Not Your Typical HK vs. Glock Thread.

[FlaMike]

I hope this doesn’t come across as your typical Gun A vs. Gun B thread. I have some specific questions in my comparison of H&K USP9 Compact and the Glock 19. First off, I would love to “buy both” but cannot. I have rented both guns and put 100 rds through each.

I’ve heard H&K’s customer service is not the best. But this is “what I heard” and not actual experience. Has anyone had to deal with them? What was your experience like? On the other hand, Glock’s customer service record seems very good.

I have read on this forum, and others, about the need to replace the sights on the Glock and some reports of sights falling off or breaking. How common is this? Are the metal factory sights a better option? I’ve never heard of sights falling off H&Ks. Although I’m sure they have of course. The sights of the H&K seemed superior (at least for me) when I was renting and comparing the two pistols side by side.

Reliability is paramount, but both makers seem to be very reliable and durable. One more so than the other? Although I recognize that failures are not at all common in the Glocks, I seem to read more about them jamming, FTF, ect. than I do the H&Ks. I’m sure this has to do with the fact that there are tons more Glocks out there than H&K. Also, how much of these failures are probably user error?

I’ve also heard that it is easier to clean and repair the Glocks than most pistols. How much of a difference between the two? I’m sure I could learn the proper breakdown and care of each, but simple is better. As someone with no gunsmithing ability. Could I still repair /replace any/some parts in the Glock? I’m pretty sure self repair on the H&K is out. 

As far as concealment, I think the 19 would be hard to beat compared to the USP Compact, but I’m a big guy and could probably conceal the USP, just less comfortably than the 19. Does anyone carry the USP concealed? BTW, I’d only be carrying concealed 4-6 hours at a time, 1-2 days a month.

I shot the H&K better but the 19 was a close second. Very close. The USP felt better in my hand, but again the Glock was close second. I like the Glock for several reasons, including aftermarket accessories, cheap and abundant parts, customer service and ease of maintenance. The difference is price of the pistols is not that big or important to me. $125-150 difference IF I am buy the superior product. More expensive doesn’t necessarily means better, but most often, it does.

Any and all input will be appreciated. Thanks.

Mike.
Lake Mary, FL

*Note: I have posted this thread on FiringLine.com as well. If your read both forums, I apologize for the repost.

 

[nomadboi]

If you can track down someone with one, try out a Steyr M-series.

Another good alternative, and they can be had pretty darn cheap now if you can pick up one of the older models- they recently came out with the A-1 series that has a standardized rail and a couple other minor mods.

 

[benEzra]

I have no experience with HK's, but I can say that Glocks are great. My wife owns a G26, and IIRC it has been 100% reliable. The Glock 17 and 19 are probably the most reliable and durable of all Glocks, I'd expect. I seem to recall instructor Kelly McCann (a.k.a. "Jim Grover") writing a few years ago that he had put over 100K rounds through his G19 and still trusted it for daily carry in harm's way...I think Chuck Taylor did a 350,000 round torture test on a G17, and he wore out a few magazine springs but didn't break the gun.

You can also use G17 and G18 magazines in a G19 (17 and 33 rounds, respectively) should you ever chose to do so, since they are all "upward compatible". My wife has a 15-round G19 magazine for her G26 for HD.

As far as sights, if you can afford them then I'd recommend tritium sights anyway. My wife had the gun shop install a set of Trijicons on her G26 the day she bought it, and they're still plenty bright 9 years later.

 

[mpthole]

I’ve heard H&K’s customer service is not the best. But this is “what I heard” and not actual experience. Has anyone had to deal with them?

I heard that rumor too. In my experience, Colt wins the award for worst customer service. I sent my USP .45c to Virginia about 2 years ago because I was getting some light primer strikes. Total turn-around time was almost exactly 30 days from the day I shipped it until the day I received it back. Problem solved with a note explaining what they did and why. I was very please with the level of service I got from them. I was not reimbursed for my shipping charges - although I never asked at the time.

I have four models of the USP series and I can say that the sights have always been very good with regards to point-of-aim and point-of-impact. Dead on in some cases and only slightly off in others. No adjustment has been required for my type of shooting.

Reliability: I don't think I've ever experienced a single malfunction in either of my USP 9's. They'll eat anything.

Cleanliness: USP's are very easy to field strip. And that's really all the maintenance they'll ever need. A buddy of mine ran nearly 5k rounds through his before cleaning it and it still went bang ever time. I finally offered to clean it for him because it just bothered me.

