Mini Milling Machine

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schmeky

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I want to be able to mill my own .330 x 65 x .070 front sight dovetails on pistol slides. There are other things as well, but the front sight dovetail would be my largest "gunsmithing" job.

My question is, can the current crop of mini-mills, i.e. Grizzly, Homier (Harbor Freight Sales) accomplish this task competently?

I know a Bridgeport would be better, but I specifically would like to know if these "home" versions are worth the money (about $500.00).
 
Ive been a machinist for a long time so I can answer this.

A firearm uses heat treated tool grade steels. This means a machine should be rigid and it should have horsepower. Neither of these are characteristics of benchtop hobby machines.

You are in a buyers market right now. Get on Ebay/equipment dealer sites and start sniping. There are deals everywhere.

Last. Once you "drop the panties" and buy a machine you'll find that you wondered how you ever lived without it. Buy the largest one you can possibly afford/fit in your shop. You'll find plenty of excuses to use it.

Good luck.

Chad
 
+1
the mini mills are good for small brass & aluminum jobs. not so good for steel. with any mill, be prepared to spend lots & lots for all the xtra's you'll need & want. i love my mini mill setup, but knew it's limitations beforehand. first thing is to convert to belt drive. they are a pain to tram. theres lots of info/forums @ google.
since this picture, i've put a DRO on the z axis, which it really needed.
am3.jpg
 
I have a Bridgeport but have been thinking of one of those mini-mills for my downstairs den/office/shop where I spend more time than in my big shop anymore.

I think that if there's a more rigid way to hold endmills than a drill chuck available it would probably be able to do sight cuts using carbide cutters ONLY.

Longrifles is right - HP and strength are the most important aspects of a mill, and those little machines don't have much of either one.

I bought my mill in ebay eight years ago for $3200. which at the time was a killer deal as it's not worn out, has x-axis feed, DRO, variable speed two horsepower and weighs 2400 lbs. See it amongst the clutter back there?

shop1.gif

Today my mill would cost less than $1500. in the same or better shape.


So is there a good collet system to hold cutters on them little guys?
 
BTW, if you do decide to get machine tools in ebay remember that for some reason they're all mostly on the east side.

It was $500. to get my BP home and I hate to think what it might cost today.
 
Thanx for the replies guys.

I guess I'm still looking for the answer to my original question: will a 1/2 - 3/4 hp mini mill accomplish a front sight cut? I have no problem making multiple passes, in fact, I anticipate it.

I am gunsmithing as a hobby on my own stuff, no commercial or high volume work. I can pick a mini-mill up at Harbor Freight for $523.00 out of the door not far from where I live.
 
having a mini mill, generally, i would say they dont work for steel. if your going to mill steel, it's the wrong tool.
btw, thats a jewelers chuck. mine uses R8.
 
I think it would do it, schmeky, with good cutters. EGW sells a nice double-ended carbide dovetail mill with 60 degrees on one end and 65 on the other, a 3/8" collet is needed is all. Good cutters go through slide steel like butter if you keep the rate down.

Husker, I didn't thnk I had room for a good track circuit so I built this instead....... Jinma1.gif LOL!
 
tell a little more about your tractor. is it set up for sled pulling. nice. i play with several old Case, Minneapolis,steamers, and some big old Rumlys to. they make the earth shake when their on the move.PS some where close theirs a rail road club waiting for a man like you. train mountain. org Chiloquin OR. 30 , miles of mane line track. PNW Live steamers. better PM about you tractor i don't want to hijack this thread any more than i already have
 
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You can buy a decent full sized mill used now for 1-3k. I'd go that route rather then buy a new table top model.
 
No way in hell is a mini mill ridged enough to run carbide tooling. Get a full sized knee mill. Figure out the biggest project you will probably work on and buy a mill at least 1.5 times as big. Easier to do small stuff on a big mill, than to fight with big stuff on a small mill....if its even possible.
 
As Longrifles said, get a used, real mill. I have a HUGE buffalo drill press, it's actually 8' tall. I bought it from a used machinery place for $350. It's sweet. I also just bought a 1960' vintage metal cutting vertical bandsaw with a 24" throat for $500.

Look on the practical machinist forum for used machinery dealers.
 
Husker, you don't want to know about that tractor - it's a Chinese made Jinma that I bought from a neighbor who was sick of it.
it runs OK and I can use it to cut my hayfield twice a year but it'd probably break if it needed to be a full time worker.

