New M1A, now need optics advice

[TexasPatriot.308]

just got my new Springfield Armory M1A standard loaded, 22" barrel, walnut stock. I plan to shoot it primarily with open sights but come next winter I am thinking of adding optics for hogs at long range. some input on mounts, adapters, optics would be appreciated. I shot the M14 in the military 40 years ago, but my eyesight was a lil better then. looking at red dot, holos and regular rifle scopes. thanks.

 

[DBryant]

I haven't put a conventional scope on mine yet (and I may never) but the one thing I hear often repeated is invest in a good quality mount.

As for the scope itself, I've had my eye on a Trijicon Accupoint because I like the simple illuminated post reticule. In theory it should serve your hog hunting purposes quite well. I haven't owned one, just fooled around with the one on display at a local store so I would be interested to hear any reports from people who actually have had one.

 

[Effigy]

To me it seems like a shame to put a red dot on a 10 pound .308 rifle with 22" barrel. You'd probably be better served by a scope of some kind. If you want to maintain the close-range capabilities of a red dot, consider low power variable scope with an illuminated reticle. On 1x it works a lot like an RDS or holo, but you still have the option for magnification at longer ranges.

Couple options for illuminated 1-4x24mm would be the Trijicon Accupoiunt TR24 or Leatherwood/Hi-Lux CMR. You could even go with something more powerful like a 2-7x32mm or 3-9x40mm scope if you don't mind the minimum magnification.

EDIT:
I do have a Trijicon Accupoint 3-9x40mm (green triangle post) on my Savage 10 and I'm impressed with what I've seen of it so far. I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet as I just got it mounted last week, but the glass is nice and the reticle has great visibility. Fit and finish is nice as well.

 

[Red State]

I agree with Effigy - the MIA is just screaming for some magnified optics like a 2-8 or 3-9, not poodleshooter holosights or red dots.

There is a lot to think about when mounting a scope on an M1A and one big factor is how to keep the scope low so that you don't need a big cheek riser. After lots of thread searching and learning, here is how I set up my M1A.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=527436

Whatever mount you choose, get a steel one and not aluminum.

 

[DBryant]

Well, with something like my M1A SOCOM, a red-dot or holosight makes a lot of sense. On a full-length version like TexasPatriot has, I would opt for a more traditional scope with some magnification.

I should probably state that I don't like a whole lot of magnification so for me a 1-4 power variable scope would do quite nicely. Some people certainly prefer more magnification.

 

[henschman]

The issue you always run into on M-14s is that if you use a traditional receiver mount, the scope will sit high and require an awkwardly tall cheek riser to get cheek weld.

I would look into a Scout mount like the Ultimak or Amega Ranges, with a long eye relief scope. It keeps the optic low over the bore so you don't need as high of a cheek rest, if you even need one at all. Most Scout scopes are nice low power, like 2.5x or 4x, which is just enough to overcome bad eyes and is great for field use. If you go with a red dot, I know you can get an Aimpoint low enough on an Ultimak Scout Mount so that you can actually get a lower 1/3 co-witness with the iron sights.

If you want a traditional eye relief scope, I prefer the ARMS #18 scope mount. It is the lowest mount available. With your optic removed, you can see your full iron sight picture over the top of the mount in fact. It is military issue and made from the same grade steel as the M-14 receiver, and attaches very solidly.

BTW, a Standard M1A does not weigh 10 pounds. My Standard weighs 8.4 lbs empty. I doubt it even breaks 10 with a full mag.

 

[Effigy]

Springfield's website listed the Loaded M1A at 9.8 lb with empty mag.

 

[mshootnit]

I like my Bassett low railed mount, low leupold PRW rings and Leupold VX3 10X scope. I don't lack for cheek weld. Maybe because I have alot of cheek there to weld.

 

[Salvo66]

On my Springfield "Loaded Package" M1A, I used a stock "original" Springfield mount and went with a Leatherwood ARTII scope and have been more than happy... It get's a little heavy with the steel mount and weight of the scope but it sure shoots nice!

 

[Bass Ackwardz]

Try the ARMS mount, it's low profile, and rock solid. With a scope, if you buy one with a smaller objective size, then you don't have to worry so much about a cheek riser. I personally went with a Leupold Mk4 2.5x8x40. It really is the perfect optic for the M1A...

