Mmm.. Glock 19 again.

[Trent]

I went to Big R tonight during their 20% off firearm sale from 8-midnight.. and picked up a new Glock 19 4th gen for $479..

I owned a 17 up to 2003.. then traded it on a 19.. then sold the 19 in 2007, and I've regretted it ever since.

Are the trigger components the same between Gen2 / Gen4? I pulled my spring kit out and put the 19 factory before I sold it and still have my preferred weight springs in my parts bin.

Will they fit?

Also are the frames the same dimensions as Gen2? I still have three holsters from my G19, hoping they'll fit.

I can't pick up the 19 for 3 days (IL waiting period), so I can't tear in to it until then.

This is my first 4th gen.

 

[JohnKSa]

The trigger spring and firing pin srping should be the same. The trigger bar and connector are different.

 

[Trent]

Thanks John!

 

[eldon519]

The Gen 4s are very nice. I think the Gen 4 trigger is more consistent although maybe a tad more springy feeling than my Gen 3. I'd still mark the Gen 4 as an improvement.

 

[Deputy25]

I have 3 Glock 19s, 2nd/3rd/4th generation. They all fit in the same holsters.

 

[Trent]

Thanks Deputy!

Looking forward to picking it up Friday. This will be my spring/fall CCW gun. (Full sized in winter.. still haven't selected a summer CCW yet.)

 

[Trent]

OK bumping this for another question.

Took the gen4 G19 out and shot it yesterday.

Does the Gen4 changes to the trigger bar change the trigger pull slightly? This trigger pull feels WAY different than my 2nd gen Glock 21, or my old 1st gen G17 and G19.

I was having a hard time getting used to the feel yesterday. It almost seems like it's a longer, slightly heavier pull, and slightly different reset feel than on my older Glocks.

 

[JohnKSa]

Yes, there are some changes to the trigger bar that changed how the trigger feels. That is the reason for the "dot" connector which should now be standard in the Gen4 guns.

If you put a standard connector in a Gen4 gun, the trigger pull will be heavier than the "5.5lb" pull that is the Glock standard. The "dot" connector is somewhere between the standard connector and the "-" connector and should bring the trigger pull down to the standard pull weight. The feel may still be slightly different, but not much.

It might be possible that some of the early Gen4 guns shipped with standard connectors. If that is the case with your gun, you can either install a "-" connector or contact Glock and ask them for a "dot" connector.

 

[JDR]

I went to Big R tonight during their 20% off firearm sale from 8-midnight.. and picked up a new Glock 19 4th gen for $479..

That's a real deal right there!

 

[Trent]

Thanks John!

I was seriously starting to wonder about my sanity when I was at the range yesterday shooting this thing. "This does NOT feel like a dang Glock.. but it does."

My first shots from draw were WAY the hell off the mark at first. (Timing on the trigger break was wrong, I was point shooting)

I'm worried that if I get used to this trigger I will throw my first-round point fire shots off on my other Glock.

Will play around with the connectors. I'm not so much worried about the pull weight as I am the break, because my first shot from a draw generally isn't aimed, it's timed by feel. (Aimed fire was spot on, it shot at the 11 o'clock mark by 2". Groups were good I can correct the 11o'clock point of impact by shifting the rear sight very slightly and using a 6 o'clock hold instead of a split-bull hold).

 

[Trent]

An update on this purchase.

It's been my daily carry piece all year.. put lots of rounds downrange out of it.

This last trip, something changed though. Shot three different types of practice ammo, all did the same thing - cases started ejecting back, whacking me in the face.

It's got around 2,500 rounds through it.

Do the new main springs not get as much service life as the older ones?

Should I go factory or aftermarket on replacement?

 

[mizer67]

Ah yes, brass to the face (BTF).

It's most likely not the recoil spring assembly. For several years now Glocks have been experiencing this issue, usually it manifests itself in the first 1,000 rounds. Mine did it at about 1,200. It was very bad in with the early Gen4's but also migrated to the Gen3's. The likely culprit is somewhere in the extraction cycle, many point to the extractors.

I went through a lot of parts changes trying to get my early Gen4 to stop pelting me in the noggin' with hot brass, including changing the recoil spring, different stock extractors like a .40 and other mfg. 9mm extractors, changing the extractor springs around and even filing the ejector to change the angle of ejection. None of that helped my pistol.

What actually worked for me was the APEX FRE in conjunction with the provided extractor spring and the non-LCI bearing that APEX recommends. Even this is not a foolproof solution, however. It is what I would recommend you try first though. I have two Gen4's that run 100% with them installed and they were drop in fits for me.

 

[Boge]

BTF is caused by limpwristing. Period. I have shot dozens of Glocks whereas the owner was whining about BTF and they worked perfectly for me. Grip it like a man and not a teacup.

 

[HOOfan_1]

Grip it like a man and not a teacup.

Not a good analogy....

 

[Trent]

BTF is caused by limpwristing. Period. I have shot dozens of Glocks whereas the owner was whining about BTF and they worked perfectly for me. Grip it like a man and not a teacup.

You're making an awful big assumption there, chief.

I teach firearms classes as a multidiscipline NRA instructor; I'm authorized by the Illinois State Police to teach concealed carry; I taught marines the love and care of Soviet Bloc weapons before they deployed to the sandbox; and I've been on TV teaching people how to shoot.

Limpwristing, I am most certainly not doing.

 

[Trent]

Ah yes, brass to the face (BTF).

It's most likely not the recoil spring assembly. For several years now Glocks have been experiencing this issue, usually it manifests itself in the first 1,000 rounds. Mine did it at about 1,200. It was very bad in with the early Gen4's but also migrated to the Gen3's. The likely culprit is somewhere in the extraction cycle, many point to the extractors.

