Minimum caliber for dog protection

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I've never actually killed any crazed mongruels but in my opinion anything loud is likely to keep you from getting attacked if you discharge it at the ground. Once when I was walking the property line I saw several feral dogs walking around in the woods, I only had a .22lr revolver on me but when they got too close for comfort I fired it twice at the ground and that was enough to scare them off. Its a little snub with less than a two inch barrel and it is loud enough to make your ears ring pretty good, I guess it must sound fairly intimidating.

I realise that in town firing the gun off is not an option unless absolutely necessary in the area where I live I'll be alright if I fire off a couple of rounds to frighten away wild animals. It works on bobcats too. :)

If it was life or death and I was actually being attacked I'd feel pretty comfortable with a .38sp loaded with some frangible rounds.
 
If you don't shoot to stop the threat, how can you say you were genuinely in fear for your life? If you weren't in fear for your life, why did you draw and shoot? And I wouldn't trust frangible ammo to stop anything that was REALLY trying to hurt me.
 
I agree that shooting a dog should be a last resort, however, you may not have time to use a loud whistle or horn, shift to pepper spray, and then bring a weapon into battery and fire (sounds like some recent rules of engagement I have heard of). You need to evaluate the possible threat and be prepared to address it.

The one time I have had to shoot a dog was when a rabid collie from the next farm over decided he did not like me. Luckily I usually have a revolver handy and a 158 grain SWC over 6.4 grains of Unique settled the argument faster then you could blink an eye. But a few .32 rounds would propably have done it just as well. That assumes you can hit what you shoot at up close, and quick.
 
We have long, long threads about bears and cougars and people attacking people. Fido attacks more people than any other critter out there, except ourselves (humans attacking humans, I mean).

I have a Brittany Spaniel (Epagnuel Breton). I bought her because that breed has been culled for over 100 years to eliminate dog and human aggression. There were other reasons, primarily bird hunting, but that was the final one. I love the GSP, but they get too human, dog, and fur aggressive to suit me. I love Dobermans and GSDs, too, but ... I had little kids when I was shopping for a dog, and neighbors and friends and siblings with little kids. Mine are in Jr High and HS now, but the little kids keep cropping up from the other peoples' houses, and they're always in my house.

My dog will run and hide in her crate before she'll hurt one of those kids. That's what I want. She'll bark at the door. That's as much as I want her to do. I'm 5'10". I weigh 200lbs, and I have guns. She doesn't need to defend me. She's 27lbs of bird dog that thinks she's a lap dog. She'll lick people to death. But if we're ever threatened by a dangerous dog, the last place she'll be is between me and that dog. She has, multiple times, done exactly what I want her to do in that situation - get behind me and let me swing my stick.

Were I still able to run, I would carry an Airweight Jframe S&W, and an ASP. Dogs don't like it when you swing sticks at them. If they're not convinced by the stick, either swinging or knocking them about, then it's time for the gun. In fact, that's what I usually carry when I walk my dog, except I use a walking stick instead of an ASP.

I very nearly got into a fight with a guy who thought I was threatening his pit one day when it came after me, my dog, and my wife. But when he came up to me, he realized two things - First, I was inches taller than him, lift weights, and had a big damn stick in my hand, and second, it wasn't actually his dog. Or at least, that's what he said when I spun around with that stick as he came up to me yelling about why was I hitting his dog. :D My reply? "I haven't hit anything, yet."

So, yeah, people will get uptight about you threatening their dogs.

The absolute closest I have yet come to actually knocking a dog in the head was when a hound mix ambushed me and my Brit from between two parked cars. He was very serious. I had seen him stalking another dog walker from down the street - he bit that dog, I found out later. I crossed the street to be away from him, but he just picked another ambush site. My Brit danced around behind me when he came out, but he took off when the end of my stick swished past his nose.

The only time I've ever shot at a canine that was threatening me or the Brit was a coyote. We were hunting quail, and she was hitting some cover about 70 yards away when a coyote jumped up from where he was sunning himself and started stalking her. I popped off a round from my pistol that kicked up dirt in his face, and he left PDQ.

Dogs are no joke, for sure. Neither are their owners. But I'm not getting bitten again, even if I have to have it out with the owner after. Got bit a couple of times when I was delivering papers on my bike as a kid. Knocked one in the head with my big shackle lock, after it chased me and knocked me down. Not getting bitten again.