Bill

 

[FSJeeper]

I have a Socom and a M!A National Match. I feel no need to put anything on the Socom because the iron sights are perfect for my use for that rifle.

For the National Match, I am still having lots of fun with the excellent iron sights they come with. I will scope it in the future and am on the fence over the ARMS 18 and Bassett low railed mount. I am leaning towards the Bassett mount.

 

[dprice3844444]

hi-luxoptics.com leatherwood mounts and scopes

 

[Andrewsky]

ARMS is the only way to go. It's the lowest one. Don't get an Ultimak or scout set-up. It will mess-up weight distribution and clamp directly onto the barrel, which could mess up harmonics.

 

[Sunray]

"...looking at red dot..." Dots on most of 'em are far too big for accurate long range shooting. Three, 4 and 5 MOA isn't unusual. Holos aren't any better.
A 2.5X to 8X with a 32 or 40 mm objective lens will do nicely. Bigger will just be heavier and will bugger the balance. Partial to the 'multi-x' reticle myself.
Which scope will depend on your budget.
The whole 'scout' concept was one of Cooper's more stupid ideas. Bolt action to start with. Moves the COG forward too much and no real sniper/scout would use one either.

 

[fragout]

I have used several different mounts over the yrs on this type of rifle, and have settled on 2 different mounts for mine...

The first is the Bassett low picatinny mount.
http://www.bassettmachine.com/prod_smpr.htm

Have had a couple of them for awhile now, and they do work as advertised. The nice feature I like about this mount is that once the optic is zeroed, I can remove the mount/optic combo from the rifle, use iron sights, and re-mount the Bassett/optic to the rifle without loss of zero.
This mount does not use the cartridge clip guide slot as a mounting point, so I can also use "stripper clips" when the mount is removed.


If I had to pick only one, then it would be the ARMS#18. (I like the older split rail version the best)

It is lightweight, compact, and very low in profile as compared to the other receiver mounts (to include the LRB M25). It is also very solid if properly installed. This mount uses the cartridge clip guide slot as a mounting point, just FYI. Quick release rings might come in handy if you wanna switch back and forth between optics and irons. Once the optic is removed, it allows use of the iron sights without having to remove the mount itself.

Note: Be advised that thier is a similar mount out there now that closely resembles an ARMS18. (Promag if memory serves me). I dont know if the knockoff mount is worth the $$ or not, but they do cost less than an ARMS does, so dont be fooled into thinking that it is an ARMS #18 mount. Look for the NSN on the mount itself, along with the swan logo ifn's you want an ARMS18....







Using the rifle pictured above with the ARMS#18 split rail mount, a set of Millett type rings, and a very low priced Simmons 3-9 scope, I have taken TX hogs out close to the 400yd mark. On the flip side, I have also dumped them at about 15ft in the brush using iron sights. ( Any closer and I might of had to buttstroke that little piggy...lol)

I'm currently searching for an optic that will work for both extremes, and looking at something along the lines of a 1-4 to mount onto the ARMS. Here are a few I'm looking at....

http://hi-luxoptics.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=51&Itemid=56
http://www.opticsplanet.net/weaver-rifle-scopes-v3-hunting-849400.html



11B

 

[Effigy]

Good stuff, fragout. I mounted the CMR14X24 on a AK-47 with a similar thought in mind. I'm pleased with the quality of that model for the price.

 

[madcratebuilder]

I would spend some time over at

http://www.m14tfl.com/upload/

Best source on the net for info on the M14/M1A. My personal recommendation is a Sadlak mount with Burris Xtreme or Warne QD rings. Sadlak makes some great tools and other small parts for the M1A, all quality stuff.

I have a 3-10X44 on my scoped rifle, plenty of FOV at 3X for most hunting situations. There's a good supply of German surplus ammo on the market at good prices, it shoots very well.

 

[parashooter]

Stick with Sadlak, Smithenterprise, and arms mounts. They also make all kinds of great m1a accessories. Don't get cheap on scopes with an expensive rifle. I never understood why people will only spend a couple hundred bucks on a scope when they spent $1500 on the rifle. Get good rings too. Stick with USGI mags or current military issue CMI mags from 44mags.com

My set up

Scout
sadlak mount
Nightforce rings
Nf 1-4 scope
sadlak piston and oprod guide spring
tubbs springs
sei gas plug
sei vortex flash hider

It shoots moa or better if I do my part.

