New (to me) 586 and a Question

[wanderinwalker]

Stopped by one of the LGS's yesterday and spotted a used, 4" S&W 586 no dash sitting on the shelf. Thought about it overnight and went back and grabbed it this afternoon. It passed the timing, end shake and lockup checks at the store and appears to have been fired very little. The previous owner swapped out the original stocks for some kind of rubber grip I can't identify.

Repaired to the range. I was a little concerned as I noted the DA trigger felt kind of light. Dropped 6 rounds of Magtech 38 Special in and lo and behold, two bangs or a click. A great, ground shaking click. My first suspicion was the strain screw or possibly binding of the mainspring from an over-torqued grip screw.

Get it home, it's cold and dark now (was 17* at sunset on the range). Pop the grips off, yes, it was on pretty tight. Well, look at that, the strain screw has bugger marks. I remove it, it doesn't look shortened, and tighten it back down ALL the way. The sideplate screws don't show signs of monkeying, so I'm hoping this solves the issue.

Now I'll have to wait until next weekend to see if the strain screw was the culprit. Barring that, what should my next step be? New mainspring? New mainspring and strain screw? I know I should take it back to the shop, but I think this is a common, easy fix on S&Ws.

Oh, and I will post the obligatory "Pics or it didn't happen" photos later. I've already swapped the rubber grips for a set of service stocks I had lying around. I'll wait and see if I need new springs first before I order up a set of Ahrends, that way I can get everything at once from Brownells if needed.

 

[Hondo 60]

Blued steel & wood are two of my all-time favorite elements in life

Sorry, I'm not a gunsmith, so I don't have an answer to your question.
I'd check the strain screw & make sure it's tight.
Maybe someone changed the mainspring for a lighter one?

Anyway, lookin forward to the gun pics.

 

[wanderinwalker]

Did I hear blued steel and wood? Can do!

The 586. I don't think the service stocks do it justice, but the Pachmyers had to go. Sorry, rubber grips just don't belong on blued S&Ws. (Good thing I took them off, looks like the previous owner carried it around a little and didn't know to pull the stocks occasionally.)

I'm not a fan of the visual appeal of the full-lug barrel, but this one doesn't balance too badly IMO with the square butt frame. I really am looking forward to getting it reliable, as it's definitely beefy enough to take .357s in stride. It remains to be given a fair accuracy workout, as 18 rounds of .38s in sub-freezing weather isn't any test at all. Oh, the previous owner had adjusted the rear sight up quite a bit too, it was hitting very high against the 25-yard plates (or should I say, OVER the 25-yd plates).

And a family photo with my other blued S&Ws, a M-18 .22LR and M-19 .357. Next to add, a Model 10 and 15 and 28.

 

[Confederate]

How much did you pay?

Some people file off the end of the strain screw so they won't get the full tension. Others file off the sides of the mainspring. Buggered screws are always a bad sign, but make sure the gun store picks up any repair costs.

Sorry you didn't get the wood grips. Let us know what happens.

.

 

[wanderinwalker]

Confederate, it was $499 OTD. I ran the pencil check on it compared to my 19. With the 19, be careful, you might put an eye out! (Proven reliable revolver.) This 586 just barely lifts the pencil a little bit. Obviously I'm not getting solid hammer strikes with it.

Right now I don't know if I should swap to the mainspring from one of my other S&Ws and see if that does the trick or what. If that works, it would seem reasonable to drop a new Wolff spring in and be good to go.

Oh, FWIW, it fired fine in single-action, at least for the 6 I tried that way.

 

[skidder]

wanderinwalker-- Nice addition to the family! I would say that's fair price.

One thing I would change....put the target grips on the L frame and the service on the K frame. I think that would look and feel better.

I hope it shoots better for ya next time!

 

[MrBorland]

I remove it, it doesn't look shortened, and tighten it back down ALL the way.

Was it loose to begin with?

IIRC, square butt strain screws are tough to find, so let's hope that's not the fix. You can likely compare it's length to that of you model 19 to see if it's been shortened. Or swap in the 19's strain screw to see if it fixes the problem.

The easiest fix would be to place a brass shim between the mainspring & strain screw. You can make one easy enough from a used case.

Take a look at the firing pin, too, just to be sure there's not a problem with it. Again, you can use your 19 for comparison.

 

[wanderinwalker]

skidder - Thanks! I'm leaning toward another set of the Ahrends smooth combats from the 586, but I might go with a finger-groove model instead. Jury's still out.

Mr. Borland - The strain screws seem to the same (if anything, the one in the 19 has been ground). The 586 screw was 1/4-1/2 turn loose when I got to it. I noticed even with the strain screw tightened all the way, the mainspring doesn't appear to be riding all the way back in its frame-slot like the one on my 19 is. Why do I get this feeling this is the source of the issue right there?

Would a lightened/recountered mainspring not seat properly in its slot even with full strain screw tension? I'll try the spent primer shim trick I read about for now.

 

[MrBorland]

The 586 screw was 1/4-1/2 turn loose when I got to it.

A lightly-sprung gun can have very little tolerance for a screw that's even a little loose. I tuned my 625 to 6 lbs, and it shoots my reloads reliably, but if the strain screw is anything but fully tight, I'll get misfires. A dab of blue I loctite keeps the gun running.

I noticed even with the strain screw tightened all the way, the mainspring doesn't appear to be riding all the way back in its frame-slot like the one on my 19 is. Why do I get this feeling this is the source of the issue right there?

Would a lightened/recountered mainspring not seat properly in its slot even with full strain screw tension?

