Man arrested while Open Carrying at Political Rally

[Stevie-Ray]

I don't know that I would care to discuss this with someone who can't even hold his temper in a discussion like this and resorts to personal attacks. You want to know what I've done, go to www.pafoa.org and search on my screen name. I post under the same name there as here. I've put my face and my real name in the news, on the radio, and on the internet in the struggle for our gun rights. I have given money and time, helping out those who need it. I contact my representatives at the local, state, and federal level when the occasion demands it, and not just on gun rights.

And as far as personal attacks goes, you're the one that started that. What's the matter, not use to people standing up to you? Get used to it with that attitude.

And if you had any sense at all, you would see this is all taking place in PA. I live in PA. MTN Jack is in PA. Open carry is legal in PA. There are a lot of us who don't tiptoe around in fear of what someone else is going to do or say. I open carry every day. Yeah, there is the risk of cops, handcuffs, jail time, whatever. It was only a few weeks ago I had my county sheriff and one of his deputies screaming in my face because I dared to bring my gun with me to the courthouse and have it checked as the law allows. I didn't worry about losing a right if I exercised it.

I've got plenty of sense. You, however lack reading comprehension, or you'd see I understand perfectly what takes place where. But, of course if you admitted that, it would give you less space to show off.

And what does any of this have to do with Michigan? Nobody told you that you had to open carry. It's not for fearful people. And I have no idea where you get the idea that I have advocated shooting it out with the cops. But it just seems to me that a big tough internet guy like you with molon labe in his sig line would be willing to do a little more than shrivel up and worry about exercising a right in case someone comes to take it away. So you stay safe in Michigan Stevie, and don't exercise those rights, just like the nice man told you. You don't want to go stirring up any trouble now, do you?

Again with the subpar reading comprehension. I live in Michigan. That the 2 peninsula state above Ohio, in case your Geography skills match your reading comp. All the rights you're wanting me to "exercise or lose" would be exercised here, of course. A blind man could see that with a cane. I have OC'd here on numerous occasions and don't really have to anymore due to CPL. Go back and reread your answer to my first post. You do your absolute best to degrade anybody that doesn't kowtow to your every thought. Your "internet bullying" doesn't impress me and it's probably the first time anybody's stood up to you. I'm sure it won't be the last. Your "look at me, I'm wonderful, I've got all the answers," attitude will guarantee that. You certainly don't like people treating you like you treat them. Tough. I'm positive I'm reading you correctly when I say you'll want the last word, so have at it. I didn't want to take up all this room on this thread and told you to take it to PM. After your next rant, anything I reply to will be in PM. To everybody else other than you, my apologies for my part in this.

 

[divemedic]

To those of you that are centering on the 2A aspect:

Since Mr Noble was at a political rally, and was in the process of handing out literature that supported his position, I think this becomes a FIRST Amendment case more than it does a 2A case.

Since the only disruption was the LEO response, I don't think that the charges will fly, but you never know. Had this been a person with a 2A sign screaming during a speech this would be different, but handing out literature supporting a legal activity while partaking in that activity? Some real 2A issues there.

To those that think "you can't fight if you're in a jail cell"- remember that there are only three ways to change laws:

1 Get the people to elect legislators that will change them. Even if that legislator is you.

2 Get the people to vote to change the law themselves. (Not all states allow this method)

3 Go to court, and get the court to change the law. Unfortunately, you need what is called "standing" to make this happen. In the case of criminal law, this often means going to jail and using your day in court to fight the fight. This is called "taking one for the team."

Where would we be without such people? Every court case out there is there because someone challenged a law. Some had pure motives, some were criminals who were looking for loopholes. You gotta respect someone who is willing to risk going to jail to secure your rights.

IMO, the sort of person who is willing to stand up to the injustice of his own Government is just as brave and just as much a patriot as the person who becomes a soldier to protect the existence of that same Government.

 

[Mousegun]

If a police officer approached him and said, "I know it is legal to open carry here in P.A. but there are a number of people that are disturbed about your gun here at the rally, I request you leave or remove your gun to your car or I may have to arrest you for disturbing the peace if enough complaints come in."

This would have prevented a false arrest like the one that took place. Maybe not the most 2A way to go but another way out for law enforcement if they choose.

Now consider if 10 people were open carrying. Would the same disturbance of the peace complaints hold up?

Now make it 150-250 people or more in a rally of lets say 3000-5000.

If a situation like that took place, you can rest assured that by the next day an emergency session of state reps would be called and by the day after, the law would be changed.

Of course another question is, if you were a political candidate, in today's climate, how would you feel looking out over an audience, half of which had a gun on their hip?

Probably about the same knowing that the other half may have a gun concealed in their pocket I guess.

 

[General Geoff]

If a situation like that took place, you can rest assured that by the next day an emergency session of state reps would be called and by the day after, the law would be changed.

No way, no how. Supreme Court in PA has ruled that open carry must be legal in order to satisfy the Pennsylvania Constitution, Article 1, Section 21:

"The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned."

Thus it would be impossible and verifiably unconstitutional to pass any such law, and anyone charged under it would have the charges thrown out.

 

[tigre]

To those of you that are centering on the 2A aspect:

Since Mr Noble was at a political rally, and was in the process of handing out literature that supported his position, I think this becomes a FIRST Amendment case more than it does a 2A case.

Well, what was he arrested for, carrying a gun or handing out fliers? Maybe there's a bit of both involved, but I doubt he'd have been arrested for handing out fliers if he wasn't carrying a gun.

 

[Mr. D]

General Geoff,

What was the name of that court case?

~Dale

 

[kevindsingleton]

Of course another question is, if you were a political candidate, in today's climate, how would you feel looking out over an audience, half of which had a gun on their hip?

I'd feel comforted, and secure, knowing that I was in a crowd of like-minded patriots.

How would you feel?

 

[Mousegun]

How would you feel?

Maybe, just maybe a bit uncomfortable knowing that all the kooks (that live in today's climate) have not yet, nor never will be rounded up and there may be a few out there that would want to do me in.

Remember, we are talking about high profile people here that have been targets of some of these kooks, as we have all seen.

This is a realistic position I am taking, not just a dream world situation.

At the same time, I personally would not like to be disarmed if in the audience but I don't consider myself a kook that would do anyone harm to make a name for myself or because I didn't like their political beliefs.

 

[NonConformist]

If a police officer approached him and said, "I know it is legal to open carry here in P.A. but there are a number of people that are disturbed about your gun here at the rally, I request you leave or remove your gun to your car or I may have to arrest you for disturbing the peace if enough complaints come in."

No one has the right not to be disturbed about someone excercising a RIGHT