Well, it looks like a lot of others spam out here too, if you call fixing an old problem with a well known rifle spam. I have refined my 7 moa Mini-14 to a near clover leaf shooter, and it seems like there are a lot of other guys who would like to do that as well. I've been pretty busy machining them out, and developing anodizing and custom finishes for the product along with other improvements. Actually, my claims were conservative to the real potential of what I have been able to achieve with the GBTS. So are you saying that you would deprive others of the knowledge of such a product, when that is the very focal point of the discussion forum?? That premise is just a little confusing, but there you have it. www.aimstraight.net
Mini-14 Accuracy
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Mini 14 Accuracy
Back to the issue. I've probably shot 30-40 different Mini 14s over the years as that was my agency's issued long gun and have owned 4 (3 Minis and 1 Ranch Rifle) as I found myself having to liquidate assets for various reasons not because of being unsatisfied with them. I've never seen one that wouldn't shoot 3" @ 100 out of the box and most would do 2". Even when hot (and I mean hot as in the full auto version) they would still shoot about 6" at 100 yd.
I read a different thread where someone was talking about the Min 14's lack of durability. My observations have been much different. We the short barrel full auto, folding stock (AC556?) and same weapon semi auto we used at the range for qualifications. These guns were fired rapid semi and full auto for years. They weren't cleaned often and in spite of this malfunctions were rare (we used factory mags). We noticed that some of them were starting to keyhole and sent them back to Ruger who asked us how many rounds were fired through these weapons. We didn't keep a round count per weapon but figured these weapons we sent back had to have at least 100,000 rounds through them. Ruger rebuilt them and asked us to send them back periodically for them to take measurements but shortly thereafter the agency standardized on M16s because we got them for free.
I only have one Mini 14 now and I'm quite sure I'll never wear it out. ARs are more accurate and unlike others I don't have any major criticisms of the AR family having used one since 1968 during my all expenses paid tour of SE Asia (I cleaned it as I was told to) and in the Reserves and as a LEO since.
The Mini14 does what it was designed to do and at a good price.
Back to the issue. I've probably shot 30-40 different Mini 14s over the years as that was my agency's issued long gun and have owned 4 (3 Minis and 1 Ranch Rifle) as I found myself having to liquidate assets for various reasons not because of being unsatisfied with them. I've never seen one that wouldn't shoot 3" @ 100 out of the box and most would do 2". Even when hot (and I mean hot as in the full auto version) they would still shoot about 6" at 100 yd.
I read a different thread where someone was talking about the Min 14's lack of durability. My observations have been much different. We the short barrel full auto, folding stock (AC556?) and same weapon semi auto we used at the range for qualifications. These guns were fired rapid semi and full auto for years. They weren't cleaned often and in spite of this malfunctions were rare (we used factory mags). We noticed that some of them were starting to keyhole and sent them back to Ruger who asked us how many rounds were fired through these weapons. We didn't keep a round count per weapon but figured these weapons we sent back had to have at least 100,000 rounds through them. Ruger rebuilt them and asked us to send them back periodically for them to take measurements but shortly thereafter the agency standardized on M16s because we got them for free.
I only have one Mini 14 now and I'm quite sure I'll never wear it out. ARs are more accurate and unlike others I don't have any major criticisms of the AR family having used one since 1968 during my all expenses paid tour of SE Asia (I cleaned it as I was told to) and in the Reserves and as a LEO since.
The Mini14 does what it was designed to do and at a good price.
I know quite a few people who own them though, and none of them are impressed with the Mini's accuracy. Is there something they're doing wrong, like ammo selection, or are Mini-14s inherently inaccurate?
[BEGIN HUMOR]
The problem your friends are having is called "A-Team Syndrome." It comes from learning the use of the Mini 14 from watching A-Team episodes. It is fairly common. Please note the following image:
On the left, you have the character "Face." He was noted for his social skills and physical beauty, not his marksmanship. He is firing with the stock folded, from the hip. Also note the lack of tactical clothing required with the use of a semi-automatic rifle.
