Mossbereg 590 in military service
- Thread starter Slater
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According to some operators who've posted at www.tacticalforums.com, the 590s didn't hold up well and were generally replaced in the special operations community (SEALs, Force Recon) with the same 870s the 590s were orginally bought to replace. It might be worth searching the topics there, as this was covered on a couple of occasions.
Combat-wombat
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Wasn't the military shotgun the Remington 870, not the M590? Either way, the M1014 is sweet!
Dave McCracken
Moderator In Memoriam
There's a couple different stories on this. The one I think is closest to the truth follows.
By and large, the 590s worked well except in saline and dusty environments. Trouble is, lots of forces are in places like that.
Also, lubing on the More Is Better Principle stopped or slowed corrosion, but the resulting grunge in dirty conditions resulted in some FTFs. Same things happened in A-stan with the M-4 carbines, I hear.
No one seems to have ordered the old 870s back to the line, but they seemed to magically turn up anyway. Some are undoubtedly PO weapons and not GI issue. Others are old issue not surplussed.
IMO, the 590s might have done better and kept grunt confidence with better PM, better cleaning techniques and less bias against them from folks used to super reliable shotguns like the 870. An 870 is a hard act to follow....
By and large, the 590s worked well except in saline and dusty environments. Trouble is, lots of forces are in places like that.
Also, lubing on the More Is Better Principle stopped or slowed corrosion, but the resulting grunge in dirty conditions resulted in some FTFs. Same things happened in A-stan with the M-4 carbines, I hear.
No one seems to have ordered the old 870s back to the line, but they seemed to magically turn up anyway. Some are undoubtedly PO weapons and not GI issue. Others are old issue not surplussed.
IMO, the 590s might have done better and kept grunt confidence with better PM, better cleaning techniques and less bias against them from folks used to super reliable shotguns like the 870. An 870 is a hard act to follow....
I own both 870s and 500/590s, and like both styles. If I could only have one, it would be the 870, based on personal preferences...
I prefer the trigger-finger release (with jumbo-head safety) of the 870 over the thumb release - can maintain firing grip with 870 while releasing safety. This is actually a 'learning' for me, having grown up on 500s, and thinking my thumb was faster...
I like the 'smoothness' of my Wingmaster-based HD, and even my 870 Express equals the 590 - both are what I consider 'gritty'.
I also prefer the steel receiver of the 870, giving me more finish options across my armory.
Finally, I think that the 870 has a wider range of accessories available for it.
I'm slowing purging the 590s, and finding bargains on 870s. I'm focusing on one SOP for HD, Hunting and target shooting.
Try both, if you can, if not, get the 870 - you won't be disappointed.
(sorry Dave, only have 2 870s right now, but I do have 6 shotguns, total, does that count?
)
Best regards,
I prefer the trigger-finger release (with jumbo-head safety) of the 870 over the thumb release - can maintain firing grip with 870 while releasing safety. This is actually a 'learning' for me, having grown up on 500s, and thinking my thumb was faster...
I like the 'smoothness' of my Wingmaster-based HD, and even my 870 Express equals the 590 - both are what I consider 'gritty'.
I also prefer the steel receiver of the 870, giving me more finish options across my armory.
Finally, I think that the 870 has a wider range of accessories available for it.
I'm slowing purging the 590s, and finding bargains on 870s. I'm focusing on one SOP for HD, Hunting and target shooting.
Try both, if you can, if not, get the 870 - you won't be disappointed.
(sorry Dave, only have 2 870s right now, but I do have 6 shotguns, total, does that count?
)Best regards,
Badger Arms
Member
Being one who actually CARRIED THE M870 ON ACTIVE DUTY, I can say that we never saw the 590. I think all of the talk about trials and a 'winner' were overblown after a sweetheart deal from the lowest bidder. The 590 is a sound shotgun, but it is NOT as rugged or well-received as the M870 was and is. I don't believe they were EVER surplussed and neither will the M590. They will remain in armorys until they are worn out or no longer needed. The M870's are wearing out due to age and will need replaced. They are being suplemented by 590's and now also by Benelli's if I believe what I've read on that subject.
In terms of soldier preference, I'd have to say that the M870 wins hands down but my sample size is small. You'll find people on both sides of the table arguing either way based on their own personal preference. I seriously doubt that the 590 was a dismal failure along the lines of the British Bullpup rifles of late. I also don't think that it was a resounding success.
In terms of soldier preference, I'd have to say that the M870 wins hands down but my sample size is small. You'll find people on both sides of the table arguing either way based on their own personal preference. I seriously doubt that the 590 was a dismal failure along the lines of the British Bullpup rifles of late. I also don't think that it was a resounding success.
GunGeek
Member
Funny, I carried a M590 on active duty, never saw a 870.
Never had problems with the 590, thats why I bought one when I got out.
Never had problems with the 590, thats why I bought one when I got out.
Timber-Hunter
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- Jul 20, 2003
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Carried both a M590 and a 870 with the best one (IMHO) being the 870.
I was an armorer, and transitioned from the 870 to the 590. The 590 is FINE, NOTHING wrong with it at all. The 590 was not always available so the 500 was substituted when an 870 needed to be turned in, they were junk.
The 870 and the 590 are for all practical purposes equal. Both are dead solid and reliable. Neither is easier to clean or maintain, and neither is more tolerant of crap in the action. I prefer the tang mounted safety of the Mossberg, and if you needed to club someone with the gun the 870 would likely hold up better. Both were in great shape at turn in time, and I only ever broke one of each.
Argue all you want, but it is a dead heat. Take it from someone with tens of thousands of rounds through both shotguns.
The 870 and the 590 are for all practical purposes equal. Both are dead solid and reliable. Neither is easier to clean or maintain, and neither is more tolerant of crap in the action. I prefer the tang mounted safety of the Mossberg, and if you needed to club someone with the gun the 870 would likely hold up better. Both were in great shape at turn in time, and I only ever broke one of each.
Argue all you want, but it is a dead heat. Take it from someone with tens of thousands of rounds through both shotguns.
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