Need Help Reloading 308 for Semi Auto FAL

[orangeparkplink]

I am reloading 150grain FMJ using LC cases, win 748 powder and win primers. I crimp with a Hornady new dimensions die set. With that set up I can't get any better than a 3 inch group at 100 yards. I am not sure if maybe I am crimping too much and causing inconsistent loads. I want to load some sierra 168 grain HPBT to see if I can get any better, but I am not sure what to do if the bullets does not have a canelure. Do I run the risk of the bullet moving from the recoil without crimping? How are the commercial match grade bullets loaded? Any experiences would be appreciated.

 

[taliv]

try not crimping at all
if the bullets don't have a canelure, definitely do not crimp

i mean, fire them one at a time and see if you can shrink the group
if not, then work on something else
if you can, then worry about setback

 

[SteveW-II]

OrangePP, have you shot better groups with this rifle before ? If so, with what ammo ?

I ask because I have 2 FALs and while they WILL shoot better than about 3" at 100 yards (with SA mil surp) its very few and far between. 2.5 to 3 MOA with a rack grade FAL is about as good as it gets when shooting groups with consecutive rounds out of the magazine. Some FALs are better than 2.5 MOA, but most are worse. Here is a whole thread about the subject over on the FAL Files. Mine is the 2nd post, with groups shown. Some handloading tips in there too. W.E.G. did a comprehensive review of ammo types I think.

http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=241840

Steve.

 

[jmorris]

As Taliv said you don't crimp bullets that don't have a canelure. Some problems you can have using bullets like that could be,

#1 them "pulling out" upon being chambered.

#2 pushing them back into the case.

If they move forward into the lands it will pull the bullet, if unfired, upon ejection and fill your receiver with 748, in this case. If they go in, they can increase pressure.

When I have done this I pick a powder that will wind up being a compressed load so I don't have to worry about #2.

 

[REL1203]

With a Semi Auto, dont you have to crimp? I ask cause I am about to start loading for my DPMS SASS and thought you had to do some type of crimp for Semi Auto with a Mag

 

[SteveW-II]

> With a Semi Auto, dont you have to crimp?

IMHO, no. What you will need is good neck tension and the bullet gripped by the whole of the neck. Also, by trying to follow the rule that says you have to crimp, then you will restrict yourself to bullets with a canelure. You don't want to do that. It cuts out so many good bullets..

Good neck tension means that once your case has been through your FL sizer, the inside diameter of your brass is about 2 to 3 thou less than the diameter of the bullet. So, in the case of .308, the inside diameter of the neck of your brass is .305 to .306. It also means that your bullet is seated so that the entire neck is used to grip the shank of the bullet.

On a dummy round, once a bullet is seated, try to push the bullet further in to the case by pressing the tip of the bullet against a hard object like a bench. If you can't more it by using your hands, it's good.

All that said, sometimes a FAL can be a real mother. What receiver is it built around ? If it's the type with the 'unibrow' feed ramp, then chamber the dummy round form the feed ramp then eject it and take a look. See if the bullet has been pushed back. If so, maybe a crimp will help.

Oh - a SASS is a 223, right ?

 

[REL1203]

My DPMS SASS is .308, and a sub MOA gun at that, but i have shot any reloads out of it yet, just high quality factory ammo. I am in the process of setting up my reloading station now

 

[orangeparkplink]

All thanks for your feedback. Jmorris I like the compressed load idea.

Steve I have shot better with a box of match grade blackhills (just under 2 inches). It was only once box so I hope it was not a fluke since I have not been able to repeat with the handloads(FMJ only so far). I reload for my bolt action rifles and have excellent results. My FAL is built on an Imbel Receiver and funtions great. I am going to try your method of the dummy load with the Sierra HPBT 168 grain.

 

[mineralman55]

.308 for Semi Auto FAL

You never mentioned what the 150 grain FMJ bullets were. If they were mil surplus part of your problem may lie there. Many (many, many) years ago when first starting out in reloading, I purchased some mil-surplus 147 grain FMJ bullets. I couldn't get better than 8" groups in my M1. A greybeard looked my loads over and suggested I weigh the bullets. What a surprise! Not only were the bullet weights all over the place, inspection showed very poor manufacturing. These were rejects that an unscrupulous dealer pawned off on a newbie! (may that guy rot in you know where).

Make certain all your components are quality.

 

[orangeparkplink]

The bullets were the bulk from Midway trhat come in the blue boxes. I am going to try some of the Sierras and see where I can go from there.

 

[REL1203]

Is doing a Taper Crimp on 308 shot from a Semi Auto better than doing a Roll crimp? I have the Dillion DIe set that comes with the Taper Crimp and am deciding if its a good idea to use it or not.

 

[orangeparkplink]

On a side note, eventually I will eventually pursue an AR10. Obviousy I want the best accuracy. DPMS or Armlite?