Muslims are waging civil war against us, claims police union

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Desertdog

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Muslims are waging civil war against us, claims police union
By David Rennie, Europe Correspondent
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/10/05/wmuslims05.xml



Radical Muslims in France's housing estates are waging an undeclared "intifada" against the police, with violent clashes injuring an average of 14 officers each day.


Interior minister Nicolas Sarkozy was warned of an 'intifada'


As the interior ministry said that nearly 2,500 officers had been wounded this year, a police union declared that its members were "in a state of civil war" with Muslims in the most depressed "banlieue" estates which are heavily populated by unemployed youths of north African origin.

It said the situation was so grave that it had asked the government to provide police with armoured cars to protect officers in the estates, which are becoming no-go zones.

The number of attacks has risen by a third in two years. Police representatives told the newspaper Le Figaro that the "taboo" of attacking officers on patrol has been broken.

Instead, officers – especially those patrolling in pairs or small groups – faced attacks as soon as they tried to arrest locals.

Senior officers insisted that the problem was essentially criminal in nature, with crime bosses on the estates fighting back against tough tactics.

The interior minister, Nicolas Sarkozy, who is also the leading centre-Right candidate for the presidency, has sent heavily equipped units into areas with orders to regain control from drug smuggling gangs and other organised crime rings. Such aggressive raids were "disrupting the underground economy in the estates", one senior official told Le Figaro.

However, not all officers on the ground accept that essentially secular interpretation. Michel Thoomis, the secretary general of the hardline Action Police trade union, has written to Mr Sarkozy warning of an "intifada" on the estates and demanding that officers be given armoured cars in the most dangerous areas.

He said yesterday: "We are in a state of civil war, orchestrated by radical Islamists. This is not a question of urban violence any more, it is an intifada, with stones and Molotov cocktails. You no longer see two or three youths confronting police, you see whole tower blocks emptying into the streets to set their 'comrades' free when they are arrested."

He added: "We need armoured vehicles and water cannon. They are the only things that can disperse crowds of hundreds of people who are trying to kill police and burn their vehicles."

However, Gerard Demarcq, of the largest police unions, Alliance, dismissed talk of an "intifada" as representing the views of only a minority.

Mr Demarcq said that the increased attacks on officers were proof that the policy of "retaking territory" from criminal gangs was working.

Mayors in the worst affected suburbs, which saw weeks of riots and car-burning a year ago, have expressed fears of a vicious circle, as attacks by locals lead the police to harden their tactics, further increasing resentment.

As if to prove that point, there were angry reactions in the western Paris suburb of Les Mureaux following dawn raids in search of youths who attacked a police unit on Sunday. The raids led to one arrest. They followed clashes on Sunday night when scores of youths attacked seven officers who had tried to arrest a man for not wearing his seat belt while driving. That driver refused to stop, and later rammed a police car trying to block his path.

The mayor of Les Mureaux, Francois Garay, criticised aggressive police tactics that afterwards left "the people on the ground to pick up the pieces".

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The most uncomfortable I've ever been was in Marseille. A couple of years ago my wife and I spent some time doing the "backpack across Europe" trip. For the most part we enjoyed our time in France -- the people were very nice, the trains on time, and we absolutely fell in love with the little village of Cerbere.

A detour caused by striking Italian railway workers ended up with us coming in to Marseille on the last train. It was late, the city was starting to close down, and we looked for a hotel. We stumbled in to a run-down Arab populated area. In was the absolute worst city neighborhood I've ever gone through, and I've spent some time with city "hackers" in New York. Burned out cars, crowds of angry looking folks, trash, it was scary.
 
Bah! If the French police were at war, they would have surrendered by now.

The French lost more soliders in combat during WWII than we did. They surrendered because their strategy of using a wall to keep out invaders failed when the wall was both breached and flanked. Something else they had to face that we didn't in WWII: their civilians were being killed too.

The constant mindless attacks on the quality of French soldiers on this board serve nothing but to stress the failures of teaching history to our citizens.
 
French Politicians

The contsant mindless attacks on the quality of French soldiers on this board serve nothing but to stress the failures of teaching history to our citizens.