Any gun, .22lr and up, will kill a dog. My aunt used a .22 rifle to pop a GSD that was chasing a week-old foal in her corral. It ran off, but didn't make it to the road before it pitched over in the ditch next to the driveway. My dad was an animal control officer in the 60s. He used a .22 revolver, and a .22 rifle to take care of problem animals. Dogs aren't any tougher today - unless, perhaps, you think you need to be ready for one of those freakishly huge mastiffs. .22 will do the job, if you will do yours (hit the target).

Carry something you shoot well, and have a plan to deal with what may come up.

The plan, and your skill in implementing it, is more important than what gun/caliber you have. That's true for many situations.
 
I used to raise cattle. When you find one of your calves gutted and a dog pack eating the remains, you won't have any trouble shooting dogs after that. An AR works fine in those situations. These were always dogs their owners couldn't bear to put down so they dumped them in the country. It wasn't the dogs' fault, but I couldn't shoot the previous owners.
 
One of my buddies came and borrowed my nail gun the other day to put up a fence.. He has been having a LOT of problems with the neighbor behind him and his two pit bulls...

He returned the gun to me yesterday and said, "You know, pit bulls, at least my neighbors, give that nail gun a lot of respect.... now..."

I knew there was a story behind this, so I topped off my iced tea and said, OK, I'll bite..

He said that as he was putting up the last 40 or 5 boards, his neighbor released his Pits into the back yard.. they made a Bee Line for him, growling, barking, and moving at him in a pretty high rate of speed.. then he laughed and said, you know, I never hit one with the nail gun, but I put a couple between his legs, and he decided he was gonna be his own bad self... a little further away... they ran, and barked from a distance..

My point being... most dogs, unless of a hound breed (they are hard headed and determined, once they get something in their head you about HAVE to kill them to change their minds), or trained as a police attack dog, are gonna run like heck at the sound of any gunfire..

The 32 that you described is plenty, head on heart lung, or head shots preferred... but if you miss, it will probably hit the high road..
 
Let me hit this from the opposite side. I've got two dogs. One is a Greyhound that wouldn't/couldn't hurt a flea.

But the other is a German Shepherd that is a sweetheart to us family members, but dangerous as heck to others, especially if she considers the 'others' a threat.

If, for whatever reason, my German Shepherd got out, threw the leash, whatever, and attacked a neighbor, or a neighbor's kid, grandmother, wife, or whatever, I hope that my neighbor is packing heat, and is very accurate. Because that dog would need to be put down.

Now I love that German Shepherd. Especially because that German Shepherd loves my wife and would give it's life for her. But the dog is not worth the life of another human, or even worth the mauling of another human.

If the above scenario happened, I would blame myself or whoever let the dog loose, accidently or otherwise. I wouldn't blame the dog and I certainly wouldn't blame the neighbor who had to put the dog down. In fact, I would apologize to the neighbor and thank him if he was able to stop a tragedy.

Now, I don't expect the above to happen. We are careful with the dog, and it's not insanely violent. But it is a possibility if, for some reason, the dog got loose and considered a person or another dog as a threat, especially to my wife.

But it would be our own stupid fault for somehow letting the dog loose, NOT the fault of the person who was simply protecting himself or others.
 
How bout you just buy a can of pepper spray!

Being from CO certainly you must have a triple sized pack of bear spray? ;)

I have used pepper spray on dogs before while bicycling and it is extremely effective. All further pursuit was stopped immediately. Now I am not advocating not carrying nor attempting to dissuade you from deadly force. Just that if you miss with the first shot you may not get a second where with the spray its hard to miss....you may need both.
 
The thing is that any respectable frangible round is nothing to laugh at and will easily kill a dog if you hit him especially at the range you would actually have to shoot him. At least if you miss in a populated neighborhood that frangible round isn't going far, a HP round may still travel through a fence and hit some kid playing in his back yard. For home defense JHP ammo is my choice but in well populated areas I would rather load up a frangible round.

As I and some other posters said before though, if you miss then the dog will most likely be scared off anyways. I've scared off dogs plenty of times using just a .22 pistol.
 
I am far from certain that ANY premium JHP round will easily stop a charging rottweiler. Far less a frangible one. Frangible bullets don't do anything to prevent unintended injury when you miss the target and hit someone else. The whole point of being armed is to use an emergency tool to even the odds when your life is in danger. Using bullets with inferior penetration likelihood does not increase your odds.

You can shoot to scare. I will shoot to stop.
 
If my dogs run off and get shot, I figure they were doing something they shouldnt have. In the first place they shouldnt have run away. I love my dogs but wouldnt blame anyone for not wanting to get bitten.

