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My S & W Model 10 project

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Oyeboten

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Mar 23, 2008
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Hi all,




Got started today about half an hour ago...and snapped a few pics
along-the-way.


Goal:

Modify an older Model 10-6, 4 inch Bull Barrel, Square Butt, for an all
Season IWB rig.


So, first phase, dismantle, evaluate mechanism for any finessing it may want
( and there will be some, as for one thing, the internal Cylinder Release bar's
little round end, should be longer than it is, so, I'll send off for a
replacement, and fit it, or, get a little Steel added via Mr. Tig at some friendly Welding Shop or other, ) and, prepare for the other various changes to be made.


In the 2nd image, 'White Out' is casually applied to show those areas which prospectively will be
removed...though I am not presently certain I will shorten the Barrel
initially...might be fun to leave that be, and see how I like things being in the 4 inch way of faith for a while, and then decide.



Image showing Revolver as it is -





Image showing gross prospective changes to form and silhouette -





The way Life and Work are these days, if I can steal an Hour a day for this project, I'll be doing well...so...off to a good start anyway!


Phil
 
Very nice!
3" vs. 4", I'm also testing the waters in that respect. I may go to 3" also on mine, but currently do not have access to the tools. Are you going with the full Fitz on that trigger guard? If so have you picked out a holster yet?
 
You are not actually contemplating cutting away the trigger guard are you? That is a very foolish and dangerous modification. It makes the gun harder to control if you find yourself struggling for it and increases the chance of snagging the trigger into an AD while serving absolutely NO useful purpose.
 
I always shed a little tear every time I see a classic old S&W 1917 that has had the trigger guard relieved back when that was a fad. It just means one less usable gun for those of us today. Please don't cut the trigger guard.
 
A lot of people aren't liking the fitz cut. I don't know if I really support it, but I say go ahead and do it. It makes it unique and its rare to find something like that.
 
...couple Coffee Breaks later...


Cut off the Hammer Spurr, and shaped the backside of the Hammer a little bit.





Hacksawed off a wedge from the back lower Grip area...and, with a Belt Sander, faired the curve there...feels pretty comfortable now, but have not rounded the perpendicular plane of the new curve area yet to match that of the Backstrap's upper area...


 
Everything is fine except for the trigger guard. That'll just be a pain as the left over part gets caught on everything that gets close to it. Not to mention that with the front of the guard gone there is now a possibility of it hooking the edge of the holster as you insert it and having that edge push on the trigger. It's called a "guard" for a very good reason and cutting away much of it will ruin the functionality that it provides. All the other mods are geared to making this a smoother pistol that will not get caught on clothing when called on to draw it for use. The cut away trigger guard goes against this philosophy of design even if it's only going to be an issue during the holstering/pocketing portion. Whoever originally thought this was a good idea was misguided at best or a blithering idiot at worst that somehow attained a highly misguided following.
 
Trigger guard

Cutting away the front of the TG was a fad, post WWII. Even Skeeter Skelton did it. But, after about '65 he too said that it was "a modification of which I no longer approve."

People say trigger discipline is the first and best safety.
Nope. The brain is. The brain should be saying, "Not the best choice."

Q
 
Sorry I am late to the vivisection, but why didn't you just go for a 3" 64, SKU #162504 and still listed in the 2006 S&W Catalog? It is a SS 10, making it inherently 'all-weather'. It also has a RB. Just puzzled... lots of 10's out there - one less now.

BTW, I modified a Ruger SBH years ago - added a QPR Bird's Head Grip. I 'had' to have a BHG .44. Not the easiest thing to get rid of like that. Fortunately, I still had the original gripframe - and it now belongs to someone else - at a significant loss.

Don't cut the trigger guard... if you tire of it, it'll be a paperweight. Sorry if I seem negative, but I'll leave the 'modifications' to Hamilton Bowen and John Gallagher, etc.

Best of luck with it.

Stainz
 
Another vote against chopping out the trigger guard, and another reason: A "Fitz Special" is a Colt.

Bill Jordan had big hands and just narrowed the front of the trigger guard from the strong side.


Are you cutting the butt to take S&W roundbutt grips or will you make your own to fit however the curve comes out?
 
Trigger Guards...

As mentioned, once a popular treatment or fashion statement and no longer in vogue.

I thought about it years ago and never got around to it. (I've done an M10 in the same style shown here. I'll have to post some pictures of it some time.) The reason for opening the trigger guard is to allow quick access to the trigger in a hurry. In all the time I've carried a revolver, I've never hung up on the trigger guard.

Mr. Watson offers the compromise; relieve the front of the guard on the strong side. Usually between a third and half the width of the guard will allow a full and free access, while maintaining the function of the guard.

By the way, one of the early criticisms of the modification was it was too easy to bend the trigger guard if one used the revolver to club an opponent. This was long before the days of political correctness.
 
Sorry if I seem negative, but I'll leave the 'modifications' to Hamilton Bowen and John Gallagher, etc.


Hey, Hamilton and John had to start somewhere too.

Good luck with it!
 
That project looks awesome. I've thought about doing the same thing before, but I was too intimidated! Especially shortening/recrowning the barrel. I really look forward to seeing the progression.
 
Ignore the nay-sayers... the gun is your private property, do what you like... it's not like you are hacking on a Registered Magnum or a Triple Lock... its a Model 10 for goodness sakes... what did they make like 10 million of them?

You seem to have a good plan, and good skills, so I say keep up the work; don't want a trigger guard? Then don't have one!

Just post lots of pictures so that the rest of us can live vicariously through your experimentation.

Good Luck
 
Hello everyone...



Thank you! - for your various mentions, encouragements, enthusiams, and good natured concerns.


Today was a long Work-Work day, and more to go yet tonight, so not much time to be doing things on the S & W.