French soldiers are not the problem...it's the French Policy Makers. If you look at some of the lessons learned from Gulf War 1, you will see that the french SF got good reviews from the American counterparts.
 
Does history include the Franco-Prussian War, the (near) mutiny of the French Army in WWI, Algeria, Indochina, etc., inter alia? Something smells Vichy here!

History has shown time and time again that the French lack the will to do what is necessary to win. Their refusal to address this Fifth Column (yes, I know my history to know from where this phrase comes) in a manful way will lead to more suffering and violence in the long run.:(
 
Mayors in the worst affected suburbs, which saw weeks of riots and car-burning a year ago, have expressed fears of a vicious circle, as attacks by locals lead the police to harden their tactics, further increasing resentment.

As if to prove that point, there were angry reactions in the western Paris suburb of Les Mureaux following dawn raids in search of youths who attacked a police unit on Sunday. The raids led to one arrest. They followed clashes on Sunday night when scores of youths attacked seven officers who had tried to arrest a man for not wearing his seat belt while driving. That driver refused to stop, and later rammed a police car trying to block his path.

The mayor of Les Mureaux, Francois Garay, criticised aggressive police tactics that afterwards left "the people on the ground to pick up the pieces".

We live in interesting times. Here are some thoughts stimulated by those paragraphs.

The incident which provoked that riot was a police attempt to enforce a seat belt law. As you know, people who don't wear seat belts increase our health care costs and must be forced to wear them or suffer the harshest possible penalties the law can bring to bear on them. You also know that smokers increase our health care costs and should suffer harsh penalties too. And of course people who eat food prepared with trans fat increase our health care costs as well and need to be prevented from doing so.

Riots, however, are apparently expressions of discontent and should not be stifled because to do so would be to increase discontent and stimulate more riots. (I'm a little confused here because if riots are good, society should want as many riots as possible, shouldn't it?) In any event it seems that riots are an acceptable outlet for discontent in at least some French cities because the riots serve as a pressure release for avoiding more riots, but only some reasonable (but as yet unspecified) number of riots should be permitted.

Here's where I get really confused. Since people who smoke or eat french fried potatoes made with trans fat are doing bad things, should they be allowed to riot while doing those things? Or are they out of the riot? Should obese people be allowed to riot? There is now a global movement to discourage extreme thinness in fashion models, because it sets a bad example for women, who are of course too stupid to think for themselves (male chauvinist pigs seem to have been on the right track). So should women who are too thin be allowed to participate in riots?

I don't know the answer to those questions but I have a feeling that there will be one or more laws clarifying the issues. In the meantime it looks as if we must live with the ambiguity of who is permitted to riot, when they are permitted to riot, whether they can smoke or stuff themselves while rioting, and how frequently they are permitted to riot.

Societies that can legislate individual human behaviors formerly left as matters of choice will have no difficulty legislating such issues too. But until we receive essential guidance from the world's governments I suppose we must make our own decisions about those matters no matter how uncomfortable we might feel about doing so. Have patience and trust that there will be laws on this and other subjects too.

In the meantime we can take comfort from the facts that France has a seat belt law, that the police enforce it, and that health care costs are reduced as a result.
 
While making fun of a nations political leadership and national military resolve is one thing, don't make the mistake of underestimating the individual soldier. The french soldier may have been underguned, poorly lead, and sold out by the leadership of the day, but as individuals they exhibited a tremendous amount of courage and fighting ability.

As poorly as they were equiped and led, they still fought the germans to a halt. and they didn't die running away from the fight, they died charging superior firepower.
 
As poorly as they were equiped and led, they still fought the germans to a halt. and they didn't die running away from the fight, they died charging superior firepower.

Exactly my point. Constantly belittling the French seems to be one of the recurring low points on "The High Road". Sure, it's anecdotal, but all the French I've personally known have been friendly and honest people. Have they had some leaders and other political pressures that have caused some stupid things to happen? Sure. Maybe even they repeat that way too often.

But it's just plain childish to bring up "The French" every time something wimpy comes around. They sure did a good job (no matter what their reasons) of financing us in our war of independence.
 
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