More distortions by CNN

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P.O.2010

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I was watching the International version of CNN this morning, the one which is broadcast primarily for the benefit of those in Europe but which you can see in the U.S., and they are running a series on the fighting in Mexico.

CNN broadcast a long segment, about ten minutes in length, where CNN correspondents interviewed ATF agents, Mexican Federal Police and Mexican Army officials and all of them blamed the United States for the conflict in Mexico stating that the cartel's arms are virtually all American in origin.

One of the most nauseating parts of the broadcast was the part where the CNN correspondent tried to demonize .50 rifles by showing a building that was shot up by the cartels and which happens to be next to a day care center (a fact that was hammered on again and again in ham fisted fashion). He then panned to a shot of a Barrett rifle despite the fact that no one knew what type of weapon was employed to actually hit the building and despite the fact that no weapon was recovered in this case. I had experience in the Army with .50 machine guns and it appeared to me that the building was on the receiving end of a burst from an M2, something which cannot simply be purchased over the counter. The rounds were too close together and formed a "trail" of sorts as though the shooter was walking the rounds in.

Other parts of the segment were spent demonizing people who purchase ammuntion in bulk or purchase more than one firearm. ATF agents were interviewed on the program stating that they are going to gun shows in Arizona and other border regions and arresting people who purchase ammuntion in large quantities (what constitutes a large quantity was not defined) as well as people who purchase multiple firearms. Specifically anyone paying cash or talking on a cellular telephone at any time during their presence at the gun show was said to be targeted. The impression was given by the report that gun shows are entirely illegitimate and that only criminals attend them. In addition, mention was made of the Arizona gun shop where the owner was arrested but later discharged (the case has been mentioned here on THR). ATF agents showed off sealed brick packs of WOLF ammo and bragged that they had confiscated 8,000 rounds of said ammo.

Most frustrating was the end of the segment where the CNN reporter started going through an evidence locker and talking about thirty AK-47 rifles which were seized in Mexico. He then implies that these were purchased from sporting goods stores in the U.S. and says that they are "Romanian knock-offs". The report then cuts to an ATF agent shooting a fully automatic AK-47 on the firing range. You can tell that this AK-47 is not any of the ones in the previously shown evidence locker since the ones in evidence had thumb-hole stocks and this one has a standard stock. Typical misdirection and substitution. The report also shows fully automatic AK-47s with silencers and implies, but never says directly, that they are American in origin. The report then shows a fully automatic AK-47 being fired at a second chance vest implying that it's only purpose is to kill policemen.

The report also states specifically that the FN 5.7 is a weapon which has no other purpose but to kill policemen and that it is referred to as "Mata Policias" by the cartels. An ATF agent then states that the pistol is in high demand because it can penetrate a bullet resistant vest something which is not true unless you have special AP ammo which is illegal with very few exceptions.

The reason I mention this is because it is obvious that there is an agenda here. The lies and distortions throughout this particular piece were legion; I probably missed some. The segment I've just mentioned was extremely propagandistic in the way it was presented and was clearly meant to demonize gun owners, gun shows, the purchase of bulk ammuntion, the ownership of .308 and .223 rifles in general and AR-15s/AK-47s in particular and to drum up public support for a ban on .50 rifles which were referred to as "war weapons" and the "biggest gun you can legally buy in America".
 
That is insane! Oh, the FN5.7 with a muzzle velocity of over 4000fps certainly will penetrate a vest.

The 5.7 doesn't reach anywhere NEAR 4k fps even out of a rifle. Be certain of what you are talking about before you state it as fact.
 
Well, how else can you justify an AWB when AWBs still have very minimal use in street crime?

Guns from America have been going illegally to Mexico for years, it hasn't been widely talked about or much of a concern until recently.

I tend to doubt that Mexican Mafia cartels are mainly supplied by America (and I bet it's almost impossible to get reliable stats on that both because it's clandestine criminal activities, and because the Mexican government is super corrupt). Even IF we were a big supplier, I'm pretty sure a 68 billion dollar industry could find a different supplier.
 
"The 5.7 doesn't reach anywhere NEAR 4k fps even out of a rifle. Be certain of what you are talking about before you state it as fact."

What I said is %100% accurate. With a muzzle velocity of over 4000 fps It would penetrate a vest. I did not state that it was capable of 4000 fps. And it was intended as sarcasm. Oh, it was right here on THR where the 4000fps number came from. The same post claimed 200yd accuracy from the handgun. Hence the sarcasm.
 
