NRA Article - Taurus Judge

[MCgunner]

Wouldn't the freebore be the same as on the Contender barrel?

I have a .45 colt/.410 contender and had a scope on it at one time. It would group about 8-10" at 100 yards, which is pathetic for a contender, but with the irons on it, at 50, you could keep 'em on minute of deer shoulder, probably around 5". The shotgun part of it involves screwing a choke on the end of the barrel which chokes it full choke AND stops the rotation of the shot load. I've hunted squirrel with it. At 20 yards and in, you can hit, but I've fired on a squirrel about about 25-30 yards before and he just scampered off laughing at me as leaves fell off the tree all around where he was sitting. The combination, even in a contender, is less than impressive.

The judge, at across the room ranges, especially if you have a small two bedroom like my house, it fine, but it ain't no huntin' or outdoor survival tool, no way, no how. I'll keep my DA .357s or my Blackhawks for outdoor use or my .30-30 barrel on the contender for serious whitetail and hog hunting. And, I have taken squirrel at 50+ yards with the .22 barrel on that Contender. The .22 is far more effective than the .410 barrel.

BTW, I haven't tried it yet, but contender types have loaded 9.3x74R brass with bulky powder and a .45 bullet to take up the freebore in the contender. I don't even know where to start on powder and powder charge, but some day when I've got nothing better to do, I'm going to ebay some brass and work on this project. Could wind up with a poor man's .45-70.

 

[ryan b]

I think everyone is missing the concept here I own one yes it has limitaions but i have a 4 inch this barrel length is not even listed with shot mine throw a good pattern at 15 yards with winchester 6's well enough for small game it shoots slugs magnificently i can hit a milk jug all day at 40 yards with them and with 45 lc it will shoot 3 inch groups from a rest at 50 yards. Try a load os 3 pellet buckshot and you will be really amazed. Yes you can get shot for a 45 colt but can you get #6 in the 45 shotshell no unless u load them yourself. My buddy has the 6 inch and it does not shoot nearly as good as mine. for a gun that is for special purposes i think it is very good. I always carry mine when i back pack with a 25 round belt of a mix of shells and shotshells. I may have just gotten a good one but i would let any one shoot mine that is a none believer in them deffently dont count them out. as a self defense weapon you cant beat it mine is loaded by my bed with the first load being shot round 2 and 3 bering 3 pellet buckshot and the last 2 45 colt corbon hollow points

 

[Shotgun Willie]

Taurus Judge

Can you believe those fools over at the Taurus company? Everyone here has already told them that Judge gun is no good, and yet those fools keep making them fast as they can!

And what about all those fools buying them? That gun has been out for a year or two now, and thousands of folks just buying them so fast the factory can't make enough. And the wholesale distributors have them "on allocation" to spread the supply among the dealers fairly. What a bunch of fools!

But wait a minute...now that I think about it, isn't that how you measure success? Let's see. So many sales they can't supply the demand. Expanded the production, still can't supply the demand. Fools keep buying them in spite of folks here saying they are no good...

Hmmm. That kind of blurs the line a bit and makes it hard to tell who is the fools, and who is the "fool-ee's in this deal.

 

[DPris]

Willie,
Sarcasm aside, the sales volume on this particular revolver is no direct indication of its genuine usefulness.
It sells largely to people who don't understand what it can & cannot do, to those who expect it to do things it can't, and to those who think it's cool.

It's not a matter of the gun being "no good", it's a matter of it being a severe compromise, and a matter of there being many better choices for defensive use.

Don't know what prompted your "fools" rant, but your concern certainly does you... credit.

Denis

 

[Down South]

You’ll find a lot of different opinions on the Judge. I think that the Judge is over rated as a defense piece when loaded with bird shot. Loaded with 45 LC is a different story. I own a Judge but I’ve never considered it as a CCW. I have other pistols / revolvers that fill that bill. The Judge is mostly just a fun gun for me. I carry it on my tractor to shoot field rats with that scurry out from under my tractor when I’m bush hogging. I carry it on my side when I’m down in the woods on my 4-wheeler. I carry it while I’m fishing. The Judge does its job well for what I bought it for, a short range 5-shot shotgun that can be easily carried on my side.
The Judge would make a great SD piece loaded with the 45 LC.

