the Black Spot
Member
Is it possible to achieve 950 fps with 310 cast bullets in a 5.5" barreled blackhawk? (44 specia)
Would be using unique, blue dot or 2400.
Thanks
Would be using unique, blue dot or 2400.
Thanks
Nm blackhawk 44 special and 310 cast bullets..?
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the Black Spot
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Want to use for close range elk and hogs.
I have a bunch of these 310 cast bullets, my blackhawk should handle @22,000 cup.
I have a bunch of these 310 cast bullets, my blackhawk should handle @22,000 cup.
do a lot of reading on Elmer Kieth and John Taffin. Be very cautious in your workups.
Start here: www.Sixguns.com
Start here: www.Sixguns.com
If it has to be 310 grain bullets, you are better off using a 44 Magnum in my opinion. I have shot many 240 LSWC's in my 44 Specials, and one going at 1000 fps is going to poke a big hole in a hog. I don't know about Elk, they are not in my neighborhood, but I don't doubt the slug would hurt one badly.
44 Spl Ruger Blackhawk 5.5"
240 LSWC 6.6 grs Unique thrown, lot UN364 3/9/92 Midway cases, Brass WLP
T ≈ 60-65 ° F 19-Apr-09
Ave Vel = 875.4
Std Dev = 25.94
ES = 109.6
High = 914.8
Low= 805.2
N = 25
240 LSWC 7.5 grs Unique thrown, lot UN364 3/9/92 Midway cases, Brass WLP
T ≈ 60-65 ° F 19-Apr-09
Ave Vel = 1001
Std Dev = 17.32
ES = 64.32
High = 1027
Low= 963
N = 27
44 Spl Ruger Blackhawk 5.5"
240 LSWC 6.6 grs Unique thrown, lot UN364 3/9/92 Midway cases, Brass WLP
T ≈ 60-65 ° F 19-Apr-09
Ave Vel = 875.4
Std Dev = 25.94
ES = 109.6
High = 914.8
Low= 805.2
N = 25
240 LSWC 7.5 grs Unique thrown, lot UN364 3/9/92 Midway cases, Brass WLP
T ≈ 60-65 ° F 19-Apr-09
Ave Vel = 1001
Std Dev = 17.32
ES = 64.32
High = 1027
Low= 963
N = 27
Jim Watson
Member
Brian Pearce got a 250 to 1000 fps at 22000 psi.
I don't think you can push a 310 to 950 at that pressure.
I don't think you can push a 310 to 950 at that pressure.
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the Black Spot
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Thx murf. I have the B. Pearce article. He used h110 which i dont have.
I can only work with 2400,blue dot and unique
i use h110 and cci350 primers exclusively in my heavy bullet 44 and 45 caliber revolver loads. max power and best accuracy in this category.
i like blue dot for the medium bullet loads. my favorite in the 45 cal. blackhawk is a 265 swc and blue dot, at 1200 fps. super accurate at long range.
luck,
murf
i like blue dot for the medium bullet loads. my favorite in the 45 cal. blackhawk is a 265 swc and blue dot, at 1200 fps. super accurate at long range.
luck,
murf
highlander 5
Member
I've a 4 5/8" SBH that I fire 44 spl out of using 44 spl case and 300 gr bullets got decent accuracy but I don't remember the load.
Mad Chemist
Member
I don't think a .44spl is enough gun for a bull elk. It may fail to penetrate if it hits the shoulder.
I have a friend that hunts elk with a scoped Redhawk in .44mag. The loads we worked up are 300gr but they are moving much faster than 950fps.
I have a friend that hunts elk with a scoped Redhawk in .44mag. The loads we worked up are 300gr but they are moving much faster than 950fps.
mr. pearce never mentioned 2400, or blue dot for the heavy 44 special loads. w296 is the same powder as h110 if you come across some. if you can't find these powders, a 250 grain keith bullet over the 2400 powder can get out the muzzle at 1200 fps (blackhawk only). that may be a better way to go.
mr. pearce has other articles in handloader regarding shooting elk with the 44 special.
murf
mr. pearce has other articles in handloader regarding shooting elk with the 44 special.
murf
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the Black Spot
Member
Q
Thx murf i will look into those articles.
I did find a listed load of:
300 jsp backed by 9.6 gr of 2400 for 711 fps and still at 18,000 cup.
That is a load i could shoot from an old CA bulldog.
Uping that charge to 11 gr might(again might) be under 25,000 cup, but still may not be close to even 900 fps.
I may have to keep the 300 grainers for the 444 marlin, and switch to a lighter bullet in the special.
Thx murf i will look into those articles.
I did find a listed load of:
300 jsp backed by 9.6 gr of 2400 for 711 fps and still at 18,000 cup.
That is a load i could shoot from an old CA bulldog.
Uping that charge to 11 gr might(again might) be under 25,000 cup, but still may not be close to even 900 fps.
I may have to keep the 300 grainers for the 444 marlin, and switch to a lighter bullet in the special.
If you look up "44 special, Goodrich family" you'll find lots of articles on the 44 special. It has the Brian Pierce articles and several others. There's also some data in the last handloader but it was only using some 255gr LSWC's. I prefer the Skeeter load in my Blackhawk, the Keith load of 2400 was more recoil than I like.
