More Kids Shooting Kids

[Baba Louie]

http://www.kvvutv.com/Global/story.asp?S=1807246&nav=2NiwMVvl
April 22, 2004
Henderson Teen Charged With Murder
(Henderson-AP) -- It was Dustin Osborn's 14th birthday -- and he and his 15-year-old pal, Jake Reeder, found a gun at Reeder's apartment.

Now, Osborn's dead and Reeder's charged with murder in the latest in a series of shootings involving teens playing with guns in southern Nevada.

Henderson police arrested Reeder shortly after the slaying yesterday morning at the Palm Villas Apartments off Whitney Ranch Drive near Sunset and Stephanie.

One of Reeder's friends say he can't believe what happened.

He didn't seem like a kid who would do that," said Brandon Means. "I used to skate with him like every day for about a year, then he just kind of drifted away."

It was the third shooting in less than a month involving a teenager killed or wounded by another teen handling a handgun.

14-year-old Erica Mendoza was shot and killed by her 15-year-old brother March 29th in their Las Vegas apartment.

And a 13-year-old Las Vegas boy was wounded in the stomach while a friend handled a gun April fourth in the garage of a home in northeast Las Vegas.
end story...

Whoooo Boy. 3 times so far this month in Las Vegas, kids FINDING guns and shooting friends while playing around.
The story listed above, it was the victims 14th birthday, they'd been smoking pot, found the gun (get this) in the washing machine or dryer where mom hid it... gonna charge the 15 year old w/ 2nd degree. Haven't heard anything about the mom, but she should be charged with criminal stupidity and as an accomplice IMO.

Sad but true. Hard to find anything positive to say about it. Except maybe about where to or how NOT to store a loaded firearm.

 

[ksnecktieman]

Maybe,,,, just maybe??? Nevada should invite Eddie Eagle into their public school system?

There is a cure for stupidity, it is called education.

 

[pax]

There is a cure for stupidity, it is called education.

No, ksnecktieman.

Education is a cure for ignorance. There is no cure for stupidity.

By the time a child has reached 12, 13, 14 years old, he has seen literally hundreds of murders on TV and on the movies. He knows that guns can be used to kill people, and that pulling the trigger is what makes the bullet come out. For a kid that age to point a gun at a friend and pull the trigger is NOT ignorance. It is stupidity.

pax

What people commonly call fate is mostly their own stupidity. -- Arthur Schopenhauer

 

[Zundfolge]

Now, Osborn's dead and Reeder's charged with murder in the latest in a series of shootings involving teens playing with guns in southern Nevada.

A "series" of shootings? So are they saying they are all related? Or that there's been a significant increase?

I bet neither, but they can easily make a statement like "the lates in a series" and people buy the hyperbole without thinking.

 

[jamz]

This sucks. The article does not say if the kids had any experience with guns, and just did something stupid, or if they were just ignorant and did something stupid.

I read an article in some parenting magazine the other day that was suprisingly balanced- it said that there was a study done with both the Eddie Eagle program, and another program called Behavioral Something Something, which taught essentially the same thing- stop, don't touch, tell an adult.

Apparently, only about 50% of the kids could accurately describe what they learned through these programs, and when tested with an actual gun in the room, zero percent actually followed what they learned. They all handled the gun, despite the two training programs.

Now, these tests were done on 4-6 year olds, so the amount of stuff they actually retain is suspect, and it did not go into detail about how long the kids were trained, how many times etc, but it did give me food for thought, and suggested that the eddie eagle program, while a good and necessary start, is not enough for most kids.

The article went on to state that, according to "experts", if you do want to gunproof your kids, you need to start with eddie eagle, and actually role play with a real or real-looking gun. After considerable role playing, it suggested that you test them- leave them in a room with a real UNLOADED/SAFED gun, or a real-looking gun, and see if they actually do what they learned. If not, repeat until they do.

Pretty good advice from a generally anti-type magazine, if you ask me. It never ever said to not keep guns in your house, either.

-James

 

[SteveS]

Now, these tests were done on 4-6 year olds, so the amount of stuff they actually retain is suspect, and it did not go into detail about how long the kids were trained, how many times etc, but it did give me food for thought, and suggested that the eddie eagle program, while a good and necessary start, is not enough for most kids.

It is also important to remember that most kids in this age group lack good impulse control. They can retain information, but aren't always able to act on it. They will tell you that it is not ok to run into the street, but 10 minutes later will dart into the street to chase after their ball.

