Mossberg Shockwave

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It would be quite fun in a 20 ga, and no I don't have one yet. I am still trying to decide between this and a aow version at my lgs. I will get one or the other, this would be a good defensive shotgun for any small space... I want to put a regular stock on one, but i haven't decided if the tax stamp is worth it yet...
 
It seems like the ideal gun to have in your car if legal where you live. Great for riots, great for a road rage incident. Also seems to be fun to shoot from what people tell me.

I am going to get one for my next gun purchase.

Will look into an optic but will want a light on it first.
 
shiftyer1 said:
I recently got one, I wouldn't recommend it as a first shotgun because a full stocked shotgun is more versatile.
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Good lord as a first shotgun the recoil would be pretty severe! I mean my 12ga isn't a huge problem but if that's the gun I'd started with it would have been unpleasant lol.

Actually OP if you haven't shot shotguns before I would rent the smallest 12ga pistol grip shotgun at the range to make sure you are up for it.
 
It seems like the ideal gun to have in your car if legal where you live.
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It would be so, in that they are easy to store in the small spaces of a vehicle. Beyond that, there would be no benefit to one.

Great for riots
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Which factor do you like better in a riot? The low capacity or the relative practical inaccuracy?

great for a road rage incident
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Really? Have you ever worked with and fired a firearm inside a vehicle? What about a 26" long two-handed firearm with considerable recoil makes it great for using in or around a vehicle?
What is it about road rage that is best dealt with with a firearm? And given that there must be some road rage situations where pulling out a firearm is the right answer, why would a 26" long, two-handed firearm be in the top 20 best choices?

Also seems to be fun to shoot from what people tell me.
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That's the best practical use for one. They are entertaining.

Once you're no longer storing that weapon, but actually shooting it at something, there is not one single thing that a stockless shotgun does better than a handgun or full-stocked shotgun.
 
A fun toy to put in a backpack perhaps, but a shoulder stocked gun is MUCH more useful. And really not all that much longer. Or perhaps an 18" gun with a pistol grip.

I like the idea more as a thumb in the eye of NFA than as a practical tool.
 
Or perhaps an 18" gun with a pistol grip.
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As long as it has a stock that rests against your shoulder it is orders of magnitude more effective than any pistol-only-gripped shotgun.

There is a logical disconnect we all suffer from in varying degrees, which says that a handgun works well, and a full-stocked shotguns works well, so something that's sort of half-way between the two must work like "the best of both worlds."

The problem with that theory is that it isn't true at all. What works so well about a handgun is completely ruined by making it a long, heavy, bulky weapon that has to be supported (and operated) with a hand out on the fore stock. What works so well about a shotgun is completely ruined by taking the shoulder stock off.

We literally then have the WORST of both worlds.





Also of note: Before anyone suggests that the Shockwave (or the other PGO "other firearms") is neat because you could slip it under your coat -- the ATF has declared that actually concealing one disproves their blanket acceptance of the firearm as "not concealable." Thus it is automatically moved from a Title I covered "other firearm" to a concealable Title II NFA firearm. And an unregistered one at that.
DON'T do that.
 
The Shockwave grip hurts my wrist unless I've got it down at the hip, and I mean just holding it, not even shooting.

I can run a regular pistol grip no problem even with full power ammo, but my wrist just does not like the position it has to be in to allow eye level shooting with the Shockwave.
 
Every time I see them for sale the price is lower than the time before.
 
Sam1911 said:
As long as it has a stock that rests against your shoulder it is orders of magnitude more effective than any pistol-only-gripped shotgun.

There is a logical disconnect we all suffer from in varying degrees, which says that a handgun works well, and a full-stocked shotguns works well, so something that's sort of half-way between the two must work like "the best of both worlds."

The problem with that theory is that it isn't true at all. What works so well about a handgun is completely ruined by making it a long, heavy, bulky weapon that has to be supported (and operated) with a hand out on the fore stock. What works so well about a shotgun is completely ruined by taking the shoulder stock off.

We literally then have the WORST of both worlds.
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Agreed. My point (that I should have elaborated) was that a conventional 18" stocked shotgun with the stock replaced with a pistol grip isn't much longer, but is cheaper and more versatile. You can always put the stock back on the 18" gun, but adding a shoulder stock to the Shockwave is a felony.