I wonder how they would respond to the fact that several years ago the US gov't legally sold a batch of Barretts to the Mexican gov't and that we have not been allowed to track those weapons. What are the odds that some have been sold or "loaned" to the cartels? What, corruption at high levels in the Mexican gov't and army? Gasp....say it ain't so, Joe.
 
Once again liberals utilize an international crisis to push their own agenda. While I am appaled, I am also amazed that anyone is suprised by this.

On the other hand, if we all give up our guns, the drug dealers and other violent criminals will too... :banghead:

I do have a lot of respect for the Mexican Army for taking on the problem of the drug cartels head-on. Keep them in your prayers.
 
At any one time 20% of Mexican police are under investigation for corruption. The UN Human Rights Commission conducted a study five years ago that showed that 1 in 10 crimes are reported and 1 in ten crimes that are reported resulted in an arrest. Further 1 in 10 crimes that result in arrest result in jail time for the offender. Basically if you commit a crime you have a 1 in 1000 chance of going to jail. Wonder why there is a problem?
 
Other parts of the segment were spent demonizing people who purchase ammuntion in bulk or purchase more than one firearm. ATF agents were interviewed on the program stating that they are going to gun shows in Arizona and other border regions and arresting people who purchase ammuntion in large quantities (what constitutes a large quantity was not defined) as well as people who purchase multiple firearms. Specifically anyone paying cash or talking on a cellular telephone at any time during their presence at the gun show was said to be targeted. The impression was given by the report that gun shows are entirely illegitimate and that only criminals attend them. In addition, mention was made of the Arizona gun shop where the owner was arrested but later discharged (the case has been mentioned here on THR). ATF agents showed off sealed brick packs of WOLF ammo and bragged that they had confiscated 8,000 rounds of said ammo.

I often attend gun shows in Tucson. It is true that people are buying large quantities of ammunition. I have watched some wheel out stacks of cases on hand carts, and come back for more. By Sunday afternoon most of what was available (and there was a lot of it) was gone. The sale of accessories, especially large capacity magazines (including drums) were brisk. There are a lot of people jabbering away on cell phones, and there is no way the BATF&E could keep track of them.

At no time have I seen any arrests being made. Nor have I heard of any, either at the shows or afterwards. It is absolutely certain that nothing like what you stated above could happen, and not make the local media – if not more then that. If such news were suppressed in the media it would still leak out through the Internet, or local dealers who would have heard of it.

I come to the conclusion that either CNN or the BATF&E are liars – possibly both. I know of other reports that were attributed to local BATF&E agents that those who live here know are not true.

It is true that some firearms of all kinds go south from the U.S. to Mexico. The reason is the same that drugs come north. Both are prohibited by the respective governments, and there is money to be made by supplying the prohibited items. But the firearms are nothing more then would be found in an ordinary retail shop or gun show held elsewhere. This whole thing is a fraud, designed to provide a context under which certain kinds of firearms and ammunition can be either banned or curtailed in the United States.
 
It's CNN.

It's what they do. Do you get annoyed when fish swim or horses run?

Why do people continue to watch shows that they know are going to irritate them? All they're doing is boosting the ratings, which the Program Director will interpret as "good TV". The result? More drivel.
 
Why do people continue to watch shows that they know are going to irritate them? All they're doing is boosting the ratings, which the Program Director will interpret as "good TV". The result? More drivel.

It's distorting the American audience, so there needs to be truth and validity during these segments.

EVERYONE, please make continual comments to CNN in a respectable and professional fashion.
 
I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that many of the weapons used in cartel violence originated in the United States. However, I would also be willing to bet that the bulk of them made a stop in a Mexican government armory (courtesy of our own government) before reaching their final destination. Why else would the Mexican government be so hesitant to disclose the serial numbers of captured weapons? Nevertheless, it doesn't really matter where these weapons are coming from: they aren't the cause or source of said violence, and the demand that is there for them implies a much deeper problem. And even still, you can bet there are producers and sellers all over the world who would be lining up to pick up the slack.
 
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It's CNN.

It's what they do. Do you get annoyed when fish swim or horses run?
I think that the worst mistake we can make is to stop holding them accountable for their actions.

Am I surprised at their reporting? No.

Will I accept it without comment? No. Silence equates to tacit approval.
 
Have you let CNN know?

