crats (we'll probably always have that), just the suspension of due process, false arrest, and the lack of intelligently guided investigation. We all need to put that back in a place of importance.
 
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Ah liberalism. They think everyone else is stupid and therefor needs to be controlled. Freedom is great as long as they are the only ones that have it.
 
Ah liberalism. They think everyone else is stupid and therefor needs to be controlled. Freedom is great as long as they are the only ones that have it.
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You know its funny that you say that but i don't ever see people on here who lean to the left refusing to keep their political views to themselves on a board where it is supposed to be against the rules. Its pretty much always right wing comments that get threads diverted into politics so who is it really who thinks so highly of their of own views?

And speaking of political groups and freedoms why don't you ask homosexuals, medical marijuana users, prostitutes, people with different religions than the official republican one, etc about which party likes to control people.
 
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What a load of old twaddle,this really is.I remember drawing automatic pistols at elementary school 20 years ago of the Colt 1911 & Walther P38,after watching The Man From U.N.C.L.E on tv.I even remember Mr Solo ejecting his magazine & changing it for a full one.No one cared at all at my school.
I didn't want to go and kill anyone.
 
Not all liberals are anti-gun...

I just wanted to get that out there.

Interestingly enough, I've actually done this. I drew a revolver when I was a sophomore in high school, and my biology teacher saw it. I got sent down to my dean's office and ended up with a 3-6 detention for it. My argument is that a drawing can't hurt anyone. My sophomore year also just so happened to be the year the Columbine shootings happened.
 
Man I have a feeling I will be getting called to the principles office soon. I have an 8 year old daughter and an 8 year old Granddaughter that are BOTH gun "nuts". They shoot with me every chance they get. And the daughter is blooming into somewhat of a little artist. I'll get a hell of a laugh if some teacher calls me about this stuff. And I'll enjoy the court time as well when I sue the living hell out of them for encroaching on my child's freedoms of expression!
 
Would the Virginia teacher still go to battle stations over the drawing, even though Virginia allows unregistered handgun ownership and even open carry? Sadly, I think she would.



you need to get out more if you believe that.
 
Without wading through 5 pages of thread, and oodles of google hits, can someone summarize for me the police's thinking in "strip searching" (I'm hoping cavity searches were NOT involved) a person for a firearm?
 
beatledog7 said:
She made no such declaration, nor was there any such violation.

Overreaction, pure and simple. Western society has become focused on making up rules to deal with what-if's. This is a bad plan.
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" When a teacher asked Neaveh who the man in the picture was, she purportedly said,... "

It's too bad society has so many what if's for cases where a child suggests her father's involvement in criminal activity.
 
ExTank said:
Without wading through 5 pages of thread, and oodles of google hits, can someone summarize for me the police's thinking in "strip searching" (I'm hoping cavity searches were NOT involved) a person for a firearm?
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Checking for other weapons, if their build is such that a patdown is likely to miss something, maybe?

Not sure why a wand wouldn't be sufficient, unless there was a concern of nonmetallic weapons.

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The topic is gun control Justinj. Liberals are people like Eric Holder. Do you agree with with that? If so you are against the second amendment and gun rights. You are too young to see the whole picture. Obama and the liberals want a new world order like Canada and many European countries. They want to do away with the Bill of Rights and the US constitution. The groups you mention are just pawns in a power struggle to end the Bill of Rights. Before you post again, study the constitution, George Washingotns inaugeral speech and Obama's Speech about a new world order. Also read " The Harbinger". A few books on history would help.
 
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