Mosin Nagant

[model4006]

My girl just got me a 1891/30 Mosin Nagant 7.62x54r for our anniversary. Ive read about it but still have a few questions.

What does the r stand for at the end of 7.62x54r?

How do you pronounce Mosin Nagant? I read somewhere that it was moi-seen, how do you guys say it?

where is the best place to find scope mounts for this thing without trying to buy a 250 dollar sniper scope thats 70 years old. can i just mount a modern scope on this thing?

what are your experiences with this gun, it seems really cool, i let one go in the back yard, couldnt resist. it will be used just as a target gun.

Is there anything that i need to do different to ensure reliabilty and long life from this gun than i would to any other gun?

thanks.

 

[model4006]

oh snap, does the r stand for russian?

 

[Oleg Volk]

R - rimmed
Pronounciation: Mo-sin Na-gun

 

[kd7nqb]

I shot one in Nevada for almost an entire weekend, GREAT GUN the recoil is substantail far more than most that I have shot. But I like it a ton.

 

[kungfuhippie]

r is for rimmed case. Congrats on the gift. Go to surplusrifle.com and learn about "deburing the chamber" there is a nice scout mount for it that replaces the rear sight. Iron elite may offer a mount too. The bolt handle will get in the way of a trditional scope, unless you wanna change that too. Just be sure to clean well if you're using corosive ammo.

you win oleg! man you type fast!

 

[Ash]

The Russians nor the Soviets gave Nagant credit for the magazine. Their term was 3 Line Rifle or Moh-zeen. I just anglisize it and pronouce it as spelled, Moh-zin. As everyone else has said, R indicates Rimmed. I'd leave the scope alone and get good with the iron sights. The scout mount is the best alternative without having to change the bolt. Here's some of the best info about Mosins that you can get:

http://www.mosinnagant.net

http://www.7.62x54r.net

Ash

 

[dfaugh]

Most everyone considers the "R" to denote a "rimmed" cartridge, but you may see a few peple to consider it to denote "Russian".

I've always pronoucned it as "Moe-sin Neg-aant" but originally it was oftenvwritten an "Moisin" as in "mosiined".

You probably need too find someone that speaks Russian to get the "true" pronunciation.

 

[kungfuhippie]

Those that consider the "R" to mean "Russian" are wrong. Unless the Ottoman Empire with it's 8x50r and Austria/Hungary/Germany with their 8x56r cartridges were just using russian products

R is Rimmed, that's because many times there are cartridges that come both ways (handguns).

With the Mosin don't do any permenant alterations until you are dead sure you want to. It's a lot of work and you may regret it later.

 

[rudolf]

In Germany/Austria 8x50r or 8x56r means "8x50 Rand" with "Rand" being the German word for rimmed. So if one cartridge is called rimmed, the next rand, and the third russian there would be no contradiction, just the coincidence of all three starting with "r".

 

[kungfuhippie]

so, what's the russian word for rim? And did they call it that or are we? I mean a .223 here is a 5.56 there. My steyr was called inaccutatly a 95/34 when in fact it was a 95 and some are 95's rearsenaled in the 30's and called 95/30. I mean we're using an english/u.s. designation.

my 8x56r box from 1938 says in german (translated)

10 piece (stück)
8mm M. 30 sharp (scharte)
s cartridges (patronen)
ix 1938

No 8x56r anywhere They had at least 4 8mm rifle cartridges in germany during WWII; 8J (.318 mauser) 8JS (.323 mauser) 8 (8x50r) and 8S (8x56r) none were our designation. So now I really want to know. Anyone here know if the 7.62x54r name is the U.S. version or the russian original?

 

[wrentree]

Russian Army Captain & Belgian designer

Mosin was a Russian military Officer and Nagant was the Belgian designer .
Both had ideas asto what should go into the new rifle under the Czarist government. Both of their ideas were incorporated into the Mosin-Nagant rifle.
As said above, R = Rimmed.

I had the long 30" barrelled 1891. It shot well and accurate.
I sold it a long time ago.
I also had a 1944 carbine with bayonet attachment. Awkward as all get out. And couldn't hit a tobacco barn with it.