 

[jad0110]

The Judge is a revolver. The chambers are in the cylinder, a separate piece from the barrel. Because the chambers must be long enough to accept the .410 shotgun shell, they are much too long for the .45 Colt, so there is a long, smooth freebore in each chamber -- from the mouth of the .45 case to the face of the cylinder, which leaves the bullet unguided.

By the time the .45 bullet reaches the cylinder gap, it is likely unstable and off-center.

I suppose this is the same basic reason why the average 38 caliber revolver has just a smidge more mechanical accuracy than an otherwise identical 357 Magnum revolver. Think 6" S&W Model 14 in 38 vs the Model 19 in 357. In practical terms though, I doubt most shooters would notice much if any difference.

My local dealer also can't keep The Judge in stock. They are selling 2 or 3 a week. Seems most people are loading them with birdshot, or 2 1/2" 000 buckshot (when it can be found). I myself usually only see the 3" .410 buckshot in my area. NOTE: max .410 shell size for The Judge is 2 1/2".

Anyone considering 410 shells for defense first needs to read the test done on "The Box O' Truth":

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot41.htm

I was really surprised (in a bad way) by the .410 slugs. I figured they would have had better penetration performance than they did. But the slugs only did marginally better than the 000. Basically, if I was using one for self defense, I would only use a good, factory 45 Colt hollowpoints.

 

[DPris]

And, if you were using one with .45 Colt loads, you could find a number of better choices in size, grips, handling, trigger pull, and accuracy.
Denis

 

[Pyzon]

Why not break the post #1 ice with my 2 cents on this thread ?

Nope, it's not much of a shotgun, even with 3" shotshells.

Nope, it's not a very accurate .45 Colt at 50 yards.

BUT....

When I shoot my 3" Magnum model, a smile usually occurs for a couple of reasons.

First though let me tell you why I fell victim and bought one.

80% home defense and a worry that somebody on the other side of the house is in range of anything other than a shotshell or a really tiny bullet, like a .22.

10% trail gun in areas where Copperheads hang out.

10% range gun that always gets a lot of attention, maybe it's that smile on my face ?

It really starts to perform with handloaded 3" shotshells with #2 plated shot, since you can fit about 60 +/- pellets in that skinny shell. Plated BB shot also shreds ( and I mean shreads) a 1" thick phonebook.

And you can send 5 rounds across the bedroom or down the hall in less than a couple of seconds, with a far less chance or some dirtball grabbing the barrel of my Ithaca 12 pump as I scout around in the dark.

Typically I will load 2 or 3 shotshells followed by 3 or 2 .45 Colt Gold Dots . Or all .45's, that I'm able to keep inside a 4" circle at 20 yards consistently.

Of all the guns I've read about or seen, this is the only one that can do this that I'm aware of. Here's a pic of what I'm talking about. I turned the target around to show the holes better. It's 3 yards from my bed to the door.

Thanks for all the informative threads everyone. I intend to read 'em all in due time.

Pyzon

 

[PedalBiker]

Heard someone ask about these at the gun store last week. They sales guy said they couldn't keep them in stock.

Keep in mind that they can't keep XDs , Glocks, or Kel Tecs in stock either ever since Obama was elected.

The did still have a whole bunch of revolvers and HKs and Kimbers and Sigs. The really expensive stuff isn't selling apparently.

I read the article. If I was rich I might add one to the collection, but it fits no need I have. If I were getting a .410 I'd be looking for a pump or lever action. 45LC doesn't interest me in any configuration. - Just me.

 

[CHAINGUNMASSACRE]

For the poster that said it would be a good home defense peice for the lady......true. If she can learn to use it effectively in defense, and with .410 buckshot loaded your best tactic may be the same used with a Raven MP25 or a Ruger MkII. Empty the friggin thing into the BG's face and neck/upper torso. Keep shooting at their face until the threat is neutralized. Sounds brutal, but when you're talking about betting your life on a short barreled .410, you'd better think of it as a "mousegun". Just with lots more BOOM and muzzle flash. I am a 9mm+p/.45ACP type guy, and I'm just not convinced that with a .410 OOBuck round out of a 4 in barrell you are going to achieve sufficient penetration to stop an attacker if you shoot center mass. You'll get their attention for sure..........but if you're going to load it with .45LC you have absolutely no advantage over a decent 1911. Just my thoughts on the Judge, and yes-I have been tempted to buy one just because they're sooo COOL!