On the right is Mr T, who was known as "B.A. Baracus." He is also preparing to fire from the hip, with apparently no magazine, although I will give him the benefit of the doubt that the photo was captured in the middle of a tactical reload. Perhaps the magazine is under one of the many religious symbols worn around his neck. B.A. is wearing what equates to brass knuckles for physical combat. He has added a head spike to his tactical gear, but instead of being made of metal, it is some plush material. Clearly, not the person who you want to learn marksmanship/combat skills from.
At least one cause for relief: the US military has decided to stop pursuing the A-Team.
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/30660
[END HUMOR], and my contributions to a thread that is already older than my four year old nephew.
jm
ps. note 4V50 Gary's post from 1999 referencing OLD Mini 14 accuracy threads.
[BEGIN HUMOR]
The problem your friends are having is called "A-Team Syndrome." It comes from learning the use of the Mini 14 from watching A-Team episodes. It is fairly common. Please note the following image:
On the left, you have the character "Face." He was noted for his social skills and physical beauty, not his marksmanship. He is firing with the stock folded, from the hip. Also note the lack of tactical clothing required with the use of a semi-automatic rifle.
On the right is Mr T, who was known as "B.A. Baracus." He is also preparing to fire from the hip, with apparently no magazine, although I will give him the benefit of the doubt that the photo was captured in the middle of a tactical reload. Perhaps the magazine is under one of the many religious symbols worn around his neck. B.A. is wearing what equates to brass knuckles for physical combat. He has added a head spike to his tactical gear, but instead of being made of metal, it is some plush material. Clearly, not the person who you want to learn marksmanship/combat skills from.
At least one cause for relief: the US military has decided to stop pursuing the A-Team.
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/30660
[END HUMOR], and my contributions to a thread that is already older than my four year old nephew.
jm
ps. note 4V50 Gary's post from 1999 referencing OLD Mini 14 accuracy threads.
Last edited:
X-Rap
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The mini platform is Rugers bigest P.O.S. This from one of the most inovative gun manufacturers in the last, well a long time.I've had 3 and known a half a dozen friends who have had them (notice the past tence).One of them a ranch bought used would clear the mag randomly another would literaly bounce bullets of the ground at 100 yds who knows where the high shots went.Friends don't let friends shoot minis.
MoccasinTracks
Member
Add a strut
I have a mini 14, and after getting one of those mini mag light mounts I noticed a better group.
Now i have a tube that i dremeled to fit flush with the gas block in there , and am getting around 1 - 3 inch 100 yard groups depending upon me and the ammo and such.
Their was a big article on it at another web site, but i have lost the site.
I have a mini 14, and after getting one of those mini mag light mounts I noticed a better group.
Now i have a tube that i dremeled to fit flush with the gas block in there , and am getting around 1 - 3 inch 100 yard groups depending upon me and the ammo and such.
Their was a big article on it at another web site, but i have lost the site.
X-Rap
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Not trying to sound like an a$$ but doesn't having to hang different s#@# on your barrel just to get an average group kind of suck.I've read here about struts and such. I've got this picture of this chunk of iron ubolted to the barrel to make it ridgid or something.I have an out of the box colt H-Bar that is sub moa and a 16" carb frankenstien that shoots under 1.5. I just can't understand starting of with a crap platform and tryig to make it something even its manufacturer doesn't think it is.
You two are talking about the original http://www.accu-strut.com/.
MoccasinTracks
Member
I gave $165 for my mini-14 (made in 1976) in 1979.
The part i added cost me maybe $20.
the mini goes bang every time, and doesen't crap where it eats.
I clean it every once in a while, but often it rides around in the trunk and gets minimal care.
all my mags: 5; 10; 20; and 30 work, or were long ago replaced.
For what I want it to do it serves me nicely.
Of course if someone has a $185 ar15 that will shoot less than 2 inches at 100 yards, and always goes bang with similar care to what i give the mini, then I might be interested in buying it.
YMMV.