I saw one of these experiments where kids were told to not touch guns and were later allowed to play in a toy room where a gun was hidden in a toy chest. Most of the kids that found the gun did play with it. Well, it was in a toy chest, so this is not a great surprise.

Education is important, but so is adequate supervision and safe storage.

 

[ceetee]

And yet, as soon as somebody suggests charging the mom with criminal negligence, the papers will all spout: "She's already lost her beloved son! How much more do you want this poor woman to suffer?!"

 

[Standing Wolf]

Education is a cure for ignorance.

That's only if you're talking about real education. What passes for "education" in many parts of the nation these days merely reinforces ignorance and adds plenty of leftist extremist superstition.

 

[Autolite]

The guy was 15 YEARS OLD ...

How much more education does a fifteen year old require to grasp the concept of a projectile exiting the muzzle very very fast once the trigger is pulled? Further training for someone (not mentally handicapped) at that age would be a waste ...

 

[Baba Louie]

More on it from the Las Vegas Sun Newspaper

http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/lv-crime/2004/apr/23/516740675.html

Today: April 23, 2004 at 11:17:02 PDT

Police: Teenager shot friend while playing FBI
By Jen Lawson
<[email protected]>
LAS VEGAS SUN

Eighth grader Dustin Osborn had a second-degree black belt in Tae Kwon Do and his goal was to become an FBI agent, his mother said.

But on Wednesday, the boy was shot and killed by his best friend while "playing FBI" with a loaded gun, according to a Henderson Police report.

Jake Reeder, 15, was arrested for murder.

"I can't hug him (Dustin) anymore. I can't hold him anymore," his mother Andrea Glaser said while crying Thursday night. "This could have been prevented by a gun lock that costs $10."

On Tuesday Osborn asked his mother if he could stay home from classes from Greenspun Junior High School on Wednesday, his 14th birthday, Glaser said. He wanted to spend the day with Reeder, who has Wednesdays off.

Glaser said no, but when she woke up Wednesday she found a note her son had left for her saying he had taken the bus to school and he would take it home. She said she knew he had skipped school because he never took the bus.

She called the school and was told Dustin hadn't showed up. Then she phoned Reeder's apartment in the Palm Villas complex on Whitney Ranch Drive near Sunset Road but received no answer.

She drove over to Reeder's apartment just after 11 a.m. to see if he was there.

When she pulled up police and paramedics were there and the apartment was sealed off with yellow police tape.

"Jake has been detained and Dustin might be dead," she was told.

Reeder told police that after his mother went to work, Osborn came over and the pair smoked marijuana. They found a .45-caliber handgun hidden in a washing machine and began playing FBI, where one of them places his hands against the wall and the other wields a gun, according to the police report.

The report says that Osborn tried to remove all of the bullets from the gun because he didn't trust Reeder with the gun. Reeder put Osborn against the wall, facing it, then "shot him in the back of the neck."

Reeder called his mother at work and told her to come home, the report says. Rolema Reeder came home immediately and found Osborn's body in the hallway.

Rolema Reeder later told police that "Jake was crying, stating that he shot Dustin and that he was going to jail."

She called 911 and Henderson patrol officers arrived at the apartment. They ordered Rolema and Jake Reeder out of the apartment via a loudspeaker, then went inside and found Osborn's body. Rescue personnel were called and pronounced Osborn dead.

Police obtained a search warrant and found a .45-caliber bullet casing and a loaded handgun next to his body. An investigator from the coroner's office determined Osborn had suffered a single gunshot wound in the back of the neck.

Glaser had planned to take Dustin to Macayo Vegas for Mexican food for his birthday Wednesday night.

"I didn't get a chance to tell him happy birthday," she said.

Glaser, a single mother and bartender at the Foxy Girls strip club, has no family in the area besides her other son, 16-year-old Kelly. Glaser's friends are rallying around her, helping with funeral arrangements and trying to raise money for the costs.

The funeral, scheduled for Monday, will cost $11,000. Glaser set up an account at Wells Fargo bank for those who would like to make a donation. The account number is 1455424935.

Thursday afternoon, another friend, Christy DeSantis, was creating fliers with Osborn's picture on them asking for citizens to help pay for the funeral. She planned to post them in convenience stores and other public places.

"I don't care if it's just a dollar," Glaser said. "I don't have that kind of money. I expected to go before my 14-year-old son ... I never expected this to happen."

Glaser and the Reeders were good friends and the families went on vacation together. Still, she said, she holds Reeder's parents, not Jake, accountable because the boys should not have had access to the gun.

