New style Lee expander plug

[JohnB-40]

These arrived in the mailbox today,new type stepped (M?) expander plugs. I got the 38sp,9mm and 45acp which I ordered after reading LiveLife's thread on said plugs. The people at Lee were very helpful in wading trough my vagueness and sending the right stuff. I will expand some cases tomorrow and see if we have a winner. Thank you LiveLife for making us aware of these.
I should add these are the powder through kind

 

[243winxb]

i think Lees would work better it some flare was availiable above the M. Like this 9mm RCBS standard expander. Not a powder thru type.

Some oversize cast bullets are being used by some, that are way larger then standard, to fit cylinder throats.

 

[irishlad]

The new Lee 9mm PTX works great. Used it yesterday for the 1st time setting up my Six Pack Pro.

 

[mdi]

I too would like to see a flare after the step. From the pics there is a smaller OD then a step to a larger OD, but no flare. Even stepped case IDs need an "entry way", unless the stepped ID is larger than the bullet. Might be OK for jacketed bullets as is but I foresee problems seating flat based cast bullets...

 

[JohnB-40]

I was trying out the 9mm expander plug this morning and was quite pleased with the results. I changed the original expander with the new model,didn't alter anything else in the die set in the turret. After expanding I could see the step in the casing. I took a RMR 124gr MW,placed it on the case,pressed down on the top of the bullet with my finger and it snapped perfectly upright in place and held there. Seated the bullet and ran a mild crimp for any flair. Very happy with rounds dimensions and zero setback with a lot of pressure applied. My opinion is while not as well machined as my RCBS stepped expanders,I think they are perfect for use on a TCP with the Pro Auto Disk using the through expander die.

 

[gwpercle]

Also look at the ones made by NOE , you can order different sizes to get exactly the flair(s) you need.
The NOE expanders I have are used in a Lee Universal Case Expanding Die and work perfectly ...
Whenever I order a new mould I order a case expander to fit the bullet that mould casts ...
They are sweet ! www.noebulletmoulds.com check them out .
Gary

 

[Mark_Mark]

Also look at the ones made by NOE , you can order different sizes to get exactly the flair(s) you need.
The NOE expanders I have are used in a Lee Universal Case Expanding Die and work perfectly ...
Whenever I order a new mould I order a case expander to fit the bullet that mould casts ...
They are sweet ! www.noebulletmoulds.com check them out .
Gary

I use NOW expander in .22, 45, 38 … works good and straight. Although I had to ask here on what numbers to order. NOE makes it difficult to understand what to order.

 

[IWAC]

RCBS sent me a "M" type expander...a "step" die, if you will. Works just great, if you don't do as I have often done..get too enthusiastic adjusting it. I managed to form a few "Gabriel's Trumpet" style cases before I got it figured out! My old Lyman "M" die just sits on the shelf anymore.

 

[GW Staar]

i think Lees would work better it some flare was availiable above the M. Like this 9mm RCBS standard expander. Not a powder thru type.

Some oversize cast bullets are being used by some, that are way larger then standard, to fit cylinder throats.

RCBS does make pistol PTX's (originally for the Pro 2000).....you got me curious....I'll have to measure the diameters in 3 places because they are so funky looking.....but they work!
9mm below.....

 

[Jim Watson]

If you make the step large enough to set the bullet, you don't need a flare.
My Lyman M plugs are marginal, the DAA is worse.
The ones from Buffalo Arms for my BPCRs are right.

 

[LiveLife]

ordered after reading LiveLife's thread

Thank you LiveLife for making us aware of these.

You are welcome.

I too would like to se flare after the step

i think Lees would work better it some flare was availiable above the M

After I suggested Lee Precision pursue R&D of stepped "M" style powder through expander (PTX) and R&D sample was sent, there was some discussion as to whether the flare above the step should be added.

My recommendation was to add the flare so those using slightly larger sized lead/coated lead bullets could use the same stepped "M" style PTX but in the end, decision was made to offer PTX in different sizing without the flare for final production.

If you make the step large enough to set the bullet, you don't need a flare.

This was likely the basis for deciding not to add flare above the step.

 

[243winxb]

If you make the step (M) large enough to set the bullet, you don't need a flare.

True, but.

Over working the brass may be the result, making mouths split sooner? (Needs testing). All depends on the cast/coated bullets diameters. A jacketed bullet may need less M?

The old style can be adjusted to just enough flare, not to much, but the bullet will not sit straight in the case mouth.

The custom made M expanders may be a better match?
But- Brass spring back after expanding is different between brands of 45 acp brass. My testing.

Mostly over thinking the expanders. As long as i dont shave lead on bullet seating, i am good to go.

 

[Jim Watson]

Over working the brass may be the result, making mouths split sooner?

Mostly loading for automatics now, I am going to lose brass before I wear it out.

As long as i dont shave lead on bullet seating, i am good to go.

About where I am at the bench.

 

[drband]

I use NOW expander in .22, 45, 38 … works good and straight. Although I had to ask here on what numbers to order. NOE makes it difficult to understand what to order.