What would be the point? CNN is nothing more than the propaganda arm of the American Leftist movement. Do you think they’re going to run a redaction and admit that the story was false? I think it’s taken for granted here that CNN has an agenda and personal firearms ownership isn’t part of it.

Will I accept it without comment? No. Silence equates to tacit approval.
What is it going to accomplish? They won't listen, they won't change , they won't even acknowlege you even said it.
 
Silence equates to tacit approval.

Never be silent.

I agree in principle but I'm not wasting my time talking to a deaf person or taking a blind person to an art museum
 
Some of you might be surprised to know that
most people don't 'buy' any of the media outlet's propaganda any more.

Whether it be CNN, MSNBC, FOX, ABC, CBS, NBC, BBC et el.

Why do you think there's an internet explosion
of forums and alternate media outlets?
(The information super highway)...

I think it's because people aren't being fooled anymore
by the handful who control the TV 'news' content
and as a result turn to the net for more reliable (in some cases) content..
 
Who are you going to hold CNN accountable to? Themselves?

The amount of money CNN can charge for a commercial is directly proportional to the size of their viewership. The more people watching, the more money they make.

In effect, you're financially supporting CNN and everything they stand for by watching that network. Complaining only reinforces that they're doing everything right.
 
"What is it going to accomplish? They won't listen, they won't change , they won't even acknowlege you even said it."

They won't listen to you. Don't worry though the rest of us are on the job for those that have given up.
 
CNN is a business. Businesses like to make money. I know these are all surprises, but try to keep up here. They want everyone to watch them, because more people that watch the more money they can make. If lots of people call and complain they will then think "wow, we could make more money if we stopped being jackasses." To think you are not one of their customers when you subscribe to cable/satellite is asinine. It is not you against them, it is them working for you and when someone works for you they need a performance review from time to time.
 
sorry if a dupe.

http://www.gunnewsdaily.com/rw807.html

You and I Can't Buy the Guns Mexican Cartels Own
The Administration is Not Dealing Straight With Us on Mexico's Gun Problem

Ralph Weller
March 1 2009


Let's set things straight right up front. Yes, some guns are being smuggled into Mexico from the U.S. Most are handguns. But, handguns are being illegally trafficked from state to state and from the U.S. to Canada. It should come as no surprise that guns are smuggled into Mexico. But, the problem being portrayed by the U.S. media and our government is not as it seems. You see, Mexico doesn't allow ownership of most firearms, so ordinary Mexican people seeking self-protection will find a way to get them into Mexico. As for the drug cartels operating in the border towns along the U.S., they have other sources for their weapons and have become the prime supplier within Mexico.

I worked in Mexico in a border town for about five years. It was far enough from San Diego County in the Sonora Desert of Mexico that commuting several hundred miles daily was impossible. So, for a few years I lived in the city and commuted home periodically on some weekends. As crime grew out of control, I eventually moved into a place on the U.S. side and commuted daily in and out of Mexico for my own safety.

I stayed in Mexico for a Mexican holiday my first year. I don't recall the holiday. Normally, I would leave Mexico for a holiday, but it was in the middle of the week and one day was not long enough to come home. All I know is that on that particular Mexican holiday, Mexicans love to fire guns into the air. That evening as I sat on the balcony of my hotel, the gun fire that erupted in celebration was quite unbelievable. It was so intense I backed off the balcony and watched the festivities from a couple three feet in the room. We're talking war-like firing of weapons, it was that intense.

As I listened that night to the gun fire, I was somewhat shocked at the amount of fully automatic gun fire. It wasn't sporadic. It was continuous throughout the city. For a country that bans guns I thought, how in the world did they get their hands on all these full-auto weapons? Clearly what sounded like M16 fire was prolific along with 7.62 x 39 AK autos with a smattering of smaller caliber full-autos, most likely 9mm. Gun fire can be heard in most American cities on New Years, but I've never heard full-auto weapons being fired, at least not in the San Diego area.

The next day I went into work and sat down with a trusted senior Mexican manager. I looked at him and said, "I thought guns were illegal in Mexico." He chuckled and said, "So you stayed in town last night?" As the conversation progressed, it became clear that guns are as common in Mexico as tamales at Christmas. Everyone he knows, including himself, own at least one gun. And, it matters not whether it's a semi-auto or fully automatic, they're all illegal, so why stop with semi-autos? Though clearly illegal in the states in most instances, a lot of Mexicans have more firepower in terms of military weapons than we can only dream of owning here.