"Within a month, there are three kids dead because of this," Glaser said, referring to three separate incidents recently in which children were shot after someone found a gun in a home. "Guns kill ... I feel his parents are responsible for not having the gun locked up."

Jake Reeder was her son's best friend, she said, and she doesn't think he pulled the trigger intentionally.

Glaser spoke to Rolema Reeder and asked her why the gun wasn't secured, she said.

"She had no comment to that," she said. "If someone's child came over I would protect them. I thought it was safe. Obviously it wasn't."

Officer Shane Lewis, spokesman for the Henderson Police Department, said at this point there are no plans to charge Reeder's parents with any crime in connection with the shooting, but police are continuing their investigation.

Reeder was arrested for murder despite the fact that investigators have not ruled out that the shooting was accidental.

Metro Police handled similar shootings differently. When 14-year-old Erica Mendoza was shot and killed last month by her brother while he played with a gun, police made no arrests right away.

Instead, Lt. Tom Monahan of Metro's homicide section said, they investigated then submitted a report this week to the district attorney's office, who may or may not decide to charge 15-year-old Rocky Mendoza with a crime. It could take weeks or months before a decision is made.

Less than a week after that shooting, a 13-year-old boy was shot in the stomach by a friend who found a gun in a garage. That boy survived.

 

[7.62FullMetalJacket]

Thanks Baba Louie

This is a parental deficiency issue, nothing more. The gun was a tool that was misused out of stupidity. I like the "$10 gun lock could have prevented it." No, about 10 minutes of parenting might have prevented it.

 

[The_Antibubba]

Where can I find one of these magical devices?

OK, so the kid is a truant, he's smoking pot with a buddy, but a gun lock would have made everything all right?



While "Playing FBI"? Grab a guy, throw him up against a wall, and jam a gun to the back of his head? Sounds like the were playing "JBT".

And this kid wanted to grow up to be a G-Man, huh? Maybe some good came out of this after all.

 

[Chuck Dye]

Just what makes this death a murder? Either the writer and the editor are engaging in a misuse of the language, or some significant information is missing from the report. Of course, by the media’s lights, I am a road rager because I think of the driver who passed me on a blind curve this morning as a stupid impatient jerk. That I actually muttered the description out loud makes me menace to society who should be scooped up and rehabilitated.

 

[Andrew Rothman]

"I can't hug him (Dustin) anymore. I can't hold him anymore," his mother Andrea Glaser said while crying Thursday night. "This could have been prevented by a gun lock that costs $10."

Some MMMommers got to her, but quick. Do you think they listen to police scanners and deploy propaganda coaches?

This tragedy could have been prevented by education (that a gun is not a toy), education (on how to unload a gun), education (on how to store a gun) or even by education (as in go to school - don't lie, skip school and smoke dope).

 

[Andrew Rothman]

Just what makes this death a murder? Either the writer and the editor are engaging in a misuse of the language, or some significant information is missing from the report.

Um, the police did arrest the kid on suspicion of murder. And the newspapers reported it.

There's plenty of media bias in the story, but this part isn't.

Anyway, it matters little what the boy was "arrested for." The DA's office will determine what the actual charges will be.

 

[7.62FullMetalJacket]

Just what makes this death a murder? Either the writer and the editor are engaging in a misuse of the language, or some significant information is missing from the report.

I am not a lawyer but this I know: If you shove the barrel of a gun against someones body (say the back of the neck) and pull the trigger, and a high velocity projectile exits the firearm, as was intended by the gun's designers, and said projectile enters the body of the person and causes physical death (splat), that would be called MURDER.

 

[Chuck Dye]

I only know what I read...

Not all homicides are murder, even under the circumstances described in the thread starter and your reply. The distinctions are important morally, ethically, linguistically, and legally. Have a look at the Nevada Revised Statutes

NRS 200.070 “Involuntary manslaughter†defined. Except under the circumstances provided in NRS 484.348 and 484.377, involuntary manslaughter is the killing of a human being, without any intent to do so, in the commission of an unlawful act, or a lawful act which probably might produce such a consequence in an unlawful manner, but where the involuntary killing occurs in the commission of an unlawful act, which, in its consequences, naturally tends to destroy the life of a human being, or is committed in the prosecution of a felonious intent, the offense is murder.

[1911 C&P § 125; RL § 6390; NCL § 10072]—(NRS A 1981, 867; 1983, 1014; 1995, 1726)