I have NOE PTX expanders in 9mm & .45. I had to call NOE to get the correct dimensions before I ordered— actually got the owner on the phone! They work great but are not interchangeable with the Lee expanders. They work properly if installed in a Lee short charging die (not the pistol ptx die).
I have a non ptx .224 NOE expander for my Lee universal expanding die. It is perfect for expanding case necks for those tiny .224 bullets I use for .22TCM! It does fit and work properly in the universal expanding die.

If the Lee PTX stepped expanders had been available, I would have ordered them for a drop in fit in my pistol dies.

 

[mdi]

I was trying out the 9mm expander plug this morning and was quite pleased with the results. I changed the original expander with the new model,didn't alter anything else in the die set in the turret. After expanding I could see the step in the casing. I took a RMR 124gr MW,placed it on the case,pressed down on the top of the bullet with my finger and it snapped perfectly upright in place and held there. Seated the bullet and ran a mild crimp for any flair. Very happy with rounds dimensions and zero setback with a lot of pressure applied. My opinion is while not as well machined as my RCBS stepped expanders,I think they are perfect for use on a TCP with the Pro Auto Disk using the through expander die.

How is the neck tension on the expanded brass?

 

[JohnB-40]

How is the neck tension on the expanded brass?

I measured the round out at 1.085". Pressed down on my bench with a lot force with wood block and then chambered the inert round twice in my 1911.
There was no setback.

If you make the step large enough to set the bullet, you don't need a flare.

I expanded another case this morning and measured with caliper, there is no flaring in case mouth,just the step.

 

[LiveLife]

How is the neck tension on the expanded brass?

There was no setback.

Bullet setback testing showed no bullet setback with RMR 115 gr FMJ seated to target 1.130" OAL using R-P "." brass - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...powder-through-expander.916523/#post-12569719

(Test pistol Gen3 Glock 22 with KKM 40-9mm conversion barrel and 9mm 10 round factory magazine loaded with 5 rounds - OAL before - OAL after - Bullet setback):

1. R-P "." - 1.130" - 1.130" - .000"
2. R-P "." - 1.130" - 1.130" - .000"
3. R-P "." - 1.131" - 1.131" - .000"
4. R-P "." - 1.129" - 1.129" - .000"
5. R-P "." - 1.130" - 1.130" - .000"
6. R-P "." - 1.129" - 1.129" - .000"
7. R-P "." - 1.129" - 1.129" - .000"
8. R-P "." - 1.130" - 1.130" - .000"
9. R-P "." - 1.130" - 1.130" - .000"
10. R-P "." - 1.130" - 1.130" - .000"

 

[stormshrike]

True, but.

Over working the brass may be the result, making mouths split sooner? (Needs testing). All depends on the cast/coated bullets diameters. A jacketed bullet may need less M?

The old style can be adjusted to just enough flare, not to much, but the bullet will not sit straight in the case mouth.

The custom made M expanders may be a better match?
But- Brass spring back after expanding is different between brands of 45 acp brass. My testing.

Mostly over thinking the expanders. As long as i dont shave lead on bullet seating, i am good to go.

I'm a member of the Over-Thinking Expanders Club myself.

Using NOE expanders and seating casted/coated bullets on a single stage press, I have found that just a hint of a flare prevents most lead shaving. But I still can get the occasional finished round that won't pass the case gauge after seating because I didn't get the bullet started straight, causing a bulge. Probably wouldn't be as big of a deal with FMJ/plated, but the larger lead bullets seem to have less margin for error. I need to work on my technique.

I don't load on a progressive, but I assume that a bullet feeder would drop a bullet square on a properly expanded case.

 

[TransAmConvert]

So if you order these from Lee directy, right now, you will get the new style? Or do they need to be specially requested.

 

[LiveLife]

So if you order these from Lee directy, right now, you will get the new style? Or do they need to be specially requested.

No, you will need to ask if new expander is available for caliber you are reloading as they are under the same part number. Ask for "square starting"/stepped "M" style powder through expander (Best to ask to be transferred to technical support).

Lee Precision is currently manufacturing replacement stepped powder through expanders and once sufficient numbers for calibers are made, an official announcement will be made.

We are aware of these and can pre-order unofficially due to "beta testing" done on THR - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...epped-m-style-powder-through-expander.916523/

 

[ReloaderNoob]

RCBS does make pistol PTX's (originally for the Pro 2000).....you got me curious....I'll have to measure the diameters in 3 places because they are so funky looking.....but they work!
9mm below.....

I use those in both the RCBS and Hornady case activated powder measures, like them better than the Hornady ptx's because the RCBS are all the same length for the different calibers, which means you don't have to change die depth when changing calibers.

 

[CQB45ACP]

Now all they need is a micrometer adjustment on top.

Do I get one of these inserts for my current Lee 9mm PTX or a Redding expander like my 45acp? What’s the cost for the Lee insert?

 

[LiveLife]

9mm ... What’s the cost for the Lee insert?

$3.67 - https://leeprecision.com/pm-exp-plug-9mm

 

[vepr12]

That one seems to have a different finish on it, maybe zinc? It would be nice if they Ti-nitrate them like like those cheap gold colored drill bits. I think it would be a practical implication for surface tension reduction.

 

[vepr12]

Now all they need is a micrometer adjustment on top.

Do I get one of these inserts for my current Lee 9mm PTX or a Redding expander like my 45acp? What’s the cost for the Lee insert?

You can make one up for the seating die.