My 357mag is better than your 9mm...

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I have read several articles on the 9mm -vs- 357mag and there seems to be no clear verdict. In self defense purpose why are these two calibers always battled over? Are they that similar in ballistics? Isn't bigger better? And lastly isn't it really just preference?
 
Wow. I can honestly say I have never heard of a 9mm vs .357 mag debate. As has been posted earlier the entire platform is different. The ballistics are very different comparing poistol calibers. Im interested to see where this goes.
 
FWIW:

Guess my ignorance is showing.

I'm not into ballistics, but I've always thought the 357mag round vastly superior to the 9mm round.

My wife has a Ruger 357mag. Security-Six in her bedside nightstand, and I've always considered it more than adequate for that "bump in the night" experience we all hope never happens.

But, MY choice for the same duty is a 3rd Gen Smith 5906, bought new last year from CDNN for $399.99.. This all steel 9MM offers 15+1 rds of quality Cor-Bon +p's, and the addition of Crimson Trace Lasergrips.. :D

Just choices.

Jesse

100_9862.jpg
 
The .357 magnum is a standard-setting self-defense cartridge and is capable in the right loads of being a capable hunting cartridge. The revolver platform allows an unparalleled (by any autoloader) flexibility in bullet design, shape and construction as well as a range of load levels that will function perfectly--from powderpuff gallery loads to firebreathing dragon slaying loads. However, the .357 mag (in a revolver) holds only 5-8 rounds, and a double action revolver is not the easiest gun in the world to shoot quickly and accurately and with control. It also transmits a fairly full measure of recoil to the shooter.

The 9mm's projectile is only .002 smaller than .357. In modern loadings, it is generally accepted as an effective (not standard-setting) defense load. It does not have near the flexibility of the .357 in power level (because of the need to cycle a semi-auto platform) and is basically stuck at the level of a very modest mid-range .357 self-defense load. It also has less flexibility in bullet design, because they have to feed in an autoloader. Modern bullet design has made this less problematic than it used to be. You can fit a lot of 9mm into a semi-auto handgun, and they are generally easier to shoot accurately and with control than a revolver. The 9mm is among the most gentle-recoiling rounds among standard self-defense rounds.

When 9mm semi-auto handguns came on the scene in American shooting, it was .38 special--not .357 mag--revolvers they generally replaced (and the power level of the 9mm is closer to a .38 +p than a real .357 magnum). I wouldn't have said the comparison of 9mm and .357 is a common one, but that's how I'd basically draw it up.
 
I would like to see a rating of all rounds in decibels! I sold my SP101 because I could not fire the 357 without ear protection without being disoriented for a couple of seconds. My ears rang so bad I could not concentrate enough to hit the target. If I was in a position where I had to pull a gun and fire at someone in self defense I bet the adrenaline would probably be pumping and instincts would take over, but holy cow, the 357 snubby is silly LOUD!

I started carrying CZ PCR in 9mm and think it will be more that enough to defend myself...
 
ChristopherG, hey that's a good summation. The 357 mag can do more than SD and is a good SD caliber and the 9MM is just a good SD caliber made better by the bullet count. I can go for that.
 
How about comparing the rounds in revolvers only? Adding in power loss due to actuating a slide for 9mm makes it apples to oranges since the 357mag cannot work in a semi-auto firearm.

Now 9mm vs 357Sig would be a better comparison as they are both capable of fitting in the same general types of firearms.
 
Jesse, did your smith come WITH the CT grips for $399? If so... wow! Nice gun. I have the 410S... same gun... .40 caliber.
 
Subcompact pocket auto 9x19 +P, pure ballistics, the 9 is pretty close to a snub .357 with a 125 grain load. Beyond that platform/load comparison for deep concealment, the .357 walks away in a class of its own. It can push a 180 grain bullet from a 6" barrel to nearly 800 ft lbs and kill hogs and deer in a humane and quick way. The nine in no load or platform can be considered a hunting round.

I do prefer a subcompact 9 to a J frame .357 for self defense, though. The 410 ft lbs out of my 9 compares favorable, as stated to the near 400 ft lbs most 125 grain loads will put up from a 2" barrel. The flash/bang is considerably more pleasant, as is recoil, from the 9. A 2" .357 throws a fireball straight out of hell and all for a similar energy level. The 9 is simply more efficient in small handguns. The .357 out of a 3" barrel, though, especially with a 140 grain load, distances the 9. My 3" shoots to 600 ft lbs with a hog 140 grain load. That's my favorite .357 carry combination at the moment, but it must be carried on a belt, not in a pocket. I really prefer it, though, to my 16 shot capacity Ruger P85, similar sized gun if a bit heavier and bulkier. And, when I go to check my hog trap, I can switch loads if I wish, to a 165 grain hard cast SWC load, for those possible shots of opportunity.
 