 

[Redhawk1]

Shotgun Willie
Can you believe those fools over at the Taurus company? Everyone here has already told them that Judge gun is no good, and yet those fools keep making them fast as they can!

And what about all those fools buying them? That gun has been out for a year or two now, and thousands of folks just buying them so fast the factory can't make enough. And the wholesale distributors have them "on allocation" to spread the supply among the dealers fairly. What a bunch of fools!

But wait a minute...now that I think about it, isn't that how you measure success? Let's see. So many sales they can't supply the demand. Expanded the production, still can't supply the demand. Fools keep buying them in spite of folks here saying they are no good...

Hmmm. That kind of blurs the line a bit and makes it hard to tell who is the fools, and who is the "fool-ee's in this deal.

I guess I am one of them fools there Little Willie. I have tons of handguns, hunting and personal protection handguns.

I looked long and hard at the Judge, I decided to buy one, and take it out to see what it would do. Just for conversation purposes, have you ever shot one, or are you just giving your unexperienced opinion?
Back to my actual experience from shooting one.
The 45 Colts at 10 yards, were all within a 5 inch circle with 5 quick shots. Not bad on any bad guy target.

The 2.5 inch 410 buck shot 3 pellets were all in the upper body at 10 yards. 5 shots and 15 holes in the target from belly to chest. The 2.5 inch 410 slugs were all in the kill zone as well from 10 yards. With the 2.5 inch 410 with number 8 shot. All five shot fired, and the body and head were full of holes.

Is the Judge as accurate as my other defense handgun, no. Could I kill someone in my house at 10 yards with my Judge, you darn right I could. But most encounters are under that distance, more like 7 or 5 yards. And I have full confidence, I would not have a problem killing anyone that came close to me with the Judge..

My actual experience with the Judge was good. Would I trust my life with it, you bet. I would not use it for my primary carry weapon, I have much better choices in my gun safe, but in my home, the judge is just one of my options.

Now lets hear your actual experience Little Willie.

 

[PcolaDawg]

I have a Judge, and it's loaded with 000 buckshot and is a permanent fixture by my bed. I also take it in the car with me when I head to work (then I leave it in the car and CCW my 642 or Kimber Ultra Carry II).

This summer, I am looking forward to having it in a side holster while I do yardwork. I'll have the first 3 chambers filled with #6 birdshot and the last two with 000 buck. Now, when I come across a Copperhead, I can kill it instantly and not run into the house to get the shotgun in hopes that the snake will still be there when I get back. And, if I come across a mean wild dog or pig (which has happened on occasion) I can switch to 000 buck and take care of business if I have to.

Anyway, in spite of the flaws and problems mentioned in this thread, I really like the gun and it serves a couple of different purposes for me that no other single gun can.

And I have practiced with it quite a bit and I personally believe the gun will do VERY well as a snake gun and very well as a home defense gun. That 000 buckshot puts one mean hole (and sometimes 3 mean holes) in whatever I shoot at. I'm accurate with it up to 25 feet, and that's probably more distance than I will ever need it for.

So count me in as a fan of the Judge (and I am the guy that had the barrel blow off the thing the first time I fired it. Taurus fixed it quickly and well and I have enjoyed shooting it ever since).

 

[Monster Zero]

Bond Arms Derringer

For a snake gun, I'd rather have a Bond Arms .45/.410 derringer "Snakeslayer".

I think it might make a better SD piece as well with 3" .410 000 buck loads. Shoot it twice and then throw it at them.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I'd as soon have a .22 revolver with ratshot. You don't need a .410 to kill a snake, and there are better .45s out there.

 

[Redhawk1]

I'd as soon have a .22 revolver with ratshot. You don't need a .410 to kill a snake, and there are better .45s out there.

SO WHAT! What value did your post add to the topic?

We all know there are more accurate guns out there, but the Judge was never intended to be used for hunting either.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

SO WHAT! What value did your post add to the topic

A bit more than you post added.

