mixing in in domestic abuse

[old lady new shooter]

There was a thread awhile back where everyone pretty much agreed that mixing in in a domestic abuse situation often results in both parties turning on the would-be rescuer.

Today at http://www.theblaze.com/stories/201...ited-with-thwarting-a-terrorist-got-involved/
there is further detail about the stabbing of Spencer Stone outside a Sacramento bar -- there is a video interview with an eyewitness who said Stone jumped in after a man who had just been hit with a plastic bag by a woman punched her in response. We already know that the result was Stone getting stabbed multiple times, but the kicker here is that THE SURVEILLANCE VIDEO SHOWS THE WOMAN GETTING INTO THE SAME CAR AS HER ATTACKER AFTER THE ALTERCATION.

From the POV of strategies and tactics, do you guys think Stone's response was correct when he saw the man punch the woman, or if not, what should he have done?

 

[TomJ]

It's hard to say without having been there, but in general my advice would be to call the police and if the situation warrants it, let the attacker know you called them.

I was involved with too many of these situations when I was a LEO where the person you're trying to protect turns on you and sides with her attacker. To be clear, I'm not saying a woman being attacked deserves to be hurt, nor am I saying you shouldn't do anything. My personal opinion based on my experience is to let the police, who are equipped to deal with this, do so.

 

[Husker_Fan]

My city's police policy was (and may still be) that a single officer was never to intervene with a domestic abuse until they had backup. These are some of the most unpredictable and dangerous situations cops get into. I think it's best to be a good witness and only get involved if you think it is absolutely necessary.

A1C Stone acted admirably in jumping to the defense of someone, but It may not have been the best response. I wish him a speedy recovery.

 

[Jeff White]

He should have pulled out his cell and called 911. I don't get paid to intervene in domestic disputes anymore and I am glad that I don't have to.

More then once one party or the other would say: arrest him/her I want them gone, I'll sign the complaint only to end up in a fight with both of them when the cuffs went on.

Then add in the fact that despite what you just saw, you probably don't have the full story.

We had a fairly regular call where a couple routinely beat on each other. After several calls there ( neither party would ever press charges) I asked the female half ( the other officer was talking to the male half) why they stayed together. Her answer floored me: "The make-up sex is too good to stop fighting or split up!"

So you never know what you're getting into. Call the police and be a good witness.

 

[DaisyCutter]

In uniform, on the clock, sometimes you have to go in and punch one, tase the other. I did it plenty when I was younger.

Off the clock, I'm avoiding the situation unless someone is going to suffer grevious bodily harm.

It ain't worth it. Just today, I attended a pre-trial settlement conference reference aggravated assault on a cop (me). It was a straight up brawl with an 18 year old. Ample witnesses, solid case.

The plea offered was for an undesignated felony, probation, and a $200 fine. The felony drops to a misdemeanor if the defendant completes probation.

Hitting a cop is half the fine of a HOV lane violation, SMH.

Had I hit first, it would've been a multi-million dollar lawsuit.

Do you really want to risk your safety and assets over a couple chuds hitting each other?

We don't have a justice system, it's a legal system and it's *for profit*. The more you have to lose, the more they will take.

Think twice.

 

[Double_J]

A friend of mine ended up with a knife in the vest from a domestic call. The woman stuck him while he was talking to the man. The second responding officer saw her grab the knife from the drawer but was too late to stop her. Both parties ended up going to jail for a long time, one for aggravated assault and one for several warrants.

The rules changed and at least two officers are on scene before anyone is approached in a domestic call.
I would have called 911, told them I was making the call, and stood back unless I had to intervene.

 

[Bobson]

I don't know if this is completely true (I don't have a valid source to cite here), but in CJ classes years back, we were taught that domestic situations are where most LEOs lose their lives. Something like 33% of in-the-line-of-duty deaths are when responding to these types of situations...

Food for thought, if nothing else.

Those of you who are cops, thanks for what you do. Ridiculous amount of BS to put up with these days, even before getting to the danger of the job.

 

[DeepSouth]

Without all of the correct information it's impossible to know for sure.
That said I'll point you to my signature line, the bottom one.

 

[Mike J]

I would probably call the police & let them handle it. I learned a valuable lesson when I was a kid. I played a lot with 2 brothers down the street. One day I tried to stop them from fighting. I wound up with both of them jumping on me. I don't meddle in other peoples family/domestic squabbles.