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in revolvers only? Adding in power loss due to actuating a slide for 9mm makes it apples to oranges since the 357mag cannot work in a semi-auto firearm.


coonan2.jpg
 
You Wanna Bet~?

As I have an older, West German SIG-SAUER model P228 9m/m that is
scary accurate; right from the box. Loaded with todays high velocity
JHP or Hornady's Critical Defense ammo, I think it would stack up well
against any .357 magnum. Cor-Bon Pow'rBall is another good example.

I use the 165 grain Cor-Bon Pow'rBall ammo from Peter Pi in my 3" Kimber
Stainless Ultra Carry. Since my LEO retirement, I have relegated my two
SIG's [both of West German manufacture and assembly] to "SAFE QUEEN'
duty; as GUARDIANS of the other weaponary stored in the RSC~! ;) :D

They happen to be the 9m/m P228 (2x 13 round magazine capacity),
and a .45 ACP P220A.
 
The .357 magnum is a standard-setting self-defense cartridge and is capable in the right loads of being a capable hunting cartridge. The revolver platform allows an unparalleled (by any autoloader) flexibility in bullet design, shape and construction as well as a range of load levels that will function perfectly--from powderpuff gallery loads to firebreathing dragon slaying loads. However, the .357 mag (in a revolver) holds only 5-8 rounds, and a double action revolver is not the easiest gun in the world to shoot quickly and accurately and with control. It also transmits a fairly full measure of recoil to the shooter.

The 9mm's projectile is only .002 smaller than .357. In modern loadings, it is generally accepted as an effective (not standard-setting) defense load. It does not have near the flexibility of the .357 in power level (because of the need to cycle a semi-auto platform) and is basically stuck at the level of a very modest mid-range .357 self-defense load. It also has less flexibility in bullet design, because they have to feed in an autoloader. Modern bullet design has made this less problematic than it used to be. You can fit a lot of 9mm into a semi-auto handgun, and they are generally easier to shoot accurately and with control than a revolver. The 9mm is among the most gentle-recoiling rounds among standard self-defense rounds.

When 9mm semi-auto handguns came on the scene in American shooting, it was .38 special--not .357 mag--revolvers they generally replaced (and the power level of the 9mm is closer to a .38 +p than a real .357 magnum). I wouldn't have said the comparison of 9mm and .357 is a common one, but that's how I'd basically draw it up.
Well said. This caliber thread so far has actually been civil and informative. That can't last long.:D
 
I haven't seen many such comparisons. .357 Magnum is definitely more powerful, but how much of an advantage it may have over 9mm depends on the size of the target. Against humans, in my opinion the difference is less pronounced than it would be against larger animals (against which different loads would be used). Using similar technology and bullet weights, it may get a bit more penetration and/or expansion, providing an edge in performance, but probably most of its energy advantage would go toward stretching tissues farther with temporary cavitation. How much of a wounding/incapacitating effect this has is controversial, with the amount of energy involved being so much less than that of high-powered rifles. Possibly the target would feel a greater amount of pain or force, and what psychological effect this might have is also debatable.

As for whether the choice is just preference, well, isn't that always the case anyway? One of the biggest factors is the type of weapon, but even leaving that aside, one almost always has to give something to get something else. For what I consider just an "edge" in effectiveness on human targets, the trade-off is greater recoil and blast, and people will have varying preferences on the matter. Even many owners of .357 Magnum revolvers will load .38 Special+P cartridges for self-defense, and these are actually less energetic than 9mm cartridges--make of that what you will.
 
If you want the round that will do the least damage to your hearing use subsonic 9mm 147gr HP. There are several rounds easily available that will work for you.
 
Would you rather be shot at with someone who is an expert with a .22 or shot at by someone that doesn't have a clue what they're doing with a .357 ?


caliber doesn't matter, knowledge does.
 
McGunner,

Nice! I learn something new every day! :)

Well I guess we should do comparisons of it in semi and revolver, then compare apples to apples. Either way, I think it's a little over-obsessive to try to say any round is better than the other as they both have their merits.
 
Would you rather be shot at with someone who is an expert with a .22 or shot at by someone that doesn't have a clue what they're doing with a .357 ?

Actually I would much rather get shot with the .22 than a .357 mag. I dont care who is pulling the trigger.
 
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