 

[kungfuhippie]

hey wrentree, too bad about your m44. Mine can hit MOTB (minute of tobacco batn) Actually mine's fairly accurate for a 60 year old carbine. As a lefty the bayonet pokes my right hand on ocasion while firing it. Shooting a mosin lefthanded leaves two marks on your right arm; a puncture wound just abouve your thumb and scratches in your wrist from left fingers working notorious sticky bolt (Head space correctly, so just don't...)

 

[wrentree]

1944 model

Hi ya doing kungfuhippie,
My 1944 would chamber smoothly but upon extracting spent shells, the bolt was a real bear to open. I mean tight! It wasn't worth a chamber job.

As for (MOTB), I found that aiming 2 "TB's" to the right would put the rounds at about 7 o'clock low on what I was aiming at. That didn't ease anyone's concerns on my accuracy. The cows religiously took cover anyway.

 

[max popenker]

so, what's the russian word for rim? And did they call it that or are we?

Well, Russia is a long-time member of CIP (European Proof commission) and uses international cartridge designation system, so 7,62x54R is 7,62x54R

Rim in Russian is "Закраина".
Original cartridge designation was "Трехлинейный патрон образца 1891 года" - "Three-line cartridge model of 1891"; Three-line stands for caliber of 0,3 inch - one line is old Russian measure for .1".

Another semi-official designation of 7,62x54R is "7,62мм винтовочный патрон" - 7,62mm rifle cartridge, as opposed to 7,62mm intermediate cartridge (7,62x39) or 7,62mm pistol cartridge (7,62x25)

 

[kungfuhippie]

thanks max, how would those be pronounced?

I guess now they're a std. 7,62x54r but pre EU they were just called the 30 caliber rifle round...more or less.

So max has won the debate, and r=rimmed.

5 for max

 

[armoredman]

Drilling the chamber with a shotgun brush and degreaser will eliminate quite a bit of that sticky bolt stuff. That's left over cosmo in teeny pits in those 70 year old chambers, melting into the laquer on your steel cased surplus ammo. I drilled out both my Mosin chambers with a cordless drill chucked with a 20ga brush, and some heavy de greaser, and both work just fine. Both are slicker than snot with brass cases, too, and I love reloading for this fine old warhorse.
As for "letting one go" in the back yard, generally a very BAD idea, unless your backyard is measured in acres, and the law says it's OK. Generally you need to "let them go" on an approved range, or in an environment conducive to safe and legal shooting. [Public service announcement off]

 

[dasmi]

I have a 91/30, and it's a great gun. You'll get many years of loud, firey shooting enjoyment from it

 

[max popenker]

thanks max, how would those be pronounced?

Honestly, i speak English much worse than i write, and spelling is not my best skill
I think Oleg will do better pronouncing, as he still remembers Russian and speaks English much better than me (practice is everything )

 

[model4006]

had mine out today, iron sights at 100 yds this gun is nothing short of amazing to me.

 

[dfaugh]

Those that consider the "R" to mean "Russian" are wrong.

I didn't mean to say they were correct, but I've heard it many times. Rimmed is most certainly correct, as there is also a 7.62x54 unrimmed cartridges as well (although rare).

There are quite a few that call the 7.62x39 a "7.62 Russian" as well.

 

[hueytaxi]

Extend the bayonet. Look silly and you will see much better target acquisition.

 

[gunny1022]

M44 was designed to fire with the bayonet extended. With the bayonet folded it will hit several inches to the left. Move your front sight to compensate.

 

[Avenger]

Gunny, I've heard that too, but when I tried about 30 rounds both ways from a rest at 200 yards, it didn't make any consistent difference at all. If anything, it pushed the pattern a little to the RIGHT with the bayo out. It did make a difference in how the gun moved during recoil, there was much less flip with the bayo out, obviously due to the weight being further forward.
The other thing I noticed is that my friends were much less critical about my shooting after I used the bayonet to pick up a few empty ammo boxes!

 

[busy_squirrel]

Just picked up a '43 model today. It needs cleaning but I'm already thinking of a new stock...

 

[kungfuhippie]

last week I went to the local shop to see a few hex reciever 91/30s he had, ended up getting a 1926 91/30 a 1941 m38 and a 1937 98k. Can't wait until the 30th!