My favorite rifle is a m14 / m1a and the mini is a baby version that lets me shoot a small round when I feel like that is what I want.
I had my fill of m16 in service, and really prefer a .308 for serious go to rifle.
My favorite platform of .223 is a bolt action rem. model 788.
I was just offering a simple solution that worked for me with one sample of the mini-14.
once again, ymmv
Have a nice day.
M.T.
The part i added cost me maybe $20.
the mini goes bang every time, and doesen't crap where it eats.
I clean it every once in a while, but often it rides around in the trunk and gets minimal care.
all my mags: 5; 10; 20; and 30 work, or were long ago replaced.
For what I want it to do it serves me nicely.
Of course if someone has a $185 ar15 that will shoot less than 2 inches at 100 yards, and always goes bang with similar care to what i give the mini, then I might be interested in buying it.
YMMV.
My favorite rifle is a m14 / m1a and the mini is a baby version that lets me shoot a small round when I feel like that is what I want.
I had my fill of m16 in service, and really prefer a .308 for serious go to rifle.
My favorite platform of .223 is a bolt action rem. model 788.
I was just offering a simple solution that worked for me with one sample of the mini-14.
once again, ymmv
Have a nice day.
M.T.
OK-gobbler
Member
I came across a used Mini-14 for $300. wood and blued. It comes with one 5-rounder and Tasco scope. It is a friend's who is wanting to finance a new encore. Assuming it shoots fairly accurate (3-4"), would this be a good deal?
According to this inflation calculator, the $185 you paid in 1979 is the equivalent of $524 in 2005.
jonsidneyb
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some of you guys have better mini's than I have. I stuck a Leupold 4.5x14 on it from another gun to help check the accruacy and shot off a bench in my back yard at only 25 yards and I could not get a good group at that range. It was a ranch and I was using Tally mounts.
I do realize it is not a target rifle but in all honest it was the least accurate rifle I have ever shot. This will be really hard to believe but I did a little bit better with Brenkie Slugs in a Reminton 870 using iron sights. That was not fun on the bench shooting the shotgun on the bench.
I am sure there are some 3-4 moa ones out there but I could not get that out of it. Mine was worse than those saying it is 7moa gun. Alot worse.
One day I want to give it a try again. I might go for Clark Custom when I try again. The truth is I would be happy with 3 MOA but would be tickled with 1.5 moa.
I don't want an AR either. I want a little semi-auto brown rifle that will shoot resonably well.
I do realize it is not a target rifle but in all honest it was the least accurate rifle I have ever shot. This will be really hard to believe but I did a little bit better with Brenkie Slugs in a Reminton 870 using iron sights. That was not fun on the bench shooting the shotgun on the bench.
I am sure there are some 3-4 moa ones out there but I could not get that out of it. Mine was worse than those saying it is 7moa gun. Alot worse.
One day I want to give it a try again. I might go for Clark Custom when I try again. The truth is I would be happy with 3 MOA but would be tickled with 1.5 moa.
I don't want an AR either. I want a little semi-auto brown rifle that will shoot resonably well.
jonsidneyb
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Actually this is what I want.
http://www.imt.net/~royalarms/Stocks.html#Bitterroot sporter
I want to try and turn an Mini-14 into an elegant carbine that can shoot 1.5 moa.
Maybe a royal arms stock and Clark customs can make this a nice little gentlemans carbine. Yes I know I know, by the time I do all of this I have spent alot more than an AR. I can't afford to do this anyway but I want to.
http://www.imt.net/~royalarms/Stocks.html#Bitterroot sporter
I want to try and turn an Mini-14 into an elegant carbine that can shoot 1.5 moa.
Maybe a royal arms stock and Clark customs can make this a nice little gentlemans carbine. Yes I know I know, by the time I do all of this I have spent alot more than an AR. I can't afford to do this anyway but I want to.
22-rimfire
Member
I have no problems with the Mini-14. Always goes bang and the bullet generally goes where I point it. For those that hate them, just buy something else like a piece of bat guano AK47 clone. Any gun that rattles when I pick it up is not for me..... that has always been my problem with the old 1911's.