I'm having a tough time picturing this. Got a pic?

I'll try the spent primer shim trick I read about for now.

The gun may shoot fine now that the strain screw's been tightened. But, you can try a shim. If you use a spent primer, I'd remove the anvil first. I usually cut a rectangular (same width as the spring) piece of brass from the case.

 

[Old Shooter]

Numrich has the strain screws in stock for the square butt 586 series as part number 323520 @ $3.15 each.

The screw for the square butt model 19 is the same part number also. Are both screws you have in hand identical?

The round butt has a different part number, mayby somebody either worked on your current screw or changed the original out for the wrong one.?

 

[Remllez]

It sounds like someone bent your mainspring in an attempt to lighten the pull, the strain screw if proper length should push the mainspring into it's slot completely seating it. When you order a new strain screw get yourself a stock mainspring.

 

[trex1310]

Check the mainspring and make sure it hasn't been bent at the top.
(A favorite trick to soften double action trigger pull.)

My 586-1: nickle, 6", unfired, circa 1986:

 

[wanderinwalker]

Zipped up to the range before sunset tonight with the 586 and 19. Still had 1 misfire with the 586 on the first cylinder, in SA with the Magtechs. But it fired off a bucket load of my 38 reloads in DA mode without a hiccup and 6 rounds of CCI Blazer Brass .357s. Incidentally, the 19 fired off the "dud" Magtech round on the first try (I hit it 3 times with the 586).

I think I'm going to go ahead and add a new mainspring to my order for a set of wood stocks and swap it in. And fire a bunch more rounds through it.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

If the screw was buggered up I would guess the previous owner tried to do a trigger job or something like that on their own. They could have shortened anything, I would install a set of Wolff springs to be sure everything is right...

 

[BCRider]

Something to try since I don't seen anything about cleaning out the insides would be to flush the action with a solvent and oil mix such as the much beloved Ed's Red mix. I'm thinking that old oil, dust and maybe some other grunge is gumming up the hammer travel. If so you may not feel the viscous drag it causes when cocking it. But if it's there it can easily slow down the hammer's fall to where it's a little iffy with some primers.

As an example of what I'm talking about think waving your had around in air and then under water in a pool. A clean hammer pivot and faces with just a little light bodied oil is your hand in the air. Some old grunged up oil and dust mixture is like your hand under water. Take that same gun out in the cold and let the existing grunge thicken up and it's like trying to wave your hand around in half congealed Jello.

I like the Ed's mix for this sort of thing because you clean away the old oils and dust while leaving behind a light coat of thin protective oil. All with merely the need to remove the grips and squirt some of the mix into the action liberally a few times, work the action a dozen times, flush once more and then shake and allow to drain and dry for a few hours. Wipe off any excess on the outer surfaces and re-install the grips.

Do the same thing with a pure solvent and there's no rust guarding oil left behind. So you end up trying to oil things when you can't even see them. For this reason the Ed's Red mix is extremely revolver friendly in my books.

If you go with this option be sure to wear nitrile gloves while working the action on the dripping gun. The stuff used in this mix isn't all that good for bathing in. Generally at least two of the ingredients are not nice to get on your skin in larger amounts.

 

[Master Blaster]

You will probably find that they filed or ground on the mainspring and may have bent the top to lighten the pull. The gun may set off federal primers reliably or not. In the day this was a common mod to reduce the trigger pull.
Order a replacement spring from Brownells, get a bossed reduced mainspring and a standard one for an K/L/N frame. The spring is easy to change if you back out the strain screw. Try the bossed on first, if that doesn't work use the full power spring.

I recently bought a 25-2 that had the mainspring ground and bent by the previous owner/ gunsmith. First range trip Click Click Click bang click click. I replaced the mainspring with the Bossed reduced model and now its 100% in DA with wolf primers.

 

[Standing Wolf]

I would install a set of Wolff springs to be sure everything is right...

That's what I'd do, too, and replace the buggered strain screw. It's unusual for strain screws to work loose, but it can and does happen now and then.

I'd start with a lighter Wolf main spring, and test the revolver for 100% reliability. If it failed to fire even one round in 200, I'd replace the lightened Wolf spring with a factory spring, then test it again.

I recently bought a 25-2 that had the mainspring ground and bent by the previous owner/ gunsmith.

That's not at all uncommon. When in doubt—any doubt at all—quit wasting time and replace the spring. If there's any chance you'll ever use the gun for defensive purposes, it might be worth your while to bear in mind main springs and strain screws are considerably less expensive than lives.

 

[wanderinwalker]

Thanks again everybody! I have a mainspring and strain screw on the way from Numrich, which I am expecting to solve the issue. I doubt the trigger will be so awful at factory spec to bother me much; that Model 18 is not the definition of smooth at the end of its DA pull and 4" plates are in danger at 25-yards...

While I was at tossing money at it, I've sent off for a set of Ahrends Smooth Tacticals in maple. Those should look pretty good and function well.

And yes, there's a real possibility this revolver could be tasked with nightstand and woods duty, so I want it to run through any ammo I throw at it without question. I mean, it's great it ran on my Winchester primered reloads and some CCI Blazer Brass .357s, but I'm not going to take chances.

Next up, good leather! My 19 came with a Milt Sparks scabard holster that is amazing. I'm open to suggestions for the L-frame.

 

[rcmodel]

Still had 1 misfire with the 586 on the first cylinder, in SA with the Magtechs.

Maybe you should consider trying a different brand of ammo.

Lots of reports of your problem & Magtech .38 & .357 ammo floating around on the internet.

rc