On the mini-mill - I've never used or even looked at one but cutting sight dovetails doesn't require a whole bunch from any machine tool so if it made a lot of light cuts without loading the tool very havily I still think it'd do it or it ought not be called mill at all. I know there's a lot of people doing some pretty fancy hobby work (little trains and steam engines and such) with those little mills and lathes 'cause I've looked at a few of their gathering places. Where's Varmint Al? He'd probably prove the point.
 
you right Krs. just take small cuts and a little more time and he should be fine. keep your bit nice and sharp good and cool. a good dial indicator to zero out your project. and go get after it
 
Here's a link to a guy's website that proves it can be done, and that a mini-mill can do much more than just dovetail a slide :http://www.geocities.com/kemays/

Ken Mays, if you're out there, you deserve a large amount of credits and accolades for having accomplished the builds of your guns!
For anyone interested - go through the build of Ken May's 1911 from an 80% frame. He details each step and describes fully how he did it and with what tools he did. It's a nice piece of work.
 
OK, now I'm back to square 1. Here's a guy (Ken Mays) cutting steel with a mini-mill. Yea, he's making incremental cuts of .010", but that's fine, patience I have.

I think I'll drop an e-mail to Ken Mays.
 
Mini mill

I have a grizzly mini mill and it does fine for cutting dovetails on 1911 frames , you do have to take small cuts. But I do agree that nothing beats a big mill. I've also cut a few dovetails on muzzle loaders.....low & slow.
 
The one used by Ken Mays is Grizzly green so the next question will be: Is the Grizzly mini-mill the same machine as the Harbor Freight model? I used to know that the little lathes were all the same except for the colors - is it now still true of the mills? I know that Grizzly charges more but that may not be a useful factor.
 
havoc7usmc & krs,

Thanx for your input. This is the kind of information I have been looking for, however, I respect in input and advice of everyone.

I think I'm going to give it a try, I'll probably order a mini-mill next week and start looking for some accessories, T-blocks, cutters, etc. I already have a Starrett Dial indicator, set of mics, depth gauges, vernier caliper, etc.

I have read on the 'net that one Chinese firm, Seig, makes all the current crop of mini-mills (Homier, Grizzly, et al). Main thing is find one that is R8 for a wider selection of cutting attachments.
 
I have another suggestion.
Consider a 10" between centers lathe and add a milling attachment.
Some of the benchtop combination Mill/Lathes are adequate enough for making the dovetail cuts in most firearm applications.

The $400 mini mills at 1/2 h.p. and 3/8" capacity are really not powerful enough for making these precision cuts and the other posters are right, you won't be satisfied with the results.
Hogging up and snapping an expensive dovetail cutter on an expensive slide isn't a good way to get into machining.

You would be better served with a 1 to 1 1/2 h.p 1/2" capacity bench top mill and even these would be best utilized if you make relief cuts centered on the dovetail path using a 1/8" to 3/32" drill before you make the first pass with the dovetail cutter.
Adding a stream of cutter fluid and keeping the speed and feed just below the dovetail cutter manufacturers maximum recomendations will keep chatter to a minimum. HTH
 
Schmeky,

I'm looking at the comparable tilt column mini-mill that's shown in the 2009 Grizzly catalog. While it is a variable speed 0 - 2500 rpm 3/4 HP job, it uses an MT #3 spindle taper.

The cutter holding type used by the HF mill is R8 as I remember. I could be wrong about that but if true it indicates that the machines may not be the same between the two outlets.

There's MT 3 tooling available still, certainly Grizzly will have some, but the R8 holders are more commonly used and available. You can find great deals on stuff like that if you can shop the various sites that sell it. There's millions of them, seems like.

It could be that Grizzly spec'd the machine this way to assure that customers would come to them for accessories and tooling. I ran into this once years ago in a situation where a seemingly generic tool I'd bought from them could not use parts from other sources, specifically the Mini-Machineshop.com.

Just a hint, or a tip, and take it as you like. I 'graduated' from a mini lathe to the one I have now, and graduated from a Jet mill-drill to the Bridgeport I have now although I still have the mill drill doing duty as a drill press. I never did try one of the mini-mills but as I said above I think I could use one in what has become my 'downstairs' office/small shop. I have a little Craftsman 6" x 18" lathe that I'm ready to move down here and once all my small toys are in here I'll be able to let my wife have all of the rest of the house. I think it'll make her happy. :)
 
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Onmilo,

Just about everyone who tries to do much with one of the Chinese combo machines that have a short bed and incorporate a mill/drill stand has gotten pretty badly frustrated. By the time they add a toolholder to the crossfeed, or attempt to use a vice made to fit theose small beds (a milling attachment) there's no room left on the machine to make cuts, or so little room that they have had to redo their setups to make half a cut from one side and the other half the other way, or things like that. It was near impossible to do any clean work that way and most every one who has started out that way gave up altogether or moved to separate machines for turning and milling.

There's the exception called "Smithy". Those are larger and much better made. Some really impressive work has come off of smithys over the years. But they are a whole different ballgame from this China initiated "Mini Machine Shop" craze that's gotten a ton of people into metal cutting who might not ever have had a chance to try it before.
 
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