As time went on, parties in the city at middle class Mexican homes become a way of life. Most Mexican managers in the plant knew I was a gun wonk. As it turns out, they couldn't wait to invite me over to their place on a Friday night to show me their collection. Semi-autos, some very high-end Sigs and other European handguns were not uncommon along with piles of old revolvers. I thought I had seen everything in the states, but in Mexico it's not uncommon for people to own full-auto military rifles. Everything from an M16, UZI machine pistols and the most popular, select-fire AK47 military rifles. These are not the so-called "assault weapons" you can buy at the local gun shop in the U.S., but full select-fire military-issue rifles. Now, I know you want to know and are dying to ask; Did I see any U.S. military-issue weapons stolen from the U.S. military? Not a single one was marked with U.S. military markings. Everything was marked with additional foreign markings on the receiver, including M16 rifles, or they had nothing at all. I saw firearms manufactured in Europe, China, Russia and South America along with U.S. manufactured weapons. I saw rifles that looked familiar with no place of manufacture, no serial number or manufacturer's logo. The information was not removed, it was never there to begin with. I can only assume they came from illegal arms manufacturers in India or Pakistan that produce copies of weapons. It was obvious that none of these firearms came from a U.S. gun shop in Tucson or San Diego. You couldn't buy them from a gun shop in the states if you tried.

It seems Mexicans have a rich heritage of firearms ownership prior to the ban in 1968. Despite the laws against owning them, they ignore it. Most Mexicans will say they need it for personal protection of themselves and their family. The other reason is they don't trust the government or local law enforcement. If they have to use it in their home for self-defense, whether they end up in jail is all dependent on how much money they can come up with, or who they know in the government. It also depends on who they shoot. But, given the alternative with high crime rates, most middle class Mexicans willingly and without reservations take the risk. Despite being able to own .22 caliber pistols or rifles, Mexican law requires them to be stored at an approved firing range. Where's the firing range I asked many times? No one knew of one. Where's the gun stores in town to buy legal guns? Gun stores? No one ever recalled seeing one anywhere in Mexico, let alone their city. I'm sure somewhere, maybe in Mexico City you might be able to buy a gun, but not in this city of almost 1.5 million residents. And the gun traffickers know it.

Where do ordinary Mexicans get their weapons? Most buy them from a 'friend' or a friend of a friend or cousin or uncle. Where the friend gets them is not talked about. But, it seems that drug cartels in Mexico are heavily involved in gun trafficking of military weapons and related hardware. And, who are these ordinary Mexicans? They range from people who work in factories as managers and senior managers, government workers, doctors, dentists and anyone with the financial means to buy a firearm. I even ran into a couple of government bureaucrats, one a lawyer for the federal government who owns firearms. He confirmed that people he knew in the government, some very highly ranked bureaucrats and politicians all own illegal firearms. The other works for the Mexican equivalent of the IRS. It's a way of life in Mexico. It seemed to me that you aren't in the 'in-crowd' in Mexico unless you own at least one firearm. I was amazed at the whole thing after believing for years that gun ownership in Mexico was non-existent. That is hardly the case.

All this flies in the face of news articles published by the U.S. media in the last week or two. Mexico's gun problems are a direct result of gun runners buying "assault weapons" in the U.S. and taking them into Mexico to arm drug cartels, says the U.S. media and government. That is a bunch of government and media nonsense. The cartels aren't arming themselves from U.S. gun stores with semi-auto AR15 and AK47 rifles. They've moved on up. Not to completely dismiss arms moving into Mexico from the U.S., but it is not as it seems when the U.S. media tells the story. The firearms moving across the border are semi-auto rifles and handguns sold to middle class or wealthy Mexicans seeking personal protection from criminals that have no connections in Mexico with gun runners. For the most part the wealthy in Mexico are targets of criminal elements, so they have no intention of connecting up with them to buy a self-defense firearm. You're better off buying a weapon from someone within the Mexican government than buying it from the criminal element, namely a drug cartel.

Cartels buy their arms from countries around the world, most any place where military weapons can be purchased on the black market, or from countries wishing to destabilize North America. They arm themselves from a worldwide black market of full auto military weapons including grenades, land mines and RPGs. They also "procure" their weapons from the less than savory from within the Mexican military.

The drug cartels can easily afford to fly their weaponry into Mexico using their own fleet of aircraft on to remote airfields, or land them on remote Mexican shores from their fleet of vessels. They do it with drugs all of the time. Drug cartels buying semi-auto AR15 or AK rifles from U.S. gun dealers is viewed as a joke by Mexico's drug cartel, most Mexicans, and unfortunately by the Mexican government. The only people fooled by all the political rhetoric are Americans listening to the likes of Attorney General Eric Holder and other anti-gun politicians.