Dogs do kill people. Just read the news. The spray will work most times but sometimes does not. I dont know about the bear spray but the cans are big and most people wouldnt want to carry something like that.
 
My experience: One 22 LR bullet from a pistol into CM did not work. The dog probably died later though.
My brother`s: it took 3 shots 9 mm Luger (FMJ, HP are illegal here).
 
The bear pepper spray works well. You don't need to shoot the canine because you'll get locked up nowadays for "animal cruelty" Using the bear pepper spray has inherent dangers. Spray down wind otherwise you will incapacitate yourself... hehehe how is the saying? "..'been there, done it?"
 
But if we're ever threatened by a dangerous dog, the last place she'll be is between me and that dog. She has, multiple times, done exactly what I want her to do in that situation - get behind me and let me swing my stick.
Now this, I get. Someone suggested earlier to use a dog to protect yourself from aggressive, dangerous dogs. That idea struck me to be about as emotionally endearing as adopting a baby to use as an airbag. Last thing I would want around a raging pitbull in attack mode is my own pet. Even if you had a large, aggressive breed, yourself, it might well escalate the situation.
 
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Whats worse, a attacking dog or bouncing .45 slugs around the neighborhood? The only shot I would take on a dog in a residential area would be straight down.
 
If the answer is a Taurus Judge...the question has to do with killing rats, snakes or tin cans.

Stopping a territorial Mastiff I would want something with some stopping power rather than relying on scaring the beast.
 
That would be the jogging route with the unicorns. Right? If you find it , let me know. Take a picture.

If you think about it, you really don't need a gun for anything. Just call the police. Carry a ham bone in your pocket so you can distract the dog and get away.

Well, you've certainly convinced me. From now on I'm going running with at least my AR-10 over my shoulder, 'cause REAL MEN live in constant fear of being mauled by chihuahuas. Plus, I'm sure my neighbors will understand that all the stray lead was necessarry to eliminate the serious threat of a charging Yorkie.


I don't jog, but I do ride a bike. I've been chased by dogs a few times. They like the spinning wheels. When I stop and get off my bike and put the bike between me and the dog, they lose interest and walk away. The biggest danger I've found are motorists who are too busy talking on cell phones or tuning their radio to actually look at the road and what's on it. I've had far far more run-ins with these bozozs than with killer dogs. So I guess my question is: "What caliber for motor vehicles?". Maybe I should start my own thread instead of hijacking this one.
 
Well, you've certainly convinced me. From now on I'm going running with at least my AR-10 over my shoulder, 'cause REAL MEN live in constant fear of being mauled by chihuahuas. Plus, I'm sure my neighbors will understand that all the stray lead was necessarry to eliminate the serious threat of a charging Yorkie.

Reductio ad absurdum

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_absurdum
 
just stand up to the dog. don't run the dog wont attack unless it's rabid. im very experienced in this on country roads with dobs rotts mutts on foot you run you get bit you stand up to them they'll turn tail and run
 
I am predisposed to believe that 22WMR is sufficient for defense against most aggressive dogs, and most aggressive people, for that matter. In part, due to the noise factor alone.

Most, not all.

Which is why 38+P or 357 JHP is what we choose to keep handy for home defense.
Which is what I would be carrying, in handgun or in carbine, depending on environment, if concerned about being attacked by either dog or man.
da' Judge is best reserved for watermelon work.

Most aggressive animals, man or beast, will back down if you simply show no fear and growl back. Most, not all. For the rest, there is 357 mag.
(there ain't no Grizz in south Georgia, but we do have more than our fair share of pit bulls; a dawg too stupid to back away from a boar hawg, is too stupid to back away from an old fat man; stupid carries a price, ask any hawg dawg)

PS
if 32 caliber was the choice, I would make it a 327 heavyweight, not a 32 H&R middleweight
 
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I agree with Pcola and Ironhead...too many people do not take the responsibility of dog ownership seriously. And for the most part like stated it isn't the dogs fault. But if my dog gets loose and attacks someone,whatever method is used to stop the attack is justified in my opinion and a apology by me is in order,as well as paying the medical bills.

As far as feral dogs go they are nothing more than predators in my book and dealt with accordingly. Again it's irresponsible owners that let those dogs run or they were let loose out in the country. Once a viscous dog looks you in the eyes and growls just before it attacks you,your position on shooting it may change as the hair on your neck stands up and you get that primal tingly feeling in your body.

So by all means enjoy owning your dog they are great companions for many people but please make sure you are responsible for their actions.
 
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