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the Black Spot
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Found another site where couple people have launched 300 gr cast bullet a hair over 1000 fps using 2400 powder. They said their empties dropped out of their blackhawks. No sign of pressure problems.
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the Black Spot
Member
Singleactions.proboards.com
It was in the handloads section(obviously) about page 1 or 2
It was in the handloads section(obviously) about page 1 or 2
Bula
Member
The thought of 300+ grains out of .44spl brass and pistol makes me a little nervous. My vote is to stick to the 250'ish cast bullets. My bet would be at pistol ranges, at 900 or so, equals dead game. I love the cast 429421 at 850 to 900 from a 4 5/8" mag Super Blackhawk.
35 Whelen
Member
Here's the link to the index of .44 Special articles
Interesting. Standard .44 Magnum loads from the Big 3 ammunition manufacturers consist of bullets in the 240-250 gr. range running from an advertised velocity of 1180-1250 fps. The original /44 Special Keith load, published in in Handloader #236, among other places, consists of a cast SWC weighing in the 240 -260 gr. range over 17.0 grs. of AL2400. Velocity runs 1200 fps +/-...curiously similar to the Big 3 .44 Magnum loads I mentioned.
I've tested this load in my stock Flat Top .44 Special and was very impressed both with velocity and accuracy:
Just for grins I fired this group at my 200 yd. gong (21") with the Blackhawk and the same load. I didn't adjust the sights for that range, rather sighted using a line I'd scribed into the rear of the front sight. The first 5 shots would easily fit into the vitals of a bull elk, but I'd never fire any handgun at elk at that range.
The bullet pictured below, a home-cast 258 gr. SWC, was taken from a whitetail buck. It's impact velocity was about 1080 fps and it struck in the left flank and travel the length of the bucks body coming to rest under the skin ahead of the right shoulder. As evidenced by the first picture, it struck a bone along the way. PLENTY of penetration I'd have to say.
I'm no expert but I really don't think a 300+ gr. bullet is necessary. Also in Handloader #236 Pearce relates:
A number of years ago, I planted two 250- grain cast bullets (from Lyman
mould 429421) through the lungs of a bull elk at over 100 yards. They were driven 1,200 fps from a Colt New Frontier with a 7-1/2" inch barrel. Both bullets exited the offside, and the bull ran 20 or 30 feet before going down.
He goes on to state: Several mule deer have fallen to the same bullets
that were traveling 900 to 980 fps. In spite of this modest velocity, bullets completely penetrate on broadside lung shots, and deer usually drop within 20 to 50 yards.
I've only killed two deer with a .44 Special revolver, both with with loads running a 255-ish gr. SWC at a little under 950 fps. Both ran about 25 yds. and gave it up.
35W
Interesting. Standard .44 Magnum loads from the Big 3 ammunition manufacturers consist of bullets in the 240-250 gr. range running from an advertised velocity of 1180-1250 fps. The original /44 Special Keith load, published in in Handloader #236, among other places, consists of a cast SWC weighing in the 240 -260 gr. range over 17.0 grs. of AL2400. Velocity runs 1200 fps +/-...curiously similar to the Big 3 .44 Magnum loads I mentioned.
I've tested this load in my stock Flat Top .44 Special and was very impressed both with velocity and accuracy:
Just for grins I fired this group at my 200 yd. gong (21") with the Blackhawk and the same load. I didn't adjust the sights for that range, rather sighted using a line I'd scribed into the rear of the front sight. The first 5 shots would easily fit into the vitals of a bull elk, but I'd never fire any handgun at elk at that range.
The bullet pictured below, a home-cast 258 gr. SWC, was taken from a whitetail buck. It's impact velocity was about 1080 fps and it struck in the left flank and travel the length of the bucks body coming to rest under the skin ahead of the right shoulder. As evidenced by the first picture, it struck a bone along the way. PLENTY of penetration I'd have to say.
I'm no expert but I really don't think a 300+ gr. bullet is necessary. Also in Handloader #236 Pearce relates:
A number of years ago, I planted two 250- grain cast bullets (from Lyman
mould 429421) through the lungs of a bull elk at over 100 yards. They were driven 1,200 fps from a Colt New Frontier with a 7-1/2" inch barrel. Both bullets exited the offside, and the bull ran 20 or 30 feet before going down.
He goes on to state: Several mule deer have fallen to the same bullets
that were traveling 900 to 980 fps. In spite of this modest velocity, bullets completely penetrate on broadside lung shots, and deer usually drop within 20 to 50 yards.
I've only killed two deer with a .44 Special revolver, both with with loads running a 255-ish gr. SWC at a little under 950 fps. Both ran about 25 yds. and gave it up.
35W
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the Black Spot
Member
Thx whelen for the info. Btw thats the same revolver i have that i want to shoot the 300's out of.
Mad Chemist
Member
Sure, I completely agree that a properly loaded .44spl can easily take a deer if the shooter does his part. However, a bull elk is a much larger critter than any deer. They are particularly large up here.
Can someone take a Bull elk with a .44spl.....probably.
Should someone try to take an elk with one, probably not.
300gr bullets may not be necessary either but it was fun to develop the load. They were real thumpers
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