Mexico has a gun problem, just like they have a drug problem and both the U.S. and Mexican governments are trying to place the blame on U.S. gun owners. U.S. gun owners aren't the problem. Mexico is the problem. The government is corrupt from the lowest level law enforcement officer shaking down American tourists for traffic violations, to officials and politicians highly placed within the Mexican government, including elements within the military. Everyone knows it. Everyone in Mexico knows it. Every law enforcement official in the U.S. knows it, and everyone in our government knows it. And anyone who has worked for any length of time within border cities and lived in the local community knows it. This is taking a Mexican problem, blaming the U.S. by turning it into a crisis in order further an agenda, and Eric Holder and President Obama knows it and they are taking advantage of it.

The next time you see a news report of illegal full-auto weapons and grenades being found here in the U.S., you know where they came from. It wasn't from a gun store in Tucson or Phoenix. The administration is right that gun trafficking along the U.S./Mexico border is a problem. Not only do we have drugs and illegal aliens coming in our southern border, but we also have military arms and explosives coming into our country illegally as well. That's the issue and our government is being disingenuous in its argument.

This AP news report published today is typical of what is going on. It is disgustingly biased and flat wrong: AP report for Detroit Free Press

Don't believe me and what I say? See what the Latin American Herald is saying about a recent arrest of cartel members and their weaponry in Mexico. No, the items listed weren't purchased at a gun store in Phoenix or Tucson. Grenades and RPGs are illegal in the U.S.: LAH Story
 
Remember this is the same CNN that is first in line to tell the "people" about every soilder or marine who is hurt or killed in battle but never mentions that for every one of us there is a pile of them. CNN would have you believe that we just drive around looking for IED's and never even get a shot off.
 
a smidge off-topic, but this bberg article puts mexico's crime situation into some perspective:

Wire: BLOOMBERG News (BN) Date: 2009-03-26 04:01:01
Mexico’s ‘Alarmist Headlines’ Hide GDP-Crime Link: Chart of Day


By Alexander Ragir and Michael Patterson
March 26 (Bloomberg) -- Mexico’s surge in drug-related
violence is being driven by an economic slump and not because
the country is a “failed state,” according to Citigroup Inc.

The CHART OF THE DAY shows the homicide rate tends to move
opposite of economic growth. The rising power of the drug
cartels and concern the violence may spill over into the U.S.
have alarmed investors, prompting Moody’s Investors Service to
issue a report this week saying it’s “far-fetched” to call
Mexico a failed state.

“Investors should differentiate between the perception
created by alarmist headlines and the difficult, but not
ungovernable, reality in Mexico,” wrote Citigroup equity
strategists Geoffrey Dennis, Alonso Rios and Jason Press in a
note to clients. “Crime is, up to a certain point, necessarily
linked to the health of the economy.”

Mexico’s crime rate may grow as much as 9 percent this year
“depending on the magnitude of the GDP contraction,” the
strategists wrote. Latin America’s second-largest economy may
contract between 2.4 percent and 4 percent this year, Citigroup
predicts. Gross domestic product shrank 1.6 percent in the
fourth quarter.

The U.S. Joint Forces Command grouped Mexico with Pakistan
in a December report as two countries at risk of “a rapid and
sudden collapse” after drug-related deaths more than doubled
last year to over 6,000 in Mexico. Drug lord Joaquin “El
Chapo” Guzman made Forbes magazine’s annual billionaires list
for the first time this year, underscoring the growing power of
the country’s drug cartels.

President Felipe Calderon, whose two-year-old crackdown on
drug-trafficking prompted clashes among rival cartels, said
speculation Mexico is not in control of all its national
territory is “false and absurd.”

For Related News and Information:
Top stories on emerging markets: TOP EM <GO>
Top stock-market stories: TOP STK <GO>
More Chart of the Day stories: NI CHART <GO>

--Editors: Allen Wan, David Papadopoulos

To contact the reporters on this story:
Alexander Ragir in Rio de Janeiro at +55-21-2125-2533 or
[email protected];
Michael Patterson in London at +44-20-7073-3102 or
[email protected].

To contact the editor responsible for this story:
David Papadopoulos at +1-212-617-5105 or
[email protected]

mexico_fail.jpg
 
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