 

[Redhawk1]

At least I gave an actual report, not a distorted view.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

At least I gave an actual report, not a distorted view.

No, I gave an actual report, not a distorted view. I have carried a .22 revolver many a mile through the woods, and killed many a snake with either ratshot or a standard ball round. I never needed a .410 shotgun to kill a snake.

When I carry a .45, I want a gun designed to shoot as well as possible -- not compromised to shoot .410 shells.

 

[Redhawk1]

That is not the design of the Judge, instead of trying to make it something it is not. It was designed as a short range personal protection gun. It can be used as a snake killer as well as a human killer.

I think you need to read my actual report I posted earlier.

I hate when people try to give to opinion of a gun they never handled or shot. Actions speak louder than words.

Have a nice day.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

Let's Break it down:

Good for.....

1. Hitting flying birds or any type of hunting with birdshot? ==> No, it's got a crappy pattern and limited range.
2. Shooting game or self-defense with .45 colt? ==> No, crappy accuracy
3. Shooting birdshot as close-up snake defense when say bowfishing or float tube fishing? ==> Yep, great for that
4. Shooting several inline 000 Buck pellets for self-defense vs. human predators? ==> Yep, great for that.
5. Shooting .410 slugs for self-defense or small-medium game? ==> Yep, great for that - accuracy is better because the slugs are obturated in the cylinders either with or without wadding.

So it DOES do some things well (3, 4, and 5), but as ArmedBear pointed out, #3 and #5 can ALSO be done by an ordinary .45 colt handgun (substituting .45 colt rounds for .410 slugs). So about the only thing it's BETTER for than a .45 colt handgun is #4 - shooting triple ot buck as a defense load, if that's your thang, particularly in the 3" version. Also as for snake defense, .410 shells are a LOT cheaper than CCI .45 colt birdshot shells (but then again how many are you gonna need for that use which probably will never happen anyway?). And the #5 use (slugs) is inferior in stopping power to an actual .45 colt loading.

So Bottom Line - they are not nearly as useful as the public seems to perceive them to be, but if use #4 is your thang, then they have a justification. Me, I have one - like it for the float tube fishing defense - we do seem to have a copious amounts of cottonmouths around here. Besides, when I get my next .45 Colt handgun, it's gonna be a $1,750 SA Freedom Arms, and ain't no way I'm risking dropping that one in the lake while float tube fishing.

So it's not bad idea, poorly executed. It's a so-so idea, executed as well as can be done, given the constraints of physics (.480 cylinders) and the law in the USA (can't be a smoothbore).

I will say that SO FAR, mine displays HORRID accuracy with .45 colt - wouldn't trust it to hit anything beyond about 5 yards. So to me, it is ONLY a shotgun. However, it will be interesting to see what .410 slugs can do out of it. Mine is 2.75", not 3.0".

 

[DAdams]

FWIW Department

The Bucket O Truth boys did some testing awhile back on da Judge, you can check it out on their website.

I'll let you find out yourself what they thought so as not to spoil the surprise.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I've shot one, Redhawk.

When I'm out and about, I'll carry a standard .22 revolver with rat shot, if I'm worried about snakes. If I want a .45, I'll carry a real .45. If I'm still worried about snakes, I'll handload a few shot rounds for that .45.

 

[Redhawk1]

I did not buy my Judge to use as my carry gun, I have a lot better choices as my CCW.

I did not buy it to shoot snakes, a good stick will kill a snake.

I did not buy the Judge to use for hunting, again I have a lot better choices for handgun hunting.

I bought it for up close and personal protection in my home, or in my tent camping. 2 legged kind.

I also bought it just because, I wanted to see what it was about.

 

[JUDGE501]

Judge-nice small arms assault weapon

I took mine out to the gun range this weekend just to blow the dust off of it. Snakes? Skunks? Possum? Raccoons? Assailants with knives or bulky semi-automatic handguns? What is everyone talking abount varments for? This thing has the ability to imobolize the best shooter, at close range, with one shot. You can't return accurate fire with 60 pellets in your upper torso and face. Then follow it up with another volley of pellets to get-em cowering, or put-em away with four rounds of 357 to end it once and for all. See my target practice.

 

[JUDGE501]

target practice

Patterns of The Judge at an inddor range.