I have considered buying another barrel and I appeciate the aimstraight link given earlier in the thread. Never really expected the mini-14 to be a target rifle. Had a Mini-Uzi carbine (folding stock) and that thing couldn't group 3" at 25 yds. Sure was one major hunk of iron though and looked cool.
I have considered buying another barrel and I appeciate the aimstraight link given earlier in the thread. Never really expected the mini-14 to be a target rifle. Had a Mini-Uzi carbine (folding stock) and that thing couldn't group 3" at 25 yds. Sure was one major hunk of iron though and looked cool.
jonsidneyb
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I do not hate the Mini, It is just so close to what I want with what I consider a major flaw.
I don't want to go hiking with a black rifle is all. I have shot AK's and do not really care for them, the AK I last shot did get better groups than my mini.
I don't want to go hiking with a black rifle is all. I have shot AK's and do not really care for them, the AK I last shot did get better groups than my mini.
Froggy
Member
Just returned from a range session where I gave my fairly new Mini-14 (a 580-series ranch model) another go. No wind at all, clear skies, temp about 75 degrees, elevation about 5200' MSL, Remington 55 grain (L223R3). Using only iron sights.
At 25 yards, a ten round group was about 3/8" wide and 2" tall. Clear vertical stringing similar to last week's range session.
"Groups" on the 100 yard target were similar to last week... about 4" diameter, but with no wind they were nicely centered on the "X" ring.
I'm guessing it is as many folks believe.... the thin barrel has a bit too much wobble. I'm looking forward to a chance to try out that accu-strut gizmo.
At 25 yards, a ten round group was about 3/8" wide and 2" tall. Clear vertical stringing similar to last week's range session.
"Groups" on the 100 yard target were similar to last week... about 4" diameter, but with no wind they were nicely centered on the "X" ring.
I'm guessing it is as many folks believe.... the thin barrel has a bit too much wobble. I'm looking forward to a chance to try out that accu-strut gizmo.
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
Another thing about mini's is that the action cycles fairly violently, which can make the rifle difficult to benchrest. Mine seems unusually sensitive to bag placement, grip, cheek weld, etc. which makes it a royal pain to sight a scope in (even a 2.5x shotgun scope, which I tried to set up this weekend and could not get the darn thing sighted in to my satisfaction).
have had a 580 series mini for about a year or so now and have no complaints. iron sights (ghost ring standard, front blade with ears), Hogue stock is the only change I have made to it and it eats Wolf 62 grain without a burp.
sure it is not a savage fp and will never match my remmie .243 but I think it would be unwise for folks to think that the mini is junk just because somebody says so. that's the standard bs rap on the rifle. the truth is that it isn't a bad gun. it is a rugged two hundred yard rifle and I for one would not want to be shot at at even 300 hundred yards by someone with a mini, expecially not my mini.
rifles have uses. a friend of mine has a custom 6mm PPC. awesome rifle. but he would no more go wandering around in the dirt with that rifle than I would think to challenge him to a shoot-off with my mini. I don't knock his PPC because it is single shot. he doesn't knock my mini because it isn't. seems rational to me.
as for AR's, well I don't own one. government let me use one when they first came out and I hated it. these days you see guys shooting them all over the place and it seems that a real good rifle has finally emerged out of Stoner's design so I have nothing bad to say about it. I'll never buy one though. doesn't look enough like a rifle to me but then I can remember the "Mattel" derrogatives.
so I say we cut the mini some slack. it's just a utility semi-auto that is way fun to shoot and can really take a beating. that's all. it is just a gun for fun and circumstance.
tc
sure it is not a savage fp and will never match my remmie .243 but I think it would be unwise for folks to think that the mini is junk just because somebody says so. that's the standard bs rap on the rifle. the truth is that it isn't a bad gun. it is a rugged two hundred yard rifle and I for one would not want to be shot at at even 300 hundred yards by someone with a mini, expecially not my mini.