Concealability: IMO, even though the USP's are fairly thick, the USP 9c is pretty easy to conceal, especially if you're a "bigger" guy. I carried one in a Kramer Confidant shirt every day for several months. I've also carried it in IWB, OWB, fanny packs, smart-carry and shoulder hosters. It fills a nice niche for me because its quite a bit smaller than a gov't model .45.

Accessories are going to be harder to find for the USP than the Glock. Magazines are a bit more expensive too.

I have seen more Glocks break at the range than USPs. Like you said that could be because there are so many more of them out there.

I would like to own a Glock someday - I'm looking at getting a 19 someday as well - but for now I'm happy with my USPs and 1911's.

Good luck with your decision - you really can't go wrong with either.

 

[Boss Spearman]

I've owned the Glock 17, 19, 23, 26, and 36 and sold every one of them. I was trying to like them because they are so popular, but I just can't stand them.
To me a G19 does not compare to my HK USP compact. The trigger is the main thing for me. Glock triggers for me s*ck, quite frankly. The trigger is very abusive on my shooting finger at any extended range session.
The HK on the other hand has a smooth trigger I can shoot all day without discomfort. I also prefer the HK's safety. I carry my USPC several hours a day without any problems.

As for customer service, I've yet to need service for either of my HKs,but I haven't had them for too long.

 

[Onmilo]

I have three Glocks, a Model 34 and two Model 26 pistols, all in 9mm.
I also recently purchased an H&K USP Elite in .45 acp.

All my Glocks have 3.5 lb. connectors and all are accurate and reliable.

The USP Elite is traditional double action.
It is better fitted and finished than a standard model and this makes it hard to compare to the Glock trigger.
The magazines are metal bodied and about twice as expensive as Glock magazines.
The grip feels larger in my hand but the pistol is controllable, super accurate and completely reliable.

I think the choice would come down to what feels best in your hand.

 

[cz75bdneos22]

since cost is not an issue, buy the hk. otherwise, you'll be forever damning (sp) glocks if you settle for one.. i have a g37, g20 and shoot a friends g21..it does everything you mention and it costs less than hk.. now, don't get me wrong...i'd get an hk too. i'm just saying the glock offers the best-bang-for the buck for me..don't want to later hear from you the familiar shoulda/coulda/woulda, but didn't story..hehe!

 

[jlh26oo]

I think you've already decided:

A) You shot the USP better.

B) Price is not an issue.

I was recently in your position, but it was between a 34 and a USP Expert. So in my case, the price jump from the Glock to HK was considerable. I went with the 34, but I'm not going to lie- it would have been the HK had money been no object.

The overall quality on the HK was obvious. The slide didn't sound like a screen door creaking like on glocks, it just glided. Everything was crisp, and the controls were snappy. Of course HK has the accuracy advantage.

While I prefer the trigger type of the glock over a da/sa, there is no disputing the match trigger was better than glock's (have never tried the compact version, don't know if its as good as the match or not). The only advantage the glock really has is in size. The USP was taller, wider, and longer overall while somehow having a shorter barrel and shorter sight radius.

With 19 vs USPc- overall dimensions are about the same, but the 19 has a 6.02" vs 5.35" sight radius advantage on the USPc, and 4" vs 3.58" barrel length advantage- don't know if the width measurements include the safety/decoker or not.

Both will be the pinnacle of reliability.

Yeah glock sights kind of suck, so you have to consider that in the price difference if you are going to upgrade- unless you are already looking at glock steel or glock night.

MY guess would be the glock finish is tougher, but I'm sure you wouldn't have probs w/either.

I don't know man- if you've already put a 100 through each, I don't think there is anything anyone here can tell you. You have your answer. But if PRICE is not a factor, and you SHOOT the HIGHER QUALITY of the two BETTER, it's a no brainer.

Good luck.

 

[psyopspec]

Owner and regular carrier of a USP c .45 here and former Glock 19 owner.

I’ve heard H&K’s customer service is not the best. But this is “what I heard” and not actual experience. Has anyone had to deal with them?

I've never had to deal with the company. I realize every manufacturer makes a lemon now and then, but with two HK pistols in my collection and no problems, my confidence in the brand only continues to grow. No experience with Glock customer service either. This is a tip o' the hat to both.

Reliability is paramount, but both makers seem to be very reliable and durable. One more so than the other?