Go to M14tfl.com for ALL KINDS OF GREAT INFO!!!

 

[fragout]

Here are my reasons for a 20 dollar used Simmons 3-9 deer Field scope:

1. It works for killing hogs out to the 400yd mark...if I do my part.

2. Iron sights are excellent for this type of rifle, so I can still dump them just dandy if the scope ever fails......again...if I do my part.

3. My wife stole my Leupold VXIII for her own M1A-A1. (Ie...the chicks do not dig it..lol)

4. The scope is very light in weight, fairly compact, and I set it up on very low rings to keep from having to build up a comb.

5. So far, I have not managed to break it yet. This is after it has been mounted on 3 different M14 types, an HK91, and a Rem700 chambered in 300Win mag.

6. If I eventually break it, I'm only out 20bucks, and have already got my money out of it in pork alone.

7. My other choice of optic is a 3Gen NVS/Bassett mount, which costs nearly twice as much as an LRB M14SA. ( The wife digs their M25 receiver, so my M14SA should be safe from her clutches.... )

3 power is just to darned much for me at closer ranges in the brush.

Not knocking the high dollar glass however. To each his own.

11B

 

[fragout]

Good stuff, fragout. I mounted the CMR14X24 on a AK-47 with a similar thought in mind. I'm pleased with the quality of that model for the price.
(Quote by Effigy)
===================================================================================================================

It's always good to hear feedback from an owner. Is yours a true 1x when set at 1 power? How does the real scope compare to the stats regarding it?




Madcratebuilder: That is one fine lookin chunk of wood on your rifle.

The M14 firing line is an excellent source of information regarding this type of rifle.


11B

 

[GunTech]

Stick with a Brookfield mount - steel or titanium. I've had the SA aluminum one come loose and get sloppy over a few thousand round. After trying everything on the market, I would only use a SAI or Sadlak, with my preference being the latter since they offer custom mounts for those of use who have out of spec SA receivers.

YMMV

 

[outlook ranch]

Lots of techno talk for hunting pigs. I hunt hogs too, and best to think of low light situations. I went to a Nikon 3-9x50. Wonderful light gathering properties, and haven't had to move it in 6 yrs. Try one.

 

[Z-Michigan]

The issue you always run into on M-14s is that if you use a traditional receiver mount, the scope will sit high and require an awkwardly tall cheek riser to get cheek weld.

+10

And the last time I checked, no forward scope rail (SAI or Ultimak) was made to fit the heavier barrel of the Loaded model, so you're outta luck on that option. Which would otherwise be my strong recommendation.

I'd get the lowest possible conventional scope mount and do a 1.5-5 or 2-7x scope. I'm a fan of 1-4x scopes but I don't think you would like its performance on 1x, as you'd be seeing a lot of the rifle in the view but it would be out of focus and partially distorted. YMMV

 

[Flatbush Harry]

FWIW, I put a Bassett Picatinny Rail mount on my 1978 Vintage Supermatch and added a 3.5-10x40 Leupold (matte finish) with a duplex reticle (I wasn't sure whether or not I'd have to rotate the scope 90* counterclockwise in the mount to prevent the brass from hitting the elevation knob cover...I didn't but that was why I chose the duplex). The Bassett mount was a superb 3 pt. mount and I used med. Weaver rings for a superior scope set-up. I recommend it unhesitatingly, and I might note I alternate the scope/mount between my Supermatch and my SOCOM 16, with excellent results.

FH

 

[X - Man]

The info provided by DBryant is good. The quality of the mount is paramount.
Once the mount is secured any scope can be fitted to the mount more easily than the mount to the receiver.

Word of warning; I purchased a used ARMS #18 mount. I suspect, after trying to get it mounted and looking at it critically, that the item I bought used was a counterfeit mount. A reproduction. The geometry was just not quite correct or precise. It might of been able to been made to work, but it just didn't sit the way it should have. It pays to get a mount directly from a reliable source.

This is not a criticism of the ARMS mount, just a warning about purchasing a used item.