I went through a lot of parts changes trying to get my early Gen4 to stop pelting me in the noggin' with hot brass, including changing the recoil spring, different stock extractors like a .40 and other mfg. 9mm extractors, changing the extractor springs around and even filing the ejector to change the angle of ejection. None of that helped my pistol.

What actually worked for me was the APEX FRE in conjunction with the provided extractor spring and the non-LCI bearing that APEX recommends. Even this is not a foolproof solution, however. It is what I would recommend you try first though. I have two Gen4's that run 100% with them installed and they were drop in fits for me.

Thanks for the constructive feedback.

It's only doing it about once or twice per magazine at this point; but did it each with Blazer, Aguila, my 115gr berry's plated reloads, and (checked tonight) it also ejects erratically with Hornady Critical defense 115gr.

Going to try a different *magazine* first, as tonight I noted it didn't lock back on the last round. If the magazine spring has weakened it could explain the wrong geometry on extraction/ejection.

Hopefully, it's just a magazine. I have plenty of spares so I'll post an update after another round of testing (will be next weekend).

 

[tarosean]

You're making an awful big assumption there, chief.

I think its ingrained into glockaholics to blame everything but the gun.


Unfortunately, there really isnt a simple answer, it will likely get worse,while taking a culmination of parts swaps to fix.

 

[HexHead]

See if it continues to do it with 124gr ammo before you start replacing extractors etc. Are those reloads your own? If so, and you started with a minimum load and worked up, you should be familiar with how lower powered loads effect ejection.

One load I was working up for my 17 went from no ejection to ejecting to the left, straight up, back at my head and finally nicely to the right as I increased the powder charge .1gr. at a time.

I've seen this time and time again on the internet, not just with Glocks, but with Kimbers, other 1911s etc, people buy the cheapest ammo they can find, then blame the gun. And I've never had any semi-auto that occasionally didn't throw a piece of brass back at me. The ammo just isn't that consistent. You don't want to get hit with brass? Get a revolver.

 

[Trent]

See if it continues to do it with 124gr ammo before you start replacing extractors etc. Are those reloads your own? If so, and you started with a minimum load and worked up, you should be familiar with how lower powered loads effect ejection.

One load I was working up for my 17 went from no ejection to ejecting to the left, straight up, back at my head and finally nicely to the right as I increased the powder charge .1gr. at a time.

Most of the 2500 rounds I fired through it this year were my own reloads; 115gr Berry's plated, .2 gr under max for the powder (bullseye).

Never a problem until this last range trip, and it happened with 3 types of ammo. Also happened after work on the way home with Hornady critical defense (stopped by the range and went through my magazine to see if it'd happen with that ammo since it is what I carry - started bothering me... now it bothers me more.. lol)

The only difference is on that ammo, the slide failed to lock back.

Will know more this weekend. I didn't think of it at the time, but now my gut is telling me it's the magazine spring.

 

[NOMI WASP]

I assure you it's not the magazine spring. I have a Gen 3 with BTF and I changed the ejector to the 30274 and it helped alot.

There are all kinds of ideas floating around about what causes the issue. I was told Glock is using 40 cal springs in the 9mm because their pistols are made for NATO ammo which is basically +P when I run hot stuff through mine I have no BTF. When I use the wimpy 115 it happens. I had a couple times when the slide didn't lock also but I attribute that to weak ammo.

I believe it gets better with time and rounds through the pistol. Good luck because I know how you feel. I sent mine back to Glock twice and even had it replaced and the new one still does it. I finally figured I would part swap until I got an acceptable rate of BTF.

I may try the APEX at some point but it's getting better leaving the gun locked open a couple times a week. Keep us updated!

 

[Thompsoncustom]

I know the reason my glock throws brass every which way, On mine it's the extractor itself. The extractor is out of spec and doesn't hold the brass to the breachface. I'm guessing a apex extractor would fix the issue.

 

[Gtscotty]

I re-read your posts, but didn't see if you had tried any heavier bullet loads than 115gr? I really only run heavy bullet stuff out of my Glocks (135gr 9mm, 180gr .40) and haven't had any BTF problems... might be worth a try just to get another data point.

 

[Trent]

I re-read your posts, but didn't see if you had tried any heavier bullet loads than 115gr? I really only run heavy bullet stuff out of my Glocks (135gr 9mm, 180gr .40) and haven't had any BTF problems... might be worth a try just to get another data point.

I've got a few boxes of 124gr reloads in the basement I could try this weekend.

ETA: I'll bring a bunch of different types of ammo to play with this weekend, just to get as much info as possible.

I *think* I still have a couple spare main springs and parts left from my last Glock 19 (sold it back in 2006), somewhere in the gun room. Will go digging for those too.

 

[GLOOB]

I know the reason my glock throws brass every which way, On mine it's the extractor itself. The extractor is out of spec and doesn't hold the brass to the breechface. I'm guessing a apex extractor would fix the issue.

My vintage 3rd gen 9mm glock is like this. I found it curious at the time I noticed it. My 40 and 45 Glocks are not like that. But I've never had any reliability or ejection problems with mine, so I thought it was normal. Now, I want to start a poll.

 

[Wisco]

BTF is caused by limpwristing. Period. I have shot dozens of Glocks whereas the owner was whining about BTF and they worked perfectly for me. Grip it like a man and not a teacup.

That's false.

I changed my ejectors on both my newer G19 Gen3 pistols and the brass-to-face stopped immediately. I used my same weak, teacup grip before AND after changing, so I know it wasn't just my grip.