In my experience, no, there is not a superior. I bought the Glock 19 new, went about 3-4000 rounds with it before selling (that darn trigger...). My USP 9 and USPc .45 probably have about 6-8000 between the two of them with no failures.

Also, how much of these failures are probably user error?

Limp wristing probably accounts for the majority of failures to eject that youv'e seen in Glocks. However, I never had a problem with one-handed shooting on either pistol. Just keep the arm extended and a solid grip.

I have read on this forum, and others, about the need to replace the sights on the Glock and some reports of sights falling off or breaking. How common is this? Are the metal factory sights a better option?

Sights falling or chipping off are rare; I go for night sights on my pistols anyway, so I can't elaborate much more on the factory ones.

I’ve also heard that it is easier to clean and repair the Glocks than most pistols. How much of a difference between the two?

As far as the time it takes to field strip, clean, lube, and reassemble, there's no real difference between the two. Suppose you could make the argument the HK mags might need cleaning more frequently than Glock, but that's negligable (I clean my HK mags every 4-500 rounds. No problems). Beyond the field stripping level, the consensus seems to be that Glocks are easier to fully disassemble. However, I'm not an armorer, so beyond user maintenance I can't comment.

As far as concealment...

I CCW'd the G19 without any problems in a leather pancake holster. It was an awesome rig after the holster finally broke in. I had to do a little more exploring to find a good holster for the HK, but I wanted something that would conceal much deeper too, and wound up with a Tuck This! holster by Desantis. Not too uncomfortable, carries a spare mag, tuckable IWB. To me, the extra effort is worth it to carry the pistol I'm more comfortable with, and by no means is the HK "hard" to conceal to begin with. For two days per month, 6 hours max, I wouldn't let the difference in concealability influence your decision.

The difference is price of the pistols is not that big or important to me. $125-150 difference IF I am buy the superior product. More expensive doesn’t necessarily means better, but most often, it does.

Now we get into that highly subjective area where you must choose what the superior product is for you. Quality-wise you're looking at an arms race that's too close to call. Let us know what you go with and how it shoots! Good luck.

Oh, and I almost forgot... Welcome to THR!

 

[FlaMike]

Thanks for the Responses.

I appreciate all the good, detailed responses I got from this thread. Lots of well informed and helpful people in this forum.

Still a tight race though.

Thanks again,

Mike
Lake Mary, FL

 

[jashobeam]

If you get a Glock, don't get adjustable sights

That is my only advice to you. The adjustable rear-sight of the Glock is definitely a very weak link in an otherwise very reliable pistol. I have a Glock 17 that I purchased with adjustable sights many years ago. The rear sight broke off completely when my waterbed's frame slipped and somehow pinched the gun, which I kept between the bladder and the frame-siding (or whatever you call it) of the bed. Afterward, I had a fixed sight installed.

I love my Glock and am quite used to the trigger. I wouldn't even know that Glock triggers suck if I hadn't been told so.

Like others have said, get the HK if that is what feels best to you and is what you shoot the best.

Welcome to The High Road! Have fun shopping, and enjoy whichever gun you choose.

 

[Rockstar]

If you don't like the grooved trigger on your G19, it's pretty simple to install a smooth, G17 trigger. It's also really simple to install a 3.5# connector. HK's a fine pistol. You won't go wrong with either.

 

[waterhouse]

I shot the H&K better but the 19 was a close second. Very close. The USP felt better in my hand, but again the Glock was close second.

I think you have the answer. They are both great guns and you sound like you've done your homework. Don't settle for "close second." (Dear Glock people, please do not take this to mean that glock is "second" to HK, only that for this individual user the HK fit his hand better).

 

[oct_97]

I sold an H&K at a big loss just to get rid of it when they refused to sell me a front sight, would not sell it to my FFL/Gunsmith either. Great gun, absolutly LOUSY company .

 

[middy]

The fixed rear sights on a Glock are fine, very durable. The adjustables have been known to break.

The plastic front sight post has also been known to pop off. If you don't want the added expense of tritium sights you can get a steel front post (with mini-wrench included) from Ameriglo for about $10 that a monkey could install in 5 minutes, though you'd probably get better results if you did it yourself.

Detail stripping a Glock is very easy, you can easily replace any part yourself. Detail stripping a USP is, well, look here :banghead:

Of course, you'll probably never need to detail strip a H&K since they never break.

As far as customer service, if you're not in military procurement H&K couldn't care less about you or your gun.