Did finesse the Hammer a little more this eve, and if I had not said so already, I find the Hammer to be a pretty hard Steel. None of my 'good' Hack Saw Blades or 'good' Files were happy with it, so I used a Liquid Cooled Diamond Saw, and that did the rough cut, and I used a cheap set of nasty little communist red chinese Diamond Needle Files, for shaping, followed by Silicon Carbide 'Wet-n-Dry' Abrasive Paper, wrapped around the Files, or 'Shoe Shine' fashion, for working out the scratches of the nasty little Diamond Files.


Yeeeeeeeeesh...


An old Colt 'Police Positive' or New Army or other, would have a much friendlier ( Hacksaw and File 'friendy' ) Hammer.


S & W used to Case Harden their Hammers, and the Hardening on this one is 'deep' too.


Finessed the Back-Strap re-profile some more, having now arrived at both a fair long curve, and, a fair 'rounding' of the short or cross axis, matching that of the original form.

Lastly, roughed out and filed pretty close, an old beat up set of plain Walnut Stocks for them to fit the new Grip shape.





This Grip shape is a little deeper or larger than the usual S & W 'Round Butt' and suits my Hand better for it. A regular S & W set of Stocks for a Round Butt, would be about 3/16ths too small on the front Strap lower area.

I'll post a pic soon, showing this.


Well, a little bit every day, is how things get done..!


Glad I got off the dime and got going on it...it's fun and intersting and good learning.


Fixed a minor Factory oversight of the Bar on whose 'Pin' end the Cylinder Release is occasioned...the Bar had a slightly irregular series of paralell planes around the 'Pin' which goes through the Frame to push against the centermost Rod in the Cylinder. So, I trued up the divergent height planes to be even with the lowest, and beveled the bottom edge a tiny bit for it to now rest fully in it's milled-out Frame place, and thus poke b-a-r-e-l-y through now instead of hanging back a little...so now the Cylinder releases nicely, where before it did not.


I'll try for an image of that, but so far have had Camera focusing troubles if trying for tiny details.


Anyway...had an errand today which made it easy to visit for the first time, a good S & W Gunsmith I'd heard about.

He was very gracious to entertain a few questions, and we ended up having a nice conversation.

He liked the project, and found no faults with any of the things I am doing, and he found the correction I'd done to the internal Bar with the 'Pin' on the end, to be 'good' and of right tolerance for the Cylinder release function.


If I can find a parts nomenclature schematic, I will be able to refer to various parts by their proper names...which should be a relief to anyone who does know the proper names, and it'd be nice to learn too.


If anyone can steer me to one, I'd be grateful.



Phil
l v
 
Ah, yes, the bar thingie with the pin that pushes the rod.

That is the "bolt" in S&W speak, which is confusing if you handle more than one brand because what Colt calls a "bolt" is the part S&W lists as the "cylinder stop".

Parts diagram and list at:
http://www.e-gunparts.com/productschem.asp?chrMasterModel=1980z10

You need to take a close look at the cylinder stop, its place in the frame, and the recess for its spring. If you persist in cutting open the trigger guard you will have to be careful to miss that spring recess. You will note that S&W chop jobs leave a little lump under the frame there.

Your trigger looks kind of far back in the guard for the hammer to be down. Is that just a photo illusion or is something stuck?
 
Thank you Jim..!


Lol...Revolver was only 'mocked up' for a hasty image and testing the appearance of the shape of the roughed-out Stocks...Trigger had no surrounding parts and was loose or arbitrarily positioned...Hammer too...side plate was off...so...


Will do...( proceed with careful forethought regarding internals and else...)


Being on the Numrich site, schematic and part numbers in front of me, worked out nice for ordering a set of two Round Head Side Plate Screws, since one will be needed for replacing the 'flat' Head one which used to be under the top of the old Magna type Stock....and the new Stocks will be along the older M & P way of charm, allowing that Screw to show.


I appreciate the link to the schematic and right nomenclature!


Nice...



Phil
Las Vegas
 
I really like this project. Looks like you did a good job and maybe has inspired me!
 
I never was fond of cutting the trigger guard. I'd leave that alone. Round butts are highly desirable, though, and I really like that. :D I won't do it to mine, though, an inheritance and I wanna keep it the way it is. If I could find another one for a decent price (yeah, right), I'd not hesitate to try that round butt treatment, though. Really makes for a better carry and the 3" heavy barrel, too. :D
 
Your last picture has this project looking really nice. The skinny grips you show on it don't fit MY hand worth a darn but if they do it for you then that's what matters.

In support of leaving the trigger guard alone the bit in one of the posts above about the possibility of using your revolver as an impromptu set of brass/steel knuckles should not be overlooked if this is to be eventually an SD firearm. But mostly to my mind having the exposed trigger is my big concern. SOME of this could be handled by covering the hammer with your thumb while holstering in case the trigger hooks something and you feel the hammer beginning to cock. But with all the adrenaline following a "situation" it would be just way too easy to forget this part and go to holster it and end up with a nasty self wound.

Besides, it just looks SOOOO right the way you show it in your picture above.

If you haven't got one for it already may I suggest a Wolff spring kit? Fantastic product. I've used it in both my S&W revolvers and they both improved by more than I ever expected. For my own range only use I went with the softest of the three trigger return springs and even then cut off a coil and a half. Nice light and easy to use double action was the result. Just gotta keep the insides clean. But since mine are range only Prima Donas keeping them clean is not an issue. Under a steady diet of pocket lint you may want to consider the medium weight return spring.
 
Did the Barrel cut his afternoon...and trued up the end from the Saw Marks.


Have to figure out some rounding for the Muzzle now...








So...that deed is done now! No going back...



Phil
 
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