rifles have uses. a friend of mine has a custom 6mm PPC. awesome rifle. but he would no more go wandering around in the dirt with that rifle than I would think to challenge him to a shoot-off with my mini. I don't knock his PPC because it is single shot. he doesn't knock my mini because it isn't. seems rational to me.
as for AR's, well I don't own one. government let me use one when they first came out and I hated it. these days you see guys shooting them all over the place and it seems that a real good rifle has finally emerged out of Stoner's design so I have nothing bad to say about it. I'll never buy one though. doesn't look enough like a rifle to me but then I can remember the "Mattel" derrogatives.
so I say we cut the mini some slack. it's just a utility semi-auto that is way fun to shoot and can really take a beating. that's all. it is just a gun for fun and circumstance.
tc
Froggy
Member
Not sure if previous models are the same, but my 580-series Mini-14 has a twist rate of 1 in 9". While reading up on differences between 5.56 x 45mm and .223 Rem commercial ammo, I came across this:
http://www.barnaulammunition.com/121699Anews.htm
If you are having accuracy issues with your Mini-14, try switching to a heavier bullet. You might have to get some 5.56mm to get it... the only heavy bullet (60+grains) in a .223 Rem cartridge out here is the very pricey match ammo.
http://www.barnaulammunition.com/121699Anews.htm
If you are having accuracy issues with your Mini-14, try switching to a heavier bullet. You might have to get some 5.56mm to get it... the only heavy bullet (60+grains) in a .223 Rem cartridge out here is the very pricey match ammo.
I own a Mini-14.
Extremely reliable. Much more than the AR platform I'd say. Also uses a cleaner and much lower maintenance operating system. Breechbolt system has proven itself.
Very low maintenance as I said.
Not nearly as accurate as ARs. Low costs improvements can be made, some of which drastically improve accuracy. These improvements shouldn't add up to the cost where you could have gotten a decent AR-15.
Depends on what you want. If you want to shoot from the benchrest or you want a target rifle, get an AR. If you want a fun semi-automatic carbine at a lower price, get a Mini-14.
Extremely reliable. Much more than the AR platform I'd say. Also uses a cleaner and much lower maintenance operating system. Breechbolt system has proven itself.
Very low maintenance as I said.
Not nearly as accurate as ARs. Low costs improvements can be made, some of which drastically improve accuracy. These improvements shouldn't add up to the cost where you could have gotten a decent AR-15.
Depends on what you want. If you want to shoot from the benchrest or you want a target rifle, get an AR. If you want a fun semi-automatic carbine at a lower price, get a Mini-14.
Simonovfan
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Thank you.
I've been reading the mini-14 bash posts and couldn't of said it better. If you got a bull target barrel and had it bedded; it still wouldn't add up to the cost of a bottom rung AR. And then the plus that it doesn't "**** where it eats" as far as the poorly designed operating mechanism and it comes out ahead.
Speaking of which, the new gas piston uppers look pretty nice, but they're way over priced right now.
I've shot a couple of Mini's and "used to" own an AR and I like the Mini's better. Especially the action and handling. The Mini-14SS is going to be my next purchase.
I've been reading the mini-14 bash posts and couldn't of said it better. If you got a bull target barrel and had it bedded; it still wouldn't add up to the cost of a bottom rung AR. And then the plus that it doesn't "**** where it eats" as far as the poorly designed operating mechanism and it comes out ahead.
Speaking of which, the new gas piston uppers look pretty nice, but they're way over priced right now.I've shot a couple of Mini's and "used to" own an AR and I like the Mini's better. Especially the action and handling. The Mini-14SS is going to be my next purchase.
rangerruck
Member
now, supposedly, ruger changed everything they did for the mini's in 2005. ingredients, temps, pour specs, electronics, equipment, computer control, everything. And , supposedly, this reduced all 100 yd groups basically in half, on both the 14 and the 30. I have yet to see one of these being used, so I cannot tell you from personal experience, nor anecdotal.
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