The Mossberg combo guns are the best bargain in this space IMO. You get two barrels and two stocks for less than the cost of a niche gun.
 
Every time I see them for sale the price is lower than the time before.
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Why not? A very easy alternative sideline product to put together requiring sourcing of very few parts not already in production lines. And an opportunity to capture a bit of market enthusiasm because of the appeal of the "thumb your nose at the NFA" angle. In very short time everyone who is tickled by that will have one and the market demand will drop to very low levels. They'll probably keep making them but won't sell nearly as many in coming years as they did in the flurry of marketing and internet hubbub at first release.

Lower demand = lower price.
 
It can be shot effectively if used properly. It's meant to be used with the forward grip on the handguard (2 handed). One handed is possible but harder and not accurate.

But it is not completely useless as some people say.

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Kevinq6 said:
It seems like the ideal gun to have in your car if legal where you live. Great for riots, great for a road rage incident. Also seems to be fun to shoot from what people tell me.

I am going to get one for my next gun purchase.

Will look into an optic but will want a light on it first.
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Instead of buying a road rage/riot gun, I would find a better place to live or an anger management class.
 
But it is not completely useless as some people say.
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Something we often struggle with is how exactly to place a quantification on statements of effectiveness when we discuss self-defense arms.

In that light, what does "not completely useless" mean?

It certainly does not mean, "as easy to store, transport, carry, draw, aim, get hits with, cycle, transition between targets, and fire follow-up shots with as a handgun."
It certainly does not mean, "as easy to aim, get hits with, cycle, and transition between targets, and fire follow up shots with as a full-stocked shotgun."

So it means something close to what is implied by the actual words in that phrase, not the more sarcastic overtone possibly intended: This firearm is not completely useless. Could be effective. Might be effective. Better than nothing. But admittedly and clearly far worse than other common choices.

(It might be worth pointing out that few people ever try to claim that a firearm of this sort is completely without any value as a defensive tool whatsoever. I.e.: completely worthless. Relatively worthless might be a reasonable assessment, though.)

So taken as given that the firearm has some value in the role, but huge detriments when compared to other common and known-effective choices, what are the positive factors it brings to the table that we must believe offset the poor aiming and handling, bulk, weight, legal questions/confusion which might come up with law-enforcement, etc.?

Pros:
1) It is easy to store, though not as easy as a handgun.
2) Concealment well, no, that's a federal felony.
3) ?

I really struggle to come up with plausible reasons to use one for serious purposes in a self-defense role.

Self-defense, by definition, is the one shot of your life you actually MUST make count. It is the moment when you must be as effective as humanly possible at delivering your bullet or shot. It is not the time to play with a "fun" or "cool" gun -- something you own for range time giggles.

These things must fall into a "relatively useless" category when evaluated for self-defense roles. Sort of like how a 4-wheeler is a lot of fun and has some merits for casual uses, but it "relatively useless" for serious transportation duties.
 
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They're alright for hiking and other outdoor activities since they're easy to pack and store, and door breaching I guess, but I don't see them being all that useful besides that.

I will say however that if not for NFA restrictions, I believe most "social" and animal defense style shotguns would have barrels around 14".

Its hard to overstate just how much handier short barrel guns are even compared to the typical 18-20" riot format.
 
drunkenpoacher said:
Instead of buying a road rage/riot gun, I would find a better place to live or an anger management class.
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It's more useless than police type shotgun with cyl choke and one piece long magazine for which spare hunting barrels are not available. I use hunting gun with 26" barrel for hd role and find it perfectly adequate.
 
Its hard to overstate just how much handier short barrel guns are even compared to the typical 18-20" riot format.
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I wouldn't argue though it seems to me that neither police nor military forces who use shotguns tend to issue many with shorter than 18" barrels. (Some do, but probably 1% or fewer.)

Possibly that's due to capacity issues from a shorter mag tube, but possibly not.
 
In the military and police context I think its mostly due to institutional conservatism, and the fact that the combat shotgun as a system has largely been neglected since the Vietnam era.
 
The only thing that intrigues me about the-not-NFA-firearms with the 14" barrel 26+" overall with birdshead grip by Mossberg or Remington is the fact that they replicate the old Witness Protection shotgun. A lot to pay to satisfy historical curiousity though.
 
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