Man with a gun. In an unexpected place

[JRH6856]

Hypothetical situation:

You drive up to a restaurant and park in front. Do you get out of your car and walk in, or do you try to check out the interior?

(I usually try look inside before I enter a public place, but some places make it nearly impossible to do so, for many reasons (solar film, tinted windows or a lack of windows, low intertior lighting, merchandise displays.)

Lets assume you are conscious of the value of situational awareness and are in Condition Yellow.

Upon entering the restaurant you observe 2 guys wearing sunglasses and holding MSRs. One (call him G2) has his at low ready.

Do you stay in Condition Yellow or go to Condition Orange?

Now, what if G2 sees you and for whatever reason, turns in your direction? With a grin on his face?

 

[rondog]

What's an MSR?

 

[JRH6856]

MSR = Modern Sporting Rifle. Otherwise known as Evil Black Rifles (EBRs)

or Assault Weapons by the media.

 

[Panzerschwein]

I had to look up "MSR" as well. I deal with enough stupid acronyms at work.

Why not just AR-15 or something like that? Moving on, I think anyone would be stupid to remain in "condition yellow" in this type of situation. I would be getting my _ out of Dodge, no color code system needed.

-Cooldill

 

[JohnKSa]

I would not enter a restaurant where I see someone handling a firearm. Finding a "safe direction" (exercising proper muzzle control) when handling an uncased firearm in a public, occupied building that doesn't have a built-in backstop is problematic. Low ready isn't even a reasonable attempt at dealing with muzzle control properly in that scenario.

So the best case scenario is that the person inside the restaurant has some problems understanding the basic rules of firearm safety but is handling a firearm anyway. I'm not going in.

Worst case scenario is pretty clearly even worse. I'm obviously not going in.

 

[USAF_Vet]

Do we really need another thread regarding the Chipotle open carry incident? Because, hypothetical or not, its the same story, wrapped in a 'what would you do' blanket.

 

[Old Dog]

Why does this have to be about "The Chipotle Incident?" What if someone had posited this as a hypothetical scenario prior to that ugly incident?

I believe this is a valid sort of situation to ponder. If one can try and consider this very scenario, wiping one's mind clean of the event from the other day, really, what would you do? How would you respond?

Looking at this from a different perspective is necessary for us. I would hope most here can understand this ... Because we've focused on examining the whole Chipotle thing from our prism of being pro-gun rights. Nothing wrong with examining things from a strategic perspective.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Do we really need another thread regarding the Chipotle open carry incident? Because, hypothetical or not, its the same story, wrapped in a 'what would you do' blanket.

Agreed. I think we've pretty well concluded (ad nauseum) that while a select few of our members seem to be ok with such a display (at least they are Monday morning quarterbacking from the safety & comfort of their desk), the overwhelming majority of us have said we'd be in condition red and looking for adequate cover or egress.

As for this thread, stick a fork in it........

 

[Panzerschwein]

A this Chipotle talk is giving me more indigestion than their jumbo bean and cheese burritos!

Seriously, comic relief attemp aside , I'm not sure what this has to do with that incident? I'm pretty sure if I saw someone with an AR-15 at low-ready, I would be uncomfortable in entering the resturaunt, regardless if they appeared to be LEO or otherwise. Call be old fashioned, I guess. Now slung on someone's back... that's a different story.

As for the OP, I still stick to my original plan of simply egressing the area ASAP. I would immediatly be in condition orange as well.

-Cooldill

 

[riceboy72]

In seeing someone with a rifle in a business, I believe I would immediately value up to orange, but by no means would I stay inside or go inside if I saw this. I'd do what everyone else has said; back up, back out, and run. Call 911 from a safe spot and not go toe to toe with the rifle, period.

 

[JRWhit]

If spotting someone in a low ready position then yes I would avoid them and depending on the entire situation around it, may feel a need to report unsafe handling in a public place. There is a huge difference between a legitimate open carry and a protest demonstration.

I am a very strong advocate for gun rights, but I am at conflict over open carry demonstrations. I do not believe it inspires any confidence.
Instead it displays gun owners using fire arms as protest posters. It is not a poster or a display of activism. It is a rifle or a hand gun and should be used as intended for safety, not for display in activism.
I get leery any time I see someone use a fire arm outside of it's intended use or unsafely and I have a hard time differentiating open carry demonstrations from that. Just my opinion. My gut doesn't like it.

 

[Al Thompson]

Folks, we already had two hundred (ish) posts on this incident over in General.

Feel free to read that thread.

 

[Kleanbore]

Why does this have to be about "The Chipotle Incident?" What if someone had posited this as a hypothetical scenario prior to that ugly incident?

I believe this is a valid sort of situation to ponder. If one can try and consider this very scenario, wiping one's mind clean of the event from the other day, really, what would you do? How would you respond?

Looking at this from a different perspective is necessary for us. I would hope most here can understand this ... Because we've focused on examining the whole Chipotle thing from our prism of being pro-gun rights. Nothing wrong with examining things from a strategic perspective.

There is some merit to that.

BUT--in my opinion there is no way to discuss such a hypothetical incident without making too many assumptions. If you do not have a basis for knowing what you can do, it makes no sense to postulate about what you would do.

Can you leave? Can you get out of sight? Can you draw? Can you fire?

Too many unknowns. Nothing to discuss.