 

[Plan2Live]

What were the dynamics? Was the woman a victim or a consenter? What was Stone's state of sobriety? Was he even in a position to be making such potentially life altering decisions? Did his recent success instill an unrealistic expectation in his mind regarding the positive outcome of future intervention situations?

My parents and experience taught me that nothing good happens after midnight. I believe Col. Cooper said something like "don't go to stupid places and do stupid things with stupid people". I realize going out to nightclubs is a rite of passage that most young people (and a few older folks who refuse to let go) participate in but overall it really isn't a good idea.

 

[Deanimator]

I'm not a cop. I don't want to be a cop or do the things that cops get paid to do.

It's my job to protect myself and people to whom I feel a duty of care, primarily family members and close friends. I have no expectation of anybody else "protecting" me, be they police or private citizen.

I don't get paid to maintain public order, investigate crimes or apprehend suspects.

The police don't get paid to protect people as individuals. They DO get paid to maintain public order, investigate crimes and apprehend suspects. I leave such tasks to them.

I have observed FAR too many domestic violence situations to EVER get involved in one, ESPECIALLY one involving strangers. All too often the women keep coming back to the men who beat them... or worse.

The ONLY way I'd EVER get involved in a violent action between strangers is if I had ZERO doubt about the criminal nature of the activity, and there was IMMEDIATE threat to LIFE.

A guy punching a woman? Dial 911.

A guy shooting up Santa's Village at the mall while screaming "Allahu Akhbar!"? Proper sight picture, breath control, and trigger squeeze until the problem is resolved.

 

[IWAC]

A1C Stone acted admirably in jumping to the defense of someone, but It may not have been the best response. I wish him a speedy recovery.

Totally agree with that, and we don't have the whole story. What worked for him the last time didn't this time, sadly, with unfortunate consequences. May Airman Stone Live Long, and Prosper!

Perhaps the old adage; "Don't expect a wise head on young shoulders." might apply here..problem is, a lot of old shoulders don't carry wise heads, either, especially where alcohol is involved.

 

[tuj]

We don't have a justice system, it's a legal system and it's *for profit*.

you just nailed it.

 

[jeepnik]

DO NOT DO IT! It will not turn out well for you.

Years ago we responded to an injury call. Seems a woman had fallen and was injured. Yes, she was injured. Dislocated shoulder and broken wrist. And numerous bruises and abrasions.

Stupid me knew it wasn't a fall and ask the husband why he had dislocated her shoulder. He remained silent. Word of advise, never ever turn your back on an abuser after confronting them.

Leave it to the cops. Let them deal with it. Besides, push come to shove they can shoot back.

 

[alsaqr]

There is a message here: Do not intervene in a domestic fight in or near a booze joint.

Simply call the cops.

 

[Jeff White]

What makes a domestic any safer away from a booze joint?

 

[strambo]

I would only entertain the idea of intervening if it looked like life/limb or eyesight was at stake. Short of that, call 911 and be a good witness.

 

[Pilot]

In uniform, on the clock, sometimes you have to go in and punch one, tase the other. I did it plenty when I was younger.

Off the clock, I'm avoiding the situation unless someone is going to suffer grevious bodily harm.

It ain't worth it. Just today, I attended a pre-trial settlement conference reference aggravated assault on a cop (me). It was a straight up brawl with an 18 year old. Ample witnesses, solid case.

The plea offered was for an undesignated felony, probation, and a $200 fine. The felony drops to a misdemeanor if the defendant completes probation.

Hitting a cop is half the fine of a HOV lane violation, SMH.

Had I hit first, it would've been a multi-million dollar lawsuit.

Do you really want to risk your safety and assets over a couple chuds hitting each other?

We don't have a justice system, it's a legal system and it's *for profit*. The more you have to lose, the more they will take.

Think twice.

Yes, you just did nail it. I am surprised most people either don't know this, or don't talk about it. The system is designed to get you in it so you are spending legal fees, court costs, fines, and any other monetary tool they have to get your money, and assets. It is scary, and that is just one reason I NEVER poke the bear.

Law isn't right, wrong, or even fair, it is just the law, and more and more being used as a revenue generator for various government jurisdictions.

 

[jeepnik]

What makes a domestic any safer away from a booze joint?

Hell, the worst bar in the world is safer than a domestic call in the more upscale area. Never got hit in the back of the head working on someone injured in or outside of a bar.

 

[Jeff White]

That's my point, domestics are dangerous situations where ever they occur. If you don't have to